Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Dragula]
#3115755
01/23/23 05:17 PM
01/23/23 05:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,022 Tulsa OK
Bad340fish
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master
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Posts: 8,022
Tulsa OK
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You saw his teardown of the Cleetus Mullet engine I am sure. That thing had lots of passes on it, ran up to 50PSI of boost, and did at least 2 drag and drive events. Steve even said it was pushed harder than it was intended. In my world brooming the rods into the trash and replacing them once a season doesn't count as streetable to me, but plenty seem to do it.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3115782
01/23/23 07:27 PM
01/23/23 07:27 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,386 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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My next build, I will price them vs. the standard stuff and see.....I do not put enough street miles on to kill anything every season. I was always told neither were streetable, but with the huge weight of a SS 2.40" intake valve, it might really take the strain off my valve-train and keep the springs cooler and need less pressure to run. I bought a reduced ramp street stripe cam where they said all I need is #180 of spring pressure. I am just looking at what makes sense and helps. And I think Titanium intakes might be my ticket to making things last and rpm like a small block. The oil squirters should also allow the springs to live longer too. The rods are probably a stretch as I run the Hemi like a bracket car, leave at 2k and shift around 6200.....I do not think these would be any kind of an advantage for me.... I also want to do Drag Week one of these days, and I need this thing to last.... You saw his teardown of the Cleetus Mullet engine I am sure. That thing had lots of passes on it, ran up to 50PSI of boost, and did at least 2 drag and drive events. Steve even said it was pushed harder than it was intended. In my world brooming the rods into the trash and replacing them once a season doesn't count as streetable to me, but plenty seem to do it. Yeah, its Steve's fault..... Cleetus pushed the small block to the breaking point....What did he think they would do to a BB? What' is so beautiful is how well they did with it..They conquered everything with it. As they learned how to tune it an run fast, they were able to turn it up time and time again....To the point, I think they made about 1000hp more than Steve had planned on...I think this combo is supposed to be around 2000hp and live well...And went to #57 on the boost and pushed it to 3000hp level with a CAST block....
Last edited by Dragula; 01/23/23 07:38 PM.
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Neil]
#3115819
01/23/23 09:41 PM
01/23/23 09:41 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,645 Stuttgart, Arkansas
rickseeman
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,645
Stuttgart, Arkansas
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I think now-a-days people tell you that you can run ti valves on the street with DLC coating. Ti is sexy but I don't turn that many RPM's. I've always thought you could run alum rods on the street, just don't tell anybody or you're gonna have to listen to all their smack.
2011 Drag Pak Challenger
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Dragula]
#3115825
01/23/23 10:09 PM
01/23/23 10:09 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,023 Oregon
AndyF
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,023
Oregon
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Chevy LS7 uses titanium valves and titanium connecting rods. That is the engine used in factory corvettes and camaros with factory warranty
Last edited by AndyF; 01/23/23 11:43 PM.
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: rickseeman]
#3115830
01/23/23 10:16 PM
01/23/23 10:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,996 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
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I think now-a-days people tell you that you can run ti valves on the street with DLC coating. Ti is sexy but I don't turn that many RPM's. I've always thought you could run alum rods on the street, just don't tell anybody or you're gonna have to listen to all their smack. It is all about stress cycles, and whether those cycles are close to a certain limit. Some lawnmower engines have had aluminum rods. They live a very long life, due to very low stress. An example of a very low stress situation was i had a set of BME396 forgings made with 2.1 rod bearings, 7.1 inch long, .990 pin end. I built a 4.35. bore rb motor with a stock 440 crank offset ground to 4.00 stroke. Peak rpm was never over 6400, cubes 475. It lived a very long life, after i raced it for rwo years at about 600 hp and sold it i ran into the buyer years later, and he was spraying it. And it was still together.
Last edited by gregsdart; 01/23/23 10:18 PM.
8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: gregsdart]
#3115843
01/23/23 11:08 PM
01/23/23 11:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,566 Motor City
6PKRTSE
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master
Joined: Jan 2004
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Motor City
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Plenty of people do it. No, they are not daily drivers but for a weekend cruiser and street strip car thay are fine. No, I don't do it personally. Not in my budget.
1963 Belvedere 440 Max Wedge Tribute 1970 Charger R/T S.E. 440 Six Pack 1970 Challenger R/T, 528 Hemi 1970 Charger 500 S.E. 440 4 BBL 1970 Plymouth Road Runner 383 1974 Chrysler New Yorker 440 1996 2500 RAM 488 V-10 4X4 2004 3500 Dually Cummins 4x4 2012 Challenger R/T Classic.
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: B1MAXX]
#3115933
01/24/23 09:27 AM
01/24/23 09:27 AM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,386 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,386
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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The trouble with titanium valves is the gumminess of the material. It likes to gald (friction weld) very easily. The problem is with the seats, sticking pieces of valve to the seat. That's were the beryllium/copper comes in.
It would be very interesting to see how GM dealt with this. I can tell you from working there, they had copper berlinium seats in most heads...
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Dragula]
#3115937
01/24/23 09:41 AM
01/24/23 09:41 AM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 39 West Central Indiana
PROSTOCKTOM
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member
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West Central Indiana
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If you want to run to run aluminum rods it's important to make sure the oil temperature is up to 160 degrees before you start driving the engine. I let my engine run about 10 minutes before I ever drive it with the aluminum rods.
As far as titanium valves unless you have a huge diameter valve and are subjecting it to high rpms you'll be a lot better off just using a 1-piece stainless steel valve.All the trick stuff sounds great, but there are trade-offs to using those items.
Following the KISS Method (Keep It Simple Stupid) reduces a lot of stress on the mind and wallet.
Tom
Molnar Technologies Full Service Dealer - Crankshafts & Connecting Rods
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Dragula]
#3115942
01/24/23 09:55 AM
01/24/23 09:55 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,022 Tulsa OK
Bad340fish
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Posts: 8,022
Tulsa OK
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Yeah, its Steve's fault.....
Cleetus pushed the small block to the breaking point....What did he think they would do to a BB? What' is so beautiful is how well they did with it..They conquered everything with it. As they learned how to tune it an run fast, they were able to turn it up time and time again....To the point, I think they made about 1000hp more than Steve had planned on...I think this combo is supposed to be around 2000hp and live well...And went to #57 on the boost and pushed it to 3000hp level with a CAST block....
Once he brought Pete Harrell in to tune the car is when it really picked up, he knew how to make the power safely and how to put it down. If you watch Pete's YouTube channel(Real Good at Doin Stuff) he dives into some of the changes he made. Since Pete does his own engines he kind of took a little shot at Steve when he commented that Garrett gave him a 50lb ceiling on the boost originally and he didn't know what that was all about lol. I know alot of the guys here probably can't stomach the Cleetus McFarland stuff but when he goes racing it can be pretty interesting.
Last edited by Bad340fish; 01/24/23 09:59 AM.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: B1MAXX]
#3115950
01/24/23 10:24 AM
01/24/23 10:24 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,608 Indiana
EV2DEMON
The Camaro Kid
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The Camaro Kid
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,608
Indiana
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OK I see how they did it. Its not in any production engines, and only in their 570 crate engine that isn't street legal. Both the LS7 and LS9 production engines used Titanium valves
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Re: Aluminum Rods & Titanium Valves on the street?
[Re: Bad340fish]
#3115954
01/24/23 10:33 AM
01/24/23 10:33 AM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,672 Wichita
GY3
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Posts: 4,672
Wichita
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Yeah, its Steve's fault.....
Cleetus pushed the small block to the breaking point....What did he think they would do to a BB? What' is so beautiful is how well they did with it..They conquered everything with it. As they learned how to tune it an run fast, they were able to turn it up time and time again....To the point, I think they made about 1000hp more than Steve had planned on...I think this combo is supposed to be around 2000hp and live well...And went to #57 on the boost and pushed it to 3000hp level with a CAST block....
Once he brought Pete Harrell in to tune the car is when it really picked up, he knew how to make the power safely and how to put it down. If you watch Pete's YouTube channel(Real Good at Doin Stuff) he dives into some of the changes he made. Since Pete does his own engines he kind of took a little shot at Steve when he commented that Garrett gave him a 50lb ceiling on the boost originally and he didn't know what that was all about lol. I know alot of the guys here probably can't stomach the Cleetus McFarland stuff but when he goes racing it can be pretty interesting. The last thing any engine builder wants is to see is his engine blown up in front of all the Youtube viewership! Cleeter and Texas Speed went through that over the last few years when they were pushing the LS platform well beyond what was reasonable and people started bagging on Texas Speed. Cleet makes sure and tell everyone now that it's not a build or a parts issue, it's just a part of racing when you push stuff hard and have a failure. I'd imagine Steve puts very safe "limits" on his stuff with customers to avoid negative publicity about his product! Steve has said recently that he still can't believe how good that engine looked inside when he got it back! LOL!
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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