Turn Signal Trouble
#2705093
10/09/19 09:58 AM
10/09/19 09:58 AM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,149 NW New Jersey
RSI700VIPER
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My 71 Challenger turn signals were acting up over the summer. The left one would work fine but the right one would work intermittently. Slow, then fast then not at all. Last week, both signals cut out so I figured it was a fuse or the flasher. Replaced them both but the blinkers still refused to work. All other lights including parking lights work fine. Anyone have any ideas what the problem might be? .
Last edited by RSI700VIPER; 10/09/19 09:58 AM.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2705130
10/09/19 11:17 AM
10/09/19 11:17 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Circle Track
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seperate the steering column pull apart connector & ohm the turn signal harness with the stalk in neutral/up/down ( www.mymopar.com will have the colors). confirm each light is grounded well. clean all (turn signal related) connections/terminals. Sorry nothing definite, probably just have to dig & clean till it clears up
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RapidRobert]
#2705135
10/09/19 11:26 AM
10/09/19 11:26 AM
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Posts: 1,149 NW New Jersey
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seperate the steering column pull apart connector & ohm the turn signal harness with the stalk in neutral/up/down ( www.mymopar.com will have the colors). confirm each light is grounded well. clean all (turn signal related) connections/terminals. Sorry nothing definite, probably just have to dig & clean till it clears up Robert - Not sure what you mean by "ohm the turn signal harness." Am I checking for open or closed circuit? My guess is neutral stalk - open, up/down closed?
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2705143
10/09/19 11:35 AM
10/09/19 11:35 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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with the stalk in neutral there should be continuity between the white "in" wire which comes from the brake light switch to the 2 "out" wires to the dr/pass brake lights (which are the same filaments in the 1157 bulbs as the TS filaments). this is when you hit the brake (& stalk in neutral) the 2 rear brake light circuits light up). with the stalk up or down one of those out circuits is redirected by the TS harness to the flasher which ain't telling you much as I am rusty on diagnosing further on that. might be a loose connection in the TS switch harness & it'd be good to confirm/elim that area as a start
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: stumpy]
#2705198
10/09/19 02:23 PM
10/09/19 02:23 PM
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Posts: 1,149 NW New Jersey
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Are you sure you replaced the correct flasher of the two? One for turn and one for emergency lights. I didn't know thee were 2 flashers. The one I replaced was under the steering column by the fuse box. Where is the other one?
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: stumpy]
#2705285
10/09/19 08:14 PM
10/09/19 08:14 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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the one side was out even when the flasher was flashing "normal" so there is poor continuity somewhere (including ground path potential)
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RapidRobert]
#2707284
10/16/19 02:06 PM
10/16/19 02:06 PM
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with the stalk in neutral there should be continuity between the white "in" wire which comes from the brake light switch to the 2 "out" wires to the dr/pass brake lights (which are the same filaments in the 1157 bulbs as the TS filaments). this is when you hit the brake (& stalk in neutral) the 2 rear brake light circuits light up). with the stalk up or down one of those out circuits is redirected by the TS harness to the flasher which ain't telling you much as I am rusty on diagnosing further on that. might be a loose connection in the TS switch harness & it'd be good to confirm/elim that area as a start Robert, You gave me some good info to work off of. I changed both flashers and still no blinkers. I checked continuity between the white "in" wire which comes from the brake light switch to the 2 "out" wires to the dr/pass brake lights (which are green and brown) and the circuit is open on both sides. Maybe the turn signal harness is bad? All parking lights are working fine, no dimming so I guess they are well grounded. Going to pull the steering wheel and can and check the TS wires/mechanism.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2707574
10/17/19 10:44 AM
10/17/19 10:44 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,492 north of coder
moparx
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"Butt Crack Bob"
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make sure you check on both sides of the harness connection. i have seen just that connection be a source of unending frustration over the years, while guys replace turnsignal switches, and the problem remains because the terminals in the connection to the harness have issues. before you pull the switch, unplug the connection and check just the switch wires. if that works out, chances are the switch is ok. [no real guarantee, but just maybe] then, look very close at the harness connection for issues such as corrosion, loose or woolied up terminals, or cracked wire insulation.
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2707585
10/17/19 11:06 AM
10/17/19 11:06 AM
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SportF
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Before you go much farther, why don't you just replace all the 4 bulbs with new ones. Try that. A seemingly good bulb can be the cause. Plus, its real easy.
I used to teach troubleshooting on complex systems. Try easy things first. Also, try to fix just one side, not both. If its a common problem, it will show up. Lots of folks like to look for commonalities. If you have two problems, you'll be working a long time.
So, neither headlight works, must be something common, eh? No, after spending time checking switch and dimmer, turns out both bulbs bad. A long time ago, but I learned from that.
I didn't own a meter at the time, and that didn't help. These days, they give them away at Harbor Freight.
Good luck.
Last edited by SportF; 10/17/19 11:09 AM.
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: SportF]
#2707826
10/17/19 07:54 PM
10/17/19 07:54 PM
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Posts: 1,149 NW New Jersey
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I'm going to work on the problem tomorrow. Changing all of the bulbs is a good idea. But if Robert is correct, I should have continuity between the "power in" white wire and brown and dark green tail light wires with stalk in neutral. I checked and I have an open circuit on both wires. Also, the flasher button/switch is jammed and I can't get the flashers to work so maybe the problem is related.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2707831
10/17/19 08:14 PM
10/17/19 08:14 PM
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Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Also, the flasher button/switch is jammed and I can't get the flashers to work so maybe the problem is related. take care of this before you do anything else
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: stumpy]
#2708167
10/18/19 06:25 PM
10/18/19 06:25 PM
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Update. I took out the signal mechanism and cleaned the contacts the best I could, and replaced the emergency flasher and directional flasher. . I also got the flasher switch to move in and out but the flashers do not work. The left blinker works fine now, but when I put the right blinker on, the amp needle swings hard to discharge each time the directional flasher clicks. Neither the front or rear right blinkers work with the flasher clicking. If I leave the right blinker on for more than 20 seconds, I blow the radio/backup fuse and the hazard/stop lamp fuse. I checked all bulbs and grounds (that I know of) and they look good. However, the right front blinker/parking lamp does not work either in blink mode or when I turn on the parking lamps. But the fender side marker light works which I'm sure is hooked up to the front park lamp. I changed the front right blinker/park light housing and bulb thinking maybe an internal short, but it still doesn't work. All other lights work including brake lights. Is it logical to assume my problem is somewhere in the harness between the front right blinker and fender light? Can the problem still be with the directional switch?
Last edited by RSI700VIPER; 10/18/19 06:31 PM.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2708178
10/18/19 07:37 PM
10/18/19 07:37 PM
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Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Man that's a tough one! Yes there is a dead short or very heavy draw on the right side blinker that is swinging the needle to discharge when it clicks & likely a seperate open. I hate to recommend a new TS harness assy. I think I would seperate the TS harness pull apart connector again & with some jumpers & write down the schematic from www.mymopar.com & feed 12V in seperately to the right side to pin it down. Not much help & I am just thinking out loud. I would search downstream from the right flasher for the ground. EDIT you might take out the TS harness completely (at least seperate the mechanism under the steering wheel from ground) then plug it in & if that changes anything
Last edited by RapidRobert; 10/18/19 07:38 PM.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RapidRobert]
#2708204
10/18/19 09:18 PM
10/18/19 09:18 PM
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Robert, can you add clarity o this " EDIT you might take out the TS harness completely (at least seperate the mechanism under the steering wheel from ground) then plug it in & if that changes anything"
Short of tearing the whole wire harness apart from dash to turn signal, I don't know where to go from here.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Turn Signal Trouble
[Re: RSI700VIPER]
#2708317
10/19/19 12:18 PM
10/19/19 12:18 PM
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Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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I was thinking that if you removed the stalk then unbolted/removed the plastic cam/terminal assy from under the st wheel then mini bolted the stalk back on & operated the assy held up in your hand that that would elim a potentail ground fault at that location. Otherwise with the gauge pegging when the R turn signal flashes there is a dead short downstream on that side.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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