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Engle cams
#291354
04/17/09 09:12 PM
04/17/09 09:12 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
momopar
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
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I see a member is peddlin' Engle cams here in the engine parts for sale section. They have a .590 upgrade , with springs for a good price. I see a lot of good comments on the old purple shaft. But many here think there are "better cams out there". Is this one of the "better cams"? It looks to me like it could be just a tad tamer than the .590. Help me with some comments, I need to pick a cam to finish my build.
440 .030
TRW 2295 .030 in the hole
Hogged 906s 80 cc
iron Crane 1.6 rockers
e85 850 D.P. on an M1
3600 lb. B body 4.56/ 3200 stall.
I get 12.4:1 so she should like the corn squeezin's
Last edited by momopar; 04/17/09 09:31 PM.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#291358
04/18/09 10:28 AM
04/18/09 10:28 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,275
Kissimmee, Florida
aarlucas
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,275
Kissimmee, Florida
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Quote:
Quote:
I get 12.4:1 so she should like the corn squeezin's
No possiable way that thing is 12:1. Its probably closer to 10:1 than 12:1 
With that compression, converter, its going to be real lazy down low, and probably never recover up top.
You're right, I figure 9.79-1 based on this info.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: aarlucas]
#291359
04/18/09 04:17 PM
04/18/09 04:17 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
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I bought an Engle solid cam from Jeff Patterson a few months ago. Don't have the motor running yet, but I can tell you that Jeff was a lot of help and very good to deal with. He took the time to talk through my build and application, made a reccomendation on a straight pattern cam. I took his advice and had the cam in less than a couple weeks.
The only thing I was unsure about was that Engle doesn't stock AMC style oil through lifters, which I thought I wanted. Jeff got in touch with Engle again for me, and asked some questions. They said they're really not needed for mopar big blocks, and made the point that you'll have better lower-end oil pressure without allowing oil through the pushrods. Makes sense.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#291360
04/18/09 04:45 PM
04/18/09 04:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
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I bought an Engle cam thru Jeff about a month ago..engine is not running yet either.
i needed the amc style lifters due to use of eddy magnum heads, engle does not have them...I bought a set from comp.
Tony
70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: aarlucas]
#291361
04/18/09 06:35 PM
04/18/09 06:35 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
momopar
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I get 12.4:1 so she should like the corn squeezin's
No possiable way that thing is 12:1. Its probably closer to 10:1 than 12:1
With that compression, converter, its going to be real lazy down low, and probably never recover up top.
You're right, I figure 9.79-1 based on this info.
You guys may be way smarter than me, or not,
I used the Wallace racing compression ratio calculator.
Bore 4.350
Stroke 3.75
Head cc 80 cc
Dome -12.1
Gasket .020
Piston in the hole .030
Compression ratio 12.41:1 I'm sure this calculator is not the end all of calculators. But I would really doubt it is off 25%.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: momopar]
#291362
04/18/09 06:43 PM
04/18/09 06:43 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 434
Hartford, MI
MoparSprinter360
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 434
Hartford, MI
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You need to calculate dome as a positive number if the piston is flat or dished.
Injected Mopar 360 Winged Dirt Sprint Car
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: MoparSprinter360]
#291363
04/18/09 06:52 PM
04/18/09 06:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
momopar
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
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Quote:
You need to calculate dome as a positive number if the piston is flat or dished.
I guess you guys don't remember the old TRW forged dome pistons. Yes not everyone runs flat tops. These are heavy,(a little lighter than the factory late 60s slugs. But they are built like a M1 tank! Besides I think piston slap in the morning sounds like..............VICTORY!
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: momopar]
#291364
04/18/09 08:15 PM
04/18/09 08:15 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
momopar
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 407
NE Indiana
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Back to my original post. Is the Engle.590 upgrade more or less aggressive than the Mopar .590? I have read that a solid would need to be 10* more duration than a hydraulic. I used to have a 284/484 and only 10.3:1 compression. That cam was plenty docile, so 242 @.050 hydraulic = 252@.050 solid. The Engle is .266 @ .050. I know I could use more convertor. Perhaps I will get a custom split around 256/260 @ 50.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: momopar]
#291365
04/18/09 08:24 PM
04/18/09 08:24 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,315
MOPAR HEADQUARTERS IN ALDEN NY
hemigod426
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MOPAR HEADQUARTERS IN ALDEN NY
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engle cams ground all the fast rate cams for hughes cams before and might still. jeff is helping me spec out a solid flat cam for one of my street hemis now. yes there cams are good 
Last edited by hemigod426; 04/18/09 08:25 PM.
MOPAR OR NO CAR
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: momopar]
#291366
04/18/09 09:03 PM
04/18/09 09:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Quote:
Back to my original post.
Is the Engle.590 upgrade more or less aggressive than the Mopar .590? I have read that a solid would need to be 10* more duration than a hydraulic. I used to have a 284/484 and only 10.3:1 compression. That cam was plenty docile, so 242 @.050 hydraulic = [Email]252@.050[/Email] solid. The Engle is .266 @ .050. I know I could use more convertor. Perhaps I will get a custom split around 256/260 @ 50.
The engle cam will be more aggesive but it wont outperform the MP .590 BUT!!, It will be more street friendly at the lower RPM,s.
The MP .590 I measured is 272*@ .050 and 179*@ .200
VS The Engle 266@ .050 and 178*@ .200 At .200 the Engle has 178*, 1* less duration but at max lift has .012 more lift. .602 vs .590
IMO the performance gain will be a wash , but it will have nicer street manors.
In comparison a SQ Comp grind can have a 271*@ .050 and a 185*@ .200 duration with over .600+ lift. Now That would be a Improvement in performance over the MP .590. BUT!!, With No improvement with street manors.
Its all in what your looking for. 
Also With your 12cc dome , yep your around 12.4 or so +/- in Comp. mike
Last edited by Sport440; 04/18/09 09:08 PM.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: lewtot184]
#291368
04/18/09 09:24 PM
04/18/09 09:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Quote:
you need to find out what the grind number is. i run engles and have their blue sheet with the grind numbers listed with lobe profiles. the blue sheet shows a bunch of cams in the .590 range. there's no way to make a comparison without the grind number.
The Cam I am referring to is the one that is listed as the MP .590, Engle upgrade in the Engines for sale section that the poster was asking about.
It can be considerd a Upgrade over the MP .590 as you wouldnt lose any performance and it would be more street friendly.IMO mike
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: Sport440]
#291369
04/18/09 09:35 PM
04/18/09 09:35 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,698
NE Oklahoma
Von
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,698
NE Oklahoma
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Nevermind!! I misread.
Last edited by Von; 04/18/09 09:36 PM.
72 RR, Pump gas 440, 452s, 3800 lbs, Corked, ET Radials,. 11.33@117.72.
Same car, bone stock 346s, 9.5 comp, baby solid. 12.24@110.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: momopar]
#291371
04/18/09 10:25 PM
04/18/09 10:25 PM
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,916
usa
lewtot184
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master
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Posts: 3,916
usa
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i found the grind, kv5. a lot of cam for a 3.23 gear. i use a k65, 238@.050, .510 lift, in a 440 with a 3.23 gear. it's plenty of cam for me but i'm pretty conservative on cam profiles. if your going to drive much i'd probaly try a k7, or ep-52. actually, an old mopar 296-.557 would be hard to beat. it would be nice if you had some flow numbers on the heads to make a more intelligent decision.
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: lewtot184]
#291372
04/19/09 10:00 AM
04/19/09 10:00 AM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,093
oberlin, Ohio
Rapid340
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Posts: 2,093
oberlin, Ohio
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Quote:
The engle cam will be more aggesive but it wont outperform the MP .590 BUT!!, It will be more street friendly at the lower RPM,s.
The MP .590 I measured is 272*@ .050 and 179*@ .200
VS The Engle 266@ .050 and 178*@ .200 At .200 the Engle has 178*, 1* less duration but at max lift has .012 more lift. .602 vs .590
IMO the performance gain will be a wash , but it will have nicer street manors.
In comparison a SQ Comp grind can have a 271*@ .050 and a 185*@ .200 duration with over .600+ lift. Now That would be a Improvement in performance over the MP .590. BUT!!, With No improvement with street manors.
Its all in what your looking for.
Also With your 12cc dome , yep your around 12.4 or so +/- in Comp. mike
Edited by Sport440 (Sat Apr 18 2009 09:08 PM)
Sport440 you are on the right track but you forgot to factor in the difference in lash. The MP cams have 10-12 thousanths more lash so the duration and the lift at the valve will be reduced (effective duration at 50 about 4 degrees less).
One nice feature with the Engle solid lobes is the lack of a slow ramp leading up to the lobe. Virtually none there. On the cam doctor it looks almost like a hydraulic lobe. The MP lobes (and many others) have extremely long slow linear ramps leading to the valvtrain contact point of the lobe. What this means is you can tighten the lash on the engle cam with no severe penalty in seat duration. I have run them 8 thousanths tighter adding about 4 degrees of duration.
The vast majority of cams I sell are custom but I did make an effort to match the effective seat timing of the "upgrade" cams the same or less than the MP cams.
The improvement in area under the curve over MP cams is more dramatic with the hydraulic grinds.
1971 Factory Appearing Duster 340 11.000 @ 122 mph
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Re: Engle cams
[Re: Rapid340]
#291373
04/19/09 06:00 PM
04/19/09 06:00 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675
Columbia, CT
moper
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675
Columbia, CT
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I've used Engle for a custom grind. I called and had Mark send me the lobe catalog they have. I spec'd my own so no need for a dealer. They have fast rate, but they have a bunch of choices for the ramp speed. There is a thing as too fast for a street car. For me, that means manners and sane idle and street spring pressures. I found the cam to be dead nuts on what I wanted, delivered on time (in a week IIRC), and with lifters was less money than the Comp shelf grinds for the cam alone (on the order of $220 plus shipping teo years ago). I was a fan of Crane, but I believe I will be using Engle much more moving forward. Great product, great service, great people.
Well, art is art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water! And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does. Now, uh... Now you tell me what you know.
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