Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: 68hemiss]
#2540675
08/23/18 11:59 PM
08/23/18 11:59 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Circle Track
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am trying to find the correct pushrod length. Straub industries has a good utube vid on this. several sources say it is the gold std on this, that at half cam lift you want the rocker to be 90 deg to the valve tip/retainer THEN (at that point) you measure the pushrod length needed for however much preload you want. EDIT & Scott on the vid uses chebby stud mounted rockers & lowers them to get the 90 deg at half lift. & the chebby rocker choice for this needs to be right (for the correct wipe pattern) & you have yours already but FYI Mike at B3 racing is top notch for this. MORE EDIT I had a Q on the vid & the guy says to then lengthen the pushrod till you have zero clearance & I am wondering if it needs to be lengthened further for a certain amt of preload or shortened a bit for the cold or hot clearance for solids ???
Last edited by RapidRobert; 08/24/18 04:05 AM.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: RapidRobert]
#2540676
08/24/18 12:06 AM
08/24/18 12:06 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Get yourself a adjustable push rod to do the job right.. they are cheap EDIT also Crane rockers seem to have some issues.. you might need to shim the shaft up to get it right or even lower it.. that takes a bit of work.. try another rocker(you might end up sending those Cranes back)
Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 08/24/18 12:16 AM.
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: 68hemiss]
#2540688
08/24/18 12:36 AM
08/24/18 12:36 AM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457 Washington
madscientist
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Go to b3racingengines.com and read his tech pages.
I'm 99.999% sure you need to correct the geometry. I'm that confident.
Make sure you check with him, take your measurements and buy his correction kit BEFORE you measure for pushrods.
This is a shaft system. Pushrod length only affects geometry in that easing or lowering the adjuster will slightly alter rocker ratio.
The adjuster should be out 9/32 of an inch. Correct the geometry and THEN measure for pushrods.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: 68hemiss]
#2540828
08/24/18 11:55 AM
08/24/18 11:55 AM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206 New York
polyspheric
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Sorry, the issue is more complicated than that. The 50% method simply transfers the error to the pushrod side.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: polyspheric]
#2540899
08/24/18 02:44 PM
08/24/18 02:44 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
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Sorry, the issue is more complicated than that. The 50% method simply transfers the error to the pushrod side. Exactly. That's why I suggested to the OP to call Mike at B3 and let Mike help him. This stuff about its good enough just isn't. You can fix these things now without machining the stands off an using blocks. It works. It's cost effective. And it should be done with virtually every rocker arm out there.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: madscientist]
#2540973
08/24/18 05:57 PM
08/24/18 05:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,857 Pattison Texas
CSK
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Sorry, the issue is more complicated than that. The 50% method simply transfers the error to the pushrod side. Exactly. That's why I suggested to the OP to call Mike at B3 and let Mike help him. This stuff about its good enough just isn't. You can fix these things now without machining the stands off an using blocks. It works. It's cost effective. And it should be done with virtually every rocker arm out there. Absolutely !!! Mike set up my T&D rockers, had to raise them quite abit & move them away from the valves.
Last edited by csk; 08/24/18 06:17 PM.
1968 Charger COLD A/C Hilborn EFI 512ci 9.7 compression, Stealth heads, 4.10 gear A518 ODtrans 4100lb,10.93 full street car trim 2020 T/A 392 Stock 11.79 @ 114.5
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: CSK]
#2541005
08/24/18 07:23 PM
08/24/18 07:23 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457 Washington
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Sorry, the issue is more complicated than that. The 50% method simply transfers the error to the pushrod side. Exactly. That's why I suggested to the OP to call Mike at B3 and let Mike help him. This stuff about its good enough just isn't. You can fix these things now without machining the stands off an using blocks. It works. It's cost effective. And it should be done with virtually every rocker arm out there. Absolutely !!! Mike set up my T&D rockers, had to raise them quite abit & move them away from the valves. That's a bit of correction but think how many guys out there running the same stuff (or even of lesser quality) that have NO correction on their stuff? You can bet their valve train is pissed off to no end. I love Mikes system. Simple, cost effective and it flat works.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: madscientist]
#2541057
08/24/18 10:08 PM
08/24/18 10:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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& Mike was the one that pointed me to the straub vid for the 50% deal being ideal. It would be way harder to find the right angle with OE type rockers as opposed to the chebby types that you just raise & lower the polylock especially if you have to mill the stands to lower the shafts and he wanted me to call back for further edumacation.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: RapidRobert]
#2541060
08/24/18 10:16 PM
08/24/18 10:16 PM
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& Mike was the one that pointed me to the straub vid for the 50% deal being ideal. It would be way harder to find the right angle with OE type rockers as opposed to the chebby types that you just raise & lower the polylock especially if you have to mill the stands to lower the shafts and he wanted me to call back for further edumacation. Did you see the picture csk posted? That's what a correction looks like. You just can't move the shafts up and down. If they go up, they have to move away from the valve. If they go down, they have to move closer to the valve too.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: 68hemiss]
#2541064
08/24/18 10:42 PM
08/24/18 10:42 PM
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polyspheric
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The diff is that the stand motion is vertical (unless you make new offset stands), while the valve stem height moves at the stem angle (15, 18 etc.).
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: polyspheric]
#2541065
08/24/18 10:45 PM
08/24/18 10:45 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,857 Pattison Texas
CSK
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The diff is that the stand motion is vertical (unless you make new offset stands), while the valve stem height moves at the stem angle (15, 18 etc.). The shaft holes have been slotted,makes it offset, so it also helps the pushrod side.
Last edited by csk; 08/24/18 10:46 PM.
1968 Charger COLD A/C Hilborn EFI 512ci 9.7 compression, Stealth heads, 4.10 gear A518 ODtrans 4100lb,10.93 full street car trim 2020 T/A 392 Stock 11.79 @ 114.5
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: madscientist]
#2541098
08/25/18 12:37 AM
08/25/18 12:37 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Did you see the picture csk posted? That's what a correction looks like. Now I do
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: wyrmrider]
#2541129
08/25/18 03:27 AM
08/25/18 03:27 AM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457 Washington
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mad that 9/32 distance you quoted was measured how? thanks many adjusters today are much longer from the ball to the thread so the old "3 thread" setup no longer works and results in too short pushrods I like the adjusters up as close to the rocker as possible leaving some room for adjustment
while roller tip rockers do not get the side thrust that iron or stock rockers do they need the fix shown in the pic above
Iron rockers need a fix if off because they can give side thrust
From the bottom of the rocker to the end of the ball. And that's as long as the oil feed hole to the adjuster is drilled right under the part where the adjuster goes through. I had one set of Crane W-2 rockers that had the oil hole about .090 lower than directly under where the adjuster comes through so you has to run the adjuster a bit lower or you'd smoke the adjuster. That was the only set of rockers I've ever seen drilled like that.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Mech rocker valve wear pattern
[Re: 68hemiss]
#2541194
08/25/18 11:19 AM
08/25/18 11:19 AM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206 New York
polyspheric
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Side thrust (sliding contact between the pallet radius and the stem tip) is present in all non-roller rocker arms BY DESIGN. It's not a mistake, it's needed to produce an oil wedge between the two surfaces.
Boffin Emeritus
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