Building a smogger 440
#3040017
05/05/22 05:18 PM
05/05/22 05:18 PM
|
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 10 Woodstock, Ontario, Canada
General Lee
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 10
Woodstock, Ontario, Canada
|
Hey y'all
This is my first post. Have snooped around here just reading around, seems like a good place for my stupid questions lol. So im building a motor. Ill throw all the info i can think of in here first. I was thinking of a 9+ compression motor. Its a 77 440-8 block, will be bored 30 over. Its for in a 1991 d150 longbox. 3.55 suregrip. 727 auto. It has to run on pump gas, and be a very fun truck. No drag truck, will see the strip a few times a year just for the fun of it. Looking for low end power and torque mostly. So ive done a lot of thinking and research,and here what im thinking. Summit 6400 cam Holley 750 carb Stock cast crank and rods Stock 452 heads (hardened seats for pump gas) Double roller timing chain Melling oil pump Stock torque converter Fully rebuilt 9.25, 3.55s solid spacer Eddy performer intake (or my stock one but you guys will probably change my mind on that) Cant think of anything else right now. So my question, what pistons do i get with that and will the setup im thinking work together nicely for a fun fast daily (not really daily bu you get the point) driver. Thanks a ton, and please dont confuse me with 100 thousand different ideas lol but thanks for all input in advance
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: General Lee]
#3040021
05/05/22 05:35 PM
05/05/22 05:35 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 12,237 Looking for a way out of Middl...
IMGTX
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 12,237
Looking for a way out of Middl...
|
Hypereutectic pistons are a good choice for cost and durability. I would suggest a decent brand like speed pro but others will have good advice. I am not sure you are going to get a 9+ compression to run on regular. Around here the regular gas is pretty crappy. Mid grade possibly. Premium yes. A 440 is a torque monster but the internals are slow to accelerate. Take advantage of that, a Lower rear gear and an overdrive will let it rev faster and still end up the same cruising RPM. My Others will have good advice too.
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: General Lee]
#3040052
05/05/22 06:54 PM
05/05/22 06:54 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,230 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
|
I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,230
Bend,OR USA
|
The Eddy RPM intake is a very good one, Way better than the stock cast iron AVS or Thermoguad intakes are What is the list number on your carb?
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: General Lee]
#3040070
05/05/22 07:50 PM
05/05/22 07:50 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061 Atlanta, GA
mgoblue9798
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
|
My two cents.
One, does your engine need an overbore? If not then just run the low comp pistons you have. It is tough to run a 9 to 1 440 with open chamber heads and no quench on anything but 93 or higher octane.
With the summit cam you chose, I would just run the stock intake. No reason to spend money on a performer or perf rpm with your combo in a truck that likely will not see north of 5500 rpm.
Now about that cam. If you follow the above and are not spending a bunch on pistons, overbore, and intake, spend a little extra and get a modern cam designed specifically for your combo. It will cost a little more, but will make the biggest bang for the buck. Mike Jones would be a good guy to talk to about the cam selection.
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: Uberpube]
#3040102
05/05/22 09:20 PM
05/05/22 09:20 PM
|
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290 nowhere
Sniper
master
|
master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290
nowhere
|
it would pull vacuum at wot throttle with the edelbrock. At what RPM?
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: Sniper]
#3040121
05/05/22 10:07 PM
05/05/22 10:07 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,525 God's Country Maryland
GODSCOUNTRY340
master
|
master
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,525
God's Country Maryland
|
I can't remember who did this dyno test but they got 449 horsepower out of a smogger engine without replacing pistons. Here's how they did it.
I love the smell of Deer guts in the morning, it smells like... VICTORY!
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: Dodge]
#3040179
05/06/22 04:10 AM
05/06/22 04:10 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,220 Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,220
Someplace you aren't
|
What shape is the short block now? I agree it may not be the best bang for the buck to change pistons.
No way I’d run under a 750 carb on a 440. I won’t run less than that on a 383 either. Run a small carb back to back on either engine and then tell me which one you’d use. Once you feel the power you won’t run a small carb again.
A performer rpm is the best intake I’ve found for a street effort and it did great on smogger low comp 440s I had.
I agree the factory 375 hp cam is likely on target or is at least the outer limit on a truck build.
I want my fair share
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: SomeCarGuy]
#3040190
05/06/22 07:21 AM
05/06/22 07:21 AM
|
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290 nowhere
Sniper
master
|
master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290
nowhere
|
What shape is the short block now? I agree it may not be the best bang for the buck to change pistons.
No way I’d run under a 750 carb on a 440. I won’t run less than that on a 383 either. Run a small carb back to back on either engine and then tell me which one you’d use. Once you feel the power you won’t run a small carb again.
A performer rpm is the best intake I’ve found for a street effort and it did great on smogger low comp 440s I had.
I agree the factory 375 hp cam is likely on target or is at least the outer limit on a truck build. The OP says he wants low end power and torque. You drag racers need to keep that in mind. Soon as you bring up a 509 cam you've far exceeded what the OP wanted. When I swapped a 360 into my M body I ran it with a 650 carb and a 750 carb. The 650 got better mileage, low end and throttle response with less top end speed, maybe 110 mph max. The 750 had better top end speed, with worse mileage and low end. Since I don't need to go past the 125 mph mark on my speedo in a street car guess which carb was the right choice?
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: Sniper]
#3040195
05/06/22 07:46 AM
05/06/22 07:46 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,832 Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
Too Many Posts
|
Too Many Posts
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,832
Kirkland, Washington
|
What shape is the short block now? I agree it may not be the best bang for the buck to change pistons.
No way I’d run under a 750 carb on a 440. I won’t run less than that on a 383 either. Run a small carb back to back on either engine and then tell me which one you’d use. Once you feel the power you won’t run a small carb again.
A performer rpm is the best intake I’ve found for a street effort and it did great on smogger low comp 440s I had.
I agree the factory 375 hp cam is likely on target or is at least the outer limit on a truck build. The OP says he wants low end power and torque. You drag racers need to keep that in mind. Soon as you bring up a 509 cam you've far exceeded what the OP wanted. When I swapped a 360 into my M body I ran it with a 650 carb and a 750 carb. The 650 got better mileage, low end and throttle response with less top end speed, maybe 110 mph max. The 750 had better top end speed, with worse mileage and low end. Since I don't need to go past the 125 mph mark on my speedo in a street car guess which carb was the right choice? A Holley 750 VS is a great choice for what the OP is targeting. Who brought up the 509 cam? I didn’t see that???
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: Pacnorthcuda]
#3040200
05/06/22 08:04 AM
05/06/22 08:04 AM
|
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290 nowhere
Sniper
master
|
master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290
nowhere
|
A Holley 750 VS is a great choice for what the OP is targeting. Who brought up the 509 cam? I didn’t see that???
Six posts above you by GodsCountry340
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: General Lee]
#3040212
05/06/22 08:28 AM
05/06/22 08:28 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,062 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
|
I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,062
U.S.S.A.
|
Hey everyone, thanks for all the help in such a short time. All my borew are perfect, not even a ridge to catch your fingernail behind, but only one has pitting. And 2 of my stock pistons are junk so i figured rebore and nice new high comp forged pistons. Im not really on a tigh budget but not going with aluminum heads right now. Can always do different heads later. Can probably get my hands on 915 or 516s, but 452 seem to do the job for many people and thats what i got now. Havent bought the 750 holley yet, but there is one for sale near me brandnew with 12 kms on it. Was overkill for his chevy 383. And cheap. By the time you have the 452's rebuilt you are most of the way to a budget set of alum heads. Stock big block mopar heads suck plain and simple. They don't flow very well, even ported and the chambers are huge on the open chamber heads. Since you aren't budget limited , to a degree, if you insist on a forged piston get something lightweight ... like a Diamond or Ross, you might be able to internal balance it which would be a plus.
running up my post count some more .
|
|
|
Re: Building a smogger 440
[Re: JohnRR]
#3040228
05/06/22 08:59 AM
05/06/22 08:59 AM
|
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 10 Woodstock, Ontario, Canada
General Lee
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 10
Woodstock, Ontario, Canada
|
I know they arent the best. But do i need more at the moment? Im not getting them rebuilt, just some new sprinfs and a valve job. I can always slap aluminum ones on in a year or 2 if i get tired of this setup. Dont wanna go to crazy either on a daily driver. And pump gas is a must for now, for 2 reasons. 1: Trudeaus awesome gas prices make it inefficient to run 91 octane on a daily driver, and the 440s gas mileage will already suck 2: we happen to have a gas tank here on the farm at home for the company trucks and thats obviously 87. Ya know, "ive never considered myself a thief, but the old man wouldnt miss just one little liter"😆😆😆 And for pistons, i wanna do the bottom end right in one shot, i can always screw with the top end later if i feel i need more. But not the bottom end.
|
|
|
|
|