Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: moparx]
#3119438
02/06/23 10:14 PM
02/06/23 10:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,469 Omaha Ne
TJP
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I Live Here
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those "flow kooler" water pumps are the ones with the "circular" vanes about 1/4" or so high, on a cast circle base ? i always like to overdrive the pump some, but is there such a thing as being overdriven too much ? there are only so many pulleys to choose from. The thermostat serves another purpose, and that is to regulate the flow rate. Removing it will cause overheating but can help compensate for a crudded up radiator. Pushing the coolant through a good radiator too fast can also cause O/ heating as the coolant may not have enough time to exchange the heat. So I would say yes. remeber you are dealing with several variables. Flow rate, pressure driving the flow, pressure in the system, size of the radiator, air flow through the core, Ambient temps, BTU's being generated, and the the infamous core debate itself. Probably a few others as well but that's a kwik list
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: fourgearsavoy]
#3119439
02/06/23 10:16 PM
02/06/23 10:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,469 Omaha Ne
TJP
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[quote=fourgearsavoy]Things I have learned about performance engines and cooling systems are you need a lot of coolant flow and good clean airflow over the largest rad you can fit in the core support. I drive a Flowkooler pump 1-1 with the crank and an ECP 26" aluminum radiator with great results. https://speedcooling.com/product-category/radiators/mopar-radiators/page/2/Gus Can't disagree with the bolded part But myself I have seen no change with the flow kooler or other similar pumps testing under as close to laboratory conditions as I could get and measuring with thermocouples and digital meters (laboratory grade again) [/quoteI I had an issue with scale clogging my rad over and over so I installed a filter in the upper hose and I could actually see the flow difference between the factory pump and a Flowkooler pump. The filter was a good tool to catch the scale from my block. I ended up filling it 3 times now it stays clean. Gus interesting on the flow and scale
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: TJP]
#3119570
02/07/23 12:32 PM
02/07/23 12:32 PM
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Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 88 IL
83hurstguy
member
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IL
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those "flow kooler" water pumps are the ones with the "circular" vanes about 1/4" or so high, on a cast circle base ? i always like to overdrive the pump some, but is there such a thing as being overdriven too much ? there are only so many pulleys to choose from. The thermostat serves another purpose, and that is to regulate the flow rate. Removing it will cause overheating but can help compensate for a crudded up radiator. Pushing the coolant through a good radiator too fast can also cause O/ heating as the coolant may not have enough time to exchange the heat. So I would say yes. remeber you are dealing with several variables. Flow rate, pressure driving the flow, pressure in the system, size of the radiator, air flow through the core, Ambient temps, BTU's being generated, and the the infamous core debate itself. Probably a few others as well but that's a kwik list The "coolant too fast" theory has been debunked dozens of times. Increased flow rate leads to turbulence, and turbulence within a pipe/tube encourages mixing (better contact with the walls to remove heat) and enhances heat transfer performance all the way to the point of physical tube erosion from the fluid velocity being too fast for the material. There have been some potential claimed issues with pumps cavitating, but that has nothing to do with coolant moving too fast in the radiator.
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: 83hurstguy]
#3119761
02/07/23 09:29 PM
02/07/23 09:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,469 Omaha Ne
TJP
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Omaha Ne
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those "flow kooler" water pumps are the ones with the "circular" vanes about 1/4" or so high, on a cast circle base ? i always like to overdrive the pump some, but is there such a thing as being overdriven too much ? there are only so many pulleys to choose from. The thermostat serves another purpose, and that is to regulate the flow rate. Removing it will cause overheating but can help compensate for a crudded up radiator. Pushing the coolant through a good radiator too fast can also cause O/ heating as the coolant may not have enough time to exchange the heat. So I would say yes. remeber you are dealing with several variables. Flow rate, pressure driving the flow, pressure in the system, size of the radiator, air flow through the core, Ambient temps, BTU's being generated, and the the infamous core debate itself. Probably a few others as well but that's a kwik list The "coolant too fast" theory has been debunked dozens of times. Increased flow rate leads to turbulence, and turbulence within a pipe/tube encourages mixing (better contact with the walls to remove heat) and enhances heat transfer performance all the way to the point of physical tube erosion from the fluid velocity being too fast for the material. There have been some potential claimed issues with pumps cavitating, but that has nothing to do with coolant moving too fast in the radiator. OK 💨
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: moparx]
#3119891
02/08/23 10:47 AM
02/08/23 10:47 AM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,555 Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy
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still wondering about those flow cooler pumps, are they the ones with the "circular" vanes about 1/4" tall on a cast round base ? This is the one I use
64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: fourgearsavoy]
#3119980
02/08/23 02:48 PM
02/08/23 02:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,548 north of coder
moparx
"Butt Crack Bob"
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"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
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north of coder
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still wondering about those flow cooler pumps, are they the ones with the "circular" vanes about 1/4" tall on a cast round base ? This is the one I use thanks. the one i'm thinking about might be the milodon pump. [i have not used the google to look, so i guess i need to]
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: moparx]
#3120028
02/08/23 05:04 PM
02/08/23 05:04 PM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,555 Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy
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I bought a Milodon HV water pump at Summit and opened it up at the counter and there was a GMB pump in the box Gave it back and they brought me the FlowKooler pump Gus
64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: TJP]
#3120116
02/08/23 10:55 PM
02/08/23 10:55 PM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 960 Chicago
PurpleBeeper
super stock
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super stock
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Posts: 960
Chicago
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Chrysler made millions of cars back then that didn't have any trouble with cooling. Do you have a factory 7 blade fan and the correct water pump and is it a factory shroud? What is the engine tune like? Glen Ray uses cooling tubes which are similar to what big truck use, that is one reason they cost more. Bob is the best in the business. AGREED 100%, So what's the difference? The efficiency of the majority of today's replacement cores. They are not ALL created equal as the bean counters and "improved" manufacturing processes over the years have slowly degraded the efficiency in the chase of profit. While discussing 1-2-3-4 rows there are several other variables, IE: tube thickness. the number of fins per inch, the thickness of those fins, louvered fins, staggering the rows, the methods used to manufacture the cores. All of these and a few more affect the efficiency. This is a completely accurate and more detailed response than mine... there is more than just adding the inches....like dimpled tubes and these things mentioned. Somebody else mentioned air flow, which is also important. You need coolant flow and air flow to cool the engine
70 Roadrunner convt. street car
440+6, NOS, 4-spd, SS springs
'96 Mustang GT convt. street car
'04 4.6 SOHC, NOS, auto, lowered
"Officer, that button is for short on-ramps"
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: TJP]
#3120381
02/10/23 12:17 AM
02/10/23 12:17 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,526 N.E. OHIO, USA
A12
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
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Posts: 21,526
N.E. OHIO, USA
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[size:11pt][/size] Well this will not be the first time, and absolutely not the last, that I over think something. About half of the cars we run around with, can go for hour and a half to two hour cruises to a show, but won't last 20 minutes in a parade. That sir is not a radiator problem, but rather a lack of air flow through the radiator . A bigger radiator may help a bit, but the root cause is LACK of sufficient air flow, Again
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: A12]
#3120478
02/10/23 03:23 PM
02/10/23 03:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442 NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
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Somewhat related to this overall subject, when using an electric fan (puller, 1 or 2 fans), some fan shrouds are solid, while others have small venting slots or flappers around the otherwise solid shroud areas. I'm considering to get an electric fan (1 or 2), that would have a fan shroud. Any preference/suggestion on the design of the shroud? This would be for my aluminum triple-flow US Radiator, 22" wide (fitting my core opening)... runs hot while road racing/autocrossing, but cool in regular street or hwy driving. I've tried different thermostats... no difference when racing.
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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Re: Radiator cooling efficiency
[Re: Mopar Mitch]
#3120582
02/10/23 10:17 PM
02/10/23 10:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,469 Omaha Ne
TJP
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,469
Omaha Ne
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Somewhat related to this overall subject, when using an electric fan (puller, 1 or 2 fans), some fan shrouds are solid, while others have small venting slots or flappers around the otherwise solid shroud areas. I'm considering to get an electric fan (1 or 2), that would have a fan shroud. Any preference/suggestion on the design of the shroud? This would be for my aluminum triple-flow US Radiator, 22" wide (fitting my core opening)... runs hot while road racing/autocrossing, but cool in regular street or hwy driving. I've tried different thermostats... no difference when racing. IMO, You have either an inefficient core for the BTU's being generated or an air flow issue. My bet is on the 1st .
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