Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262565
03/27/09 01:00 PM
03/27/09 01:00 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
I understand what your saying and I see why you need a rear steer rack in the front. That would be great, you could have your tie rods at the exact angle and length. I think it would be a bit bulky though and take some engineering to get the angles, length of pivot arms, and proper geometry so it won't bind.
It's a good idea and sounds easy, but I think it would take someone with a engineering degree to design.
Actually it was quite easy, I was going to use it on my car and thats when I did the design work but I ended up moving the engine rearward and upward and didnt need to go to it..... but now with the added 100 more HP I wish I would have used it so I could lower my engine and maybe move it forward some
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: 451Guy]
#262566
03/27/09 01:04 PM
03/27/09 01:04 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
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Menomonee Falls
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Quote:
I have been watching this post with interest. I put a rack in my Demon a couple of winters ago. It was a long and drawn out process for me that involved lots of re-do's. As Mr. P said remove the torsion bars and the shock so that the lower control arm can move up and down freely. Mock up the rack and attach it to ball joints. Build your self a guage that you can put beside the tire to do some measuring off. Reinstall the tire and then jack up the tire through the entire travel and measure both the front and rear of the tire off the fixture to see what is happening with the toe as the tire moves up and down. The positioning of the rack will effect the toe issues as will the distance above or below the ball joint the heims are located.
I would also attempt to get the attachment point for the rack to ball joint as close to the tire as possible. This will get you some ackerman and help when the car backs up.
I built my own lower ball joints - I was not comfortable heating and bending or welding on the stock ones - Just me!
My front end works okay after all the work. I was never able to eliminate the bump steer issue but I did limit it to the very top and the very bottom of the travel. I limited the front suspension both ways to compensate for it.
I now have about 3 - 4 inches of front end travel. If I had it to do again I think I would have installed struts. Same travel no bump steer issues. That may still happen!
Good Luck and I hope you have a beer fridge in the garage - Mine involved lots of head scratching and the odd frosty beverage
Its all mocked up now. All my vice grips and c clamps are in use under my car Everything seems to look good.
Like you said, as I move it up and down I only really see noticeable bump steer in bottom inch and top inch of travel. I'm gonna try to see if I can correct it, but I doubt it.
How did you limit your suspension. That may be what I end up doing.
I try not to drink when working on my car, but this project here is gonna drive me to it
I'l usually slam a few down every night after I've exhausted my brain
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262567
03/27/09 01:36 PM
03/27/09 01:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591 Canton, Ohio
Sport440
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Canton, Ohio
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Its been done by a guy here in Ohio, Dave Laube, ???, and I studied his build. That is the perfect way to do it. It gets the inner connection points where they need to be. He didnt use a rear steer though with the Pivot Idea Though that would work.
He used a front steer, and removed the two steering tie ends fabbed up a new drag link with higher inner mounting points and bolted it to the rack where the arms plug in. Ran new tierods and he claims it functions perfect in both Bump steer and ackerman.
I had a appointment with him to view his work first hand but i never got out there. I also have the article with pics of his build. I can send copies if anyone would like. After his article ran he was barraged with calls including mine. So many infact that now he stop taking them.
Someday I may convert mine over, but that would mean another redo. Even though mines not perfect after many adjustments and head scratching and studying, making models, flipping steering arm ball joints back and forth. And then just making my own.
I finally have my rack working fairly well, but not perfect. In the abody you just cant get the rack back and up far enough for its proper position. That dang crank centerline is in the way.
If you dont do the Drag link thing the best thing you can do is minimize the issues the best you can. mike
Edit, Pivot/rear steer
Last edited by Sport440; 03/27/09 06:13 PM.
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: Dodgeman67]
#262574
03/27/09 09:17 PM
03/27/09 09:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
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Menomonee Falls
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Quote:
Now that's what I'm talk'in about.
Looking good, you ain't got that thing running yet?
Ha ha ha not yet Give me another day or two
Still have to take all the steering components out and tig them
Then the final dreaded task.......... building headers to go around the steering coulmn
After that, it's all down hill. Putting the engine together and then back in the car
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: RichV]
#262579
12/08/09 10:56 AM
12/08/09 10:56 AM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,442 LOWELL IN
QWK_ENUF
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,442
LOWELL IN
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that is what dareracing did to make his front ends
swapped stock ball joints side to side which messes up the ackerman angle.it will drive straight but will give problems when turning
WAXER
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: QWK_ENUF]
#262580
12/08/09 11:02 AM
12/08/09 11:02 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
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Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
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Wow I didn't know I'd get more responses on this thread. I was just bumping this for my buddy cause he wanted the info. Who makes the ball joints for front steer with ackerman corrected? The car drives great! Had a little bump steer issue but got that fixed. Still can't hold it on the street very well You need two clear lanes to put it to the floor... Also I did not switch ball joints from side to side. I just cut the steering arm off the back and welded it on the front. For some of you reading this for the first time, glad that you learned something from this thread. If you didn't notice I knew nothing about suspension when I started this thread and learned very quickly (the hard way) about how suspension works...
Last edited by R5P7Duster; 12/08/09 11:05 AM.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: QWK_ENUF]
#262581
12/08/09 03:50 PM
12/08/09 03:50 PM
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Anonymous
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