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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: PAINT IT BLACK]
#354341
06/22/09 07:55 AM
06/22/09 07:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,139
West Tennessee
rbstroker
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,139
West Tennessee
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I am using a stock three core 22" radiator in my '65 with a 496 stroker. It does have a shroud and a five blade non clutch fan, but gets the job done. I seriously doubt that it has 600HP though. Hope that helps.
This is the land of the free
because of the brave
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: PAINT IT BLACK]
#354343
06/22/09 08:56 AM
06/22/09 08:56 AM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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If you will be making a legit 600HP, a 22" rad aint gonna make it.
Fastest 300
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Crizila]
#354344
06/22/09 10:54 AM
06/22/09 10:54 AM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 326
Davenport, IA
70shaker
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 326
Davenport, IA
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My 472 Hemi with a large cam and aluminum heads cools fine with a 2 core 22" stock type radiator. I do have the 7 blade clutch fan and fan shroud.
Ex Hemi Racer
70 Challenger Hemi 4 speed clone
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#354346
06/22/09 11:09 AM
06/22/09 11:09 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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It will be in the Houston heat, and will mainly be getting highway driving, with a good bit of light traffic street excursions. Generally hour long or less trips. I have no patience for overheating and I WILL be using aluminum heads. Car will have a hood scoop, so maybe that will help... though I will be using an A12 style air cleaner. I see that PG Classic sells the bracket to convert for $125. It WAS painted from the factory right? I wonder why it is seemingly cad plated (or zinc or whatever) on their website...? I'd really rather not modify the rad. support if possible, but with all I am doing, what's another cut or two? 
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: PAINT IT BLACK]
#354347
06/22/09 11:25 AM
06/22/09 11:25 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,844
Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,844
Kirkland, Washington
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Don't mean to stray off-topic but why do people use a horsepower estimate/value to gauge how much cooling they need?
OK, you have 600hp on tap...How often do you use it? What duration of time are you making 600hp--maybe 11 seconds tops? The rest of the time (assuming a street driven car here) the engine is producing less than 200hp doing some form of 'regular' street driving.
Cubic inches makes a lot more sense, because that relates to the amount of swept-area and piston/head surface exposed to combustion chamber heat. Bigger engines will put more total BTU's into the block/heads.
Thats said, a LOT of RB's are running around just fine on 22" rads, including mine.
A good three core brass, or an aftermarket aluminum, and a shroud, a good fan, water pump and you should be fine.
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Pacnorthcuda]
#354348
06/22/09 12:05 PM
06/22/09 12:05 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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Quote:
Don't mean to stray off-topic but why do people use a horsepower estimate/value to gauge how much cooling they need?
OK, you have 600hp on tap...How often do you use it? What duration of time are you making 600hp--maybe 11 seconds tops? The rest of the time (assuming a street driven car here) the engine is producing less than 200hp doing some form of 'regular' street driving.
Cubic inches makes a lot more sense, because that relates to the amount of swept-area and piston/head surface exposed to combustion chamber heat. Bigger engines will put more total BTU's into the block/heads.
Thats said, a LOT of RB's are running around just fine on 22" rads, including mine.
A good three core brass, or an aftermarket aluminum, and a shroud, a good fan, water pump and you should be fine.
Very good point. Wasn't thinking. I suppose I was trying to attract comments from people with similar setups on a subconcious level.
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Pacnorthcuda]
#354350
06/22/09 07:52 PM
06/22/09 07:52 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Quote:
Don't mean to stray off-topic but why do people use a horsepower estimate/value to gauge how much cooling they need?
OK, you have 600hp on tap...How often do you use it? What duration of time are you making 600hp--maybe 11 seconds tops? The rest of the time (assuming a street driven car here) the engine is producing less than 200hp doing some form of 'regular' street driving.
Cubic inches makes a lot more sense, because that relates to the amount of swept-area and piston/head surface exposed to combustion chamber heat. Bigger engines will put more total BTU's into the block/heads.
Thats said, a LOT of RB's are running around just fine on 22" rads, including mine.
A good three core brass, or an aftermarket aluminum, and a shroud, a good fan, water pump and you should be fine.
Actually, HP is a better criteria, which is why it is used more often than cubic inches. Making HP is more directly linked to heat than engine size. When you make HP, you make heat. If what has been said on this thread is true, there really is no need for 26" radiators - in any application. Factory built radiators were never designed to cool an engine at it's peek HP continuously. They also were never designed to cool a 600HP engine @ idle - where the original engine was only making 50 HP, while the 600HP engie is now making 100HP. The point is, that at any RPM the 600HP engine is going to be making more HP ( HEAT )than what the original radiator was designed to handle. IMO, your 600HP motor wont be making it with a radiator that was designed to handle a 300HP motor.
Fastest 300
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Crizila]
#354351
06/22/09 08:05 PM
06/22/09 08:05 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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Quote:
Actually, HP is a better criteria, which is why it is used more often than cubic inches. Making HP is more directly linked to heat than engine size. When you make HP, you make heat. If what has been said on this thread is true, there really is no need for 26" radiators - in any application. Factory built radiators were never designed to cool an engine at it's peek HP continuously. They also were never designed to cool a 600HP engine @ idle - where the original engine was only making 50 HP, while the 600HP engie is now making 100HP. The point is, that at any RPM the 600HP engine is going to be making more HP ( HEAT )than what the original radiator was designed to handle. IMO, your 600HP motor wont be making it with a radiator that was designed to handle a 300HP motor.
Again, I am not going to be using a radiator that was designed to handle a 300 hp motor. I am going to be using an aluminum radiator. Not stock. Now what does 4" of surface area vs. the dissipation properties of aluminum v. copper vs. the addition of cores do for my cooling results? I dunno. That's why I asked.  I'm no genius, I just figured someone had a similar setup and could steer me in the right direction.
I am running a 22" aluminum Griffin radiator in my 500 hp small block Cuda with absolutely no trouble at all right now, so it is not an open/shut case as you suggest. Another 100 cubes/100-150 hp, and sure... things might be different. I am leaning toward thinking it'd be okay... but I am open to ideas.
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: PAINT IT BLACK]
#354352
06/22/09 08:30 PM
06/22/09 08:30 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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The reason why aluminum radiators cool beter than copper is not the material. Copper is a much better conductor of heat than aluminum is. The problem with copper is that it is much weaker than aluminum, so the core tubes can not be as big- hence you need more of them. The problem with 3 -4 core radiators is that by the time the air reaches the 3rd core, heat transfer is some where around 20% - IE the 3rd core aint doin much. Aluminum radiators are usually only 2 core, but each core can be made at least 1 1/2" wide ( deep ) because aluminum is stronger - and the 2nd core is still able to transfer a lot of heat. Yes, what you have is better than stock, but 600 ponies takes a rad bigger than you are proposing - IMHO. Nothing wrong with trying it. It's not like you can't back up if it don't work.
Fastest 300
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Crizila]
#354353
06/22/09 09:35 PM
06/22/09 09:35 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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Quote:
Nothing wrong with trying it. It's not like you can't back up if it don't work.
Just $/time... 
I don't want to do this twice. That seed of doubt is eating at me a little.
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Crizila]
#354355
06/23/09 02:26 PM
06/23/09 02:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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Quote:
Quote:
Sorry if I got you in a quandary. That wasn't my intention. I was under the impression you already had the 22" rad in hand. Please don't cut up your core support based on my opinion. Maybe you should call Griffin, Becool or Fourseasons ( Mancini )and get their input. I've been where you are at. First I took my stock 26" 2 core rad and had it recored to a 3 core unit. Slight improvement. The car would run on the stat at cruise ( 50 -60 ). Anywhere else it would start to overheat. Then went to a small ( $180 ) aluminum rad. Another slight improvement, but basically the same story. Finally went with a large ( 600HP rated ) aluminum rad - problem fixed. Stays on the stat at all times. I can make round robin passes at the track and don't have overheat problems. I'm making no where near 600HP.
I called Griffin. They said being that it was a non AC car, 22" MIGHT work with 650 hp (by the way they gauge things based on 1st hp, then cubes). Then they asked me where I lived. Turns out, Houston is pretty hot. Go figure. So he said I could roll the dice, but he'd go with a 26" radiator and be done. The price is the same, its just that the bummer is I have to cut the car and spend $125 on the conversion piece.
So that's what I'll do.
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Re: Will a 22" radiator work?
[Re: Dans 68]
#354357
06/23/09 04:28 PM
06/23/09 04:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
PAINT IT BLACK
OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
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OP
Got a CHIP on my shoulder
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,647
Houston Texas
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Quote:
If you go with the 26" radiator you want to cut the opening up to look stock, or just to take full advantage of the added cooling? If the vendor does not think a 22" will suffice, then go with a 26" by all means, with a shroud, but leave the original radiator support opening intact. You will not, of course, be getting the full advantage of a 26" flow by, but the added capacity and supplemental cooling will make a difference. I have a 26" with a shroud in my original 22" opening (383 4-bbl) and it cools fine. If it does not suffice then trim the sheet metal.
Dan
 That sounds appealing. Do you have a pic of yours so I might see what it looks like? Are the mounting locations different for a 26"?
I'm not even sure where I'd have to cut... I don't have an example (or any pics) of a 26" opening here.
Anyone got some pics that would educate me? 
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