Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25398
08/05/06 04:58 PM
08/05/06 04:58 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220 toronto canada
69chargeryeehaa
OP
pro stock
|
OP
pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220
toronto canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
...I know the paint still scratches (yep, with my fingernail) - not that it scratches all the way off, but it leaves a scratch...
Exit...get ready for a long wait! I've been in the process of preparing my car for a 'real' paint job. This roll-on stuff will not feather like other auto paint. When I try to sand, the Rustoleum peels!! My paint has been on for months - not dry yet...That sucks...
Another thing i've noticed...this thread has been going on forever...you'd think we'd have a bunch of success stories by now?!? Mine was a bomb...Chuck
sucess storie(s):
(bug pic taken 3 weeks ago with my new wheels, paint is 6+yrs old and counting):
Note to exit - honestly i haven't tried to scratch my paint off with my nail after painting, but i know it would if i tried, i did notice that when re-assembling the car the paint would "dent" like it was still soft. my advice, let a few months go by, it WILL be rock hard, i'd put $ on it, cut and polish the paint when it's fresh, the reason why i advise the turtle wax is because it is such a fine (3000+ grit) compound, it does'nt scratch the paint. This paint takes LONG to fully cure, BUT when dry i'm telling you it's got to be one of the toughest paints around.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25399
08/05/06 05:11 PM
08/05/06 05:11 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
IIRC you're working on a hood ... if you da'd the paint off, you might want to hit it real quick with the same grit as the DA, but with a long-ish block. The DA takes off material very unevenly on flat surfaces, and is probably the source of your waves. Back when my dad and I were doing his 'vette over in the early 90s, we were doing bodywork, prime, and da'ing the poop out of it, we couldn't get a level surface until an old timer came over and laughed at us ... "da's are for shaping, guys ... you need to put those things down and start blocking the car out!"
A fresh recoat of Brightside Black on the hood last night. No drying problems this time, everything seems to be in order. Yup, I still have some waves, though not quite as bad as before. Since I'm pretty happy with the paint application this time, I think I can live with it, but maybe I'll get a long sanding block once I start stripping the rest of the car. I hope to get my second coat on maybe by tonight.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: Exit1965]
#25400
08/05/06 05:34 PM
08/05/06 05:34 PM
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575 Canada
Marq
mopar addict
|
mopar addict
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575
Canada
|
Quote:
Has anyone (Marq?) wetsanded then polished the brightside yet?
Nope... the paint job was finished on the 22nd of August and I have been happily putting some mileage on the car... whhhhhhhhheeeeeeeeeee !
I was planning to hold off on the polishhing and waxing stage for at least 30 or more days ( as per the recommendations of the polyurhane shiners.
Quote:
I have not yet begun the final wetsand/polish on my car, but I know the paint still scratches (yep, with my fingernail) - not that it scratches all the way off, but it leaves a scratch.
The longer you can hold off on the polishing and final waxing of the polyurathane the better. But I have noticed in the furniture message boards where they have gone from painting or coating with polyurathane in as short as 72 hours - and gotten mirror smooth finishes.
But the furniture guys are usually working with a much smaller surace area. And I believe they are putting less coats on tha we are.
Quote:
Funny thing I've noticed is that when I've used rustoleum in spray cans, and even when I mixed some spray together in my refillable spray can, the paint has dried VERY hard in a matter of days or a week. I can't leave indentations in it with my fingernails like I can with the rolled on stuff.
The carrier in the spray paint is much more evaporative then the carrier in the paints which we use. So that and the thickness of the layers we 'roll on' go a long way towards the longer curing time needed as compared to the spray bombs.
.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25401
08/05/06 05:42 PM
08/05/06 05:42 PM
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575 Canada
Marq
mopar addict
|
mopar addict
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575
Canada
|
Quote:
Anyone know a good way to dye a plush cloth interior? The sun faded parts of the front interior from grey to blue.
I know at our Canadian Tire store they sell an aerosol spray bomb for 'textiles' in the automotive section. They have it sittin on the shelves right next to the spray bombs for changing the color or refreshing the color of vinyl.
Another way to do the color change would cost a few bucks but guarantee a more professional look. In Ottawa we have a company that has equipment for changing the color of 'CARPETS'. Visually it just looks like they are steam cleaning the carpet... but they use a dye in their system that changes the color of the carpet. Possibly if you had one of the 'carpet dyers' in your area, they could do a car interior with one of their hand held units.
.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25402
08/05/06 06:46 PM
08/05/06 06:46 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
As to success, I'm satisfied that the final result is going to be well worth my time, cost and effort. I started on the final wet sand polish today, on the driver's side box panel. Looked a bit peely indoors, but felt smooth as glass when finished. Out in the sun, the florida grapefruit doesn't even show up, so I can only assume that it's an effect of the metallic dusting coat between layers. As to the hardness of the paint, I managed to put one scratch in it with a nail head while installing ( test purposes, being impatient again ) my redneck tonneau cover. Wooden frame with a tarp stretched over it. Other than that, I had the cover on and off twice with no sign of damage or marring. My cheap ( ) camera doesn't catch it the best, but in the sun, the shine is "Holy snowblind, Batman!". Finishing was 2000 wet sand followed by Turtle Wax polishing compound on a Turtle Wax random orbit polisher. I'm satisfied with the results and would say it's been successful for me. I hope that others can get the results I have.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: Exit1965]
#25403
08/05/06 06:53 PM
08/05/06 06:53 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
What have the temps been for you lately? I notice that when I ran the truck out in the sun for a day, the paint always felt softer, or tackier/grabby to the touch. Next morning, after a night indoors, it felt quite dry and tough again. Perhaps it's an effect of solvent passing up through the surface layer from below? I know that mine has wetsanded and polished out extremely well and is very difficult to mark or mar without really making an effort, say like dragging a high nail head accross it ( see expalanation in last posting )
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: Marq]
#25404
08/05/06 07:42 PM
08/05/06 07:42 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,001 Coram, NY
Pool Fixer
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,001
Coram, NY
|
Quote:
Quote:
Anyone know a good way to dye a plush cloth interior? The sun faded parts of the front interior from grey to blue.
I know at our Canadian Tire store they sell an aerosol spray bomb for 'textiles' in the automotive section. They have it sittin on the shelves right next to the spray bombs for changing the color or refreshing the color of vinyl.
Another way to do the color change would cost a few bucks but guarantee a more professional look. In Ottawa we have a company that has equipment for changing the color of 'CARPETS'. Visually it just looks like they are steam cleaning the carpet... but they use a dye in their system that changes the color of the carpet. Possibly if you had one of the 'carpet dyers' in your area, they could do a car interior with one of their hand held units.
.
just beware that some "stainmaster" type carpets will not take dye. I tried having carpets dyed when I first moved in my house 10 years ago. the guy cut out a piece from under a baseboard and tried it in my sink, no go!!!
maybe whatever they put in the carpet and/or seat cloth to make it stain resistant might make it "dye" resistant.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25406
08/05/06 09:20 PM
08/05/06 09:20 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
That seems odd, I would of assumed it shouldn't scratch, me and you are pretty much in the same weather and my friends car was almost fully dry and scratch test proof after a few days. Maybe since we were putting it on a bit thicker, who knows.
I know the test glove box door I did, and the roof on my truck are HARD no way in heck will I do much more than MAYBE scuff the paint with my fingernails, maybe enough to roughen the surface of the paint but even that I doubt, that crap is tough and HARD. If I get that all over? I'll be STOKED with the finish I can guarantee that.
The door ain't been outside, the roof ain't been inside so I don't think it's sun, heat (plenty lately) or humidity (way more than plenty lately) keeping paint soft. 90+ lately almost 100, both heat and humidity! I can't work on my truck more than 30 minutes at a pop, then I come inside and drink a quart of water and rest for a while, then do it again.
I'm using Rusto Professional + Low Odor spirits all from Lowes, I believe I am putting on what would be considered "thicker" coats but frankly I can live with a little orange peel, looked at a "new" car lately? Orange peel baby! My wife's new Yukon? Yep see that orange peel, I was walking around a parking lot a couple days ago while my wife was getting some medicine at the drugstore and just scrutinizing paint jobs. I found everyone that I analyzed was quite "substandard".
I know a place that does high dollar restorations ($50,000 is a good start for this place to do a car for you) if I get some time I might go up there and just eyeball a few of their cars to see how the "good ones" look up close. I've been threatening the owner for ages to come up there and chat up his body men for tips and hints.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: 78D150CLUB]
#25407
08/05/06 09:22 PM
08/05/06 09:22 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
I hope that others can get the results I have.
How do those stripes look close up? What'd you use just blue painter's tape, or regular masking tape or what?
I'm wanting to two-tone my truck and I'm worried I might not be able to pull off the edges properly to make it look good so hints and suggestions are what I'm after
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25408
08/05/06 10:25 PM
08/05/06 10:25 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
At first, grim, the stripe had an edge where the tape had been, the same way the original paint did. Original, as in factory shot, hard to believe on a 30 yr old truck, still only one coat of paint. The wet sanding with 2000 took that right down almost smooth. I used ordinary masking tape, but with the time the tape has to remain in place, I think I'd try the blue or green painters tape next time. I had no problems with the edge pulling, but I did have an issue with the tape removing paint from the dark layer in spots. I found that using a cloth wetted with spirits wiped along the adhesive as the tape comes off worked very well to soften the adhesive and allow the tape to release without pulls. Also, pull the tape on the bias, ie: 45 deg angle to the edge of the paint /______ so the pull is into the edge. not lifting straight up on it. Rub the cloth with spirits back and forth across the edge while applying a gentle pull, and the tape should come off clean and easy. Bit of a sticky job, cause the softened glue wants to resettle all over your fingers, though Sorry for rambling, just trying to pass on all I can about what worked for me, same way 69Charger did for us all. Hopefully, it's of some help. A great big YEeeeeHaaaa for Charger, thanks for sharing your method with the rest of us.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: 78D150CLUB]
#25409
08/05/06 10:37 PM
08/05/06 10:37 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
An addition to my reply to grimster re: two tone This truck is not mine, but the paint and trim are the same package as mine is. The twotone line will be covered by the mounted trim when everything is finished.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: 78D150CLUB]
#25410
08/05/06 10:47 PM
08/05/06 10:47 PM
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575 Canada
Marq
mopar addict
|
mopar addict
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 575
Canada
|
Something that just struck me here.... about this discussion about 'soft' paint and challenges regarding 'hardness' of the paint. I am starting to believe that there are some people out there that have absolutely NO IDEA about the relative hardness of : a) a new cars paint job...fresh from the factory or... b) a freshly painted car from a professional paint shop. It seems that the folks who are under the impression that automotive paint jobs 'MUST' be rock hard... are basing their opinions on car paint jobs that are 'OLD' - and fully cured. And the older the car... then obviously the harder that paint will be. It's been curing FOR YEARS for cripes sake.. Let's think about this for a minute... a brand new car from THE FACTORY... Think for a second... how much TIME has passed from the time the car was painted at the factory before it showed up at the car lot or was purchased by its first owner. They don't just slam out the cars and magically have it appear on the car lot two weeks after it was painted. And what does the world famous wax and polish authority Meguiars have to say about new car paint jobs ? Quote:
A new car with a factory paint job can be waxed the moment it is rolled out of the manufacturing plant. Cars that have factory paint jobs are cured at much higher temperatures, sometimes as high as 300 degrees in special baking ovens. At a factory level, the car goes through the painting and baking process without any of the rubber, plastic, and cloth components installed. This is why they can expose the car and it's fresh paint to such high temperatures. These high temperatures and special paints used at the factory level insures the paint is fully cured by the time the car is completely assembled.
And even with this ulta-hot baking... the cars are then put in storage... for weeks and months. So it is impossible to compare a 300 degree baked paint job against a paint shop paint job or a 'rolled on' and baked in the sun paint job.
. New cars in storage in South Korea heading for the USA. And how long do they sit in the hold of the ship while being transported. And how long do they sit in the US holding compounds before being forwarded to the dealers. That's a lot of curing time I would say...
. At the southside of the town of Corby (UK) there are enormous car storage areas with thousands of vahicles. Baking in the sun... waiting... waiting... for when they will be finally sent on to a car dealers lot... where they will continue to sit in the sun until someone buys them...
. New cars in storage in Newark New Jersey (USA) waiting to be forwarded to dealers. Fresh from the holding lots at the car manufacturers... where they originally sat and baked in the sun.. and now sitting in this compound where they sit and cure... while waiting... waiting.. to be sent on to the car dealer lots... where they will continue to sit in the sun...
Some of those cars have sat at 'holding compounds' FOR MONTHS prior to being shipped to the dealer lots. Those holding compounds are OUTSIDE in the sun. So these cars have been painted and left to sit for months prior to you getting a chance to dig your finger nails into their paint.... That paint has had time to CURE.
Now.. let's pop the delusional bubble about the paint jobs that have been applied by the professional paint shops - baked or not baked. I do not think there is one body shop in the world that would advise their customer 'that its ok to take the car through a car wash for the first or second month'. They normally advise their customers to NOT take the car through a car wash and to ONLY WASH THE CAR with a bucket of water, very mild auto specific soap, very soft chamois cloth or some other soft cloth. The bottom line is that the freshly painted car from the shop has SOFT PAINT that can be scratched, marred or even have impressions pushed into it because it TAKES TIME FOR IT TO FULLY CURE. Want to be a nasty [Edited by Moparts - Keep it clean]... then go to a paint shop and casually try to scratch the paint on one of their freshly painted cars. If you don't get killed by the shop owner.. you may live to tell exactly how soft the professional paint job really is.
And what does the world authority Meguiars have to say on paint shop paint jobs ???
Quote:
After-market paint finishes however, are cured at a much lower temperature to ensure the method of baking or heating the paint doesn't melt non-metal components such as wiring and vinyl. For this reason, it's best to follow the specific paint manufactures recommendations for care and maintenance of fresh paint. Most paint manufactures that supply paint to the refinish industry recommend that you allow anywhere from 30 to 90 days curing time after the paint is applied before you apply the first application of wax.
When comparing the hardness of the Tremclad/Rustoleum or Brightside paints against 'OTHER' paint jobs... I hope people will be able to keep things in better perspective and compare APPLES TO APPLES - rather than APPLES TO ORANGES.
The reality of these 'roller' paint jobs is that their relative 'HARDNESS' is probably THE VERY SAME when you are comparing the same time space of each of those processes in its curing.
And I don't think it is realistic to compare a paint job that has only cured for one week, one month or even a couple of months... against a car's finish that is six months old or many years old.
Keep things in the proper perspective and I think you can better appreciate that this 'roller process' is at the same level of hardness during its curing as the other paint jobs are AT THE SAME PERIOD OF TIME in their curing.
And if you could BAKE your car at 300 degees without melting all your rubber and plastic.. you might stand a chance at competing and comparing against a factory baked paint job for hardness
But with TIME all paint jobs eventually reach their maximum potential hardness...
Last edited by Marq; 08/05/06 11:54 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: Marq]
#25411
08/05/06 11:04 PM
08/05/06 11:04 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
with Marq. I've been painting mine one panel at a time for the last month, and allowing it to bake outside on sunny days. The paint is still hardening even now, but it isn't finished, and likely won't be fully cured before late fall, in my opinion. I'm lucky enough to have a second vehicle and I can work at the truck when I get motivated. Thus, I've been able to stretch it out, and can actually compare different stages of paint on the same vehicle. BTW, i'm still over the shine on the buffed areas i did today.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: 78D150CLUB]
#25412
08/05/06 11:54 PM
08/05/06 11:54 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
So is rust, or brightside gettin better results? OR does it even matter, i think i read that with brightside you dont need miniral spirits to thing it out, its already good to go?
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25413
08/06/06 12:28 AM
08/06/06 12:28 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
I know Marq used Brightside, and I think he thinned with their brushing fluid, but I'm not 100% certain on that. His results seemed very glossy in the pics he posted. I used Tremclad and mineral spirits, and didn't find any problems. I did probably put in more time than a lot of others applying, but I wasn't in a hurry. There are still some obvious bumps and bruises in the bodywork, but that's because the correct/better parts and a long term facility aren't available right now. Even with a less than perfect surface, I got impressive results.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
[Re: 78D150CLUB]
#25415
08/06/06 12:35 AM
08/06/06 12:35 AM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
There is SO much information on this thread its hard to catch up with all the things yall have mentioned... So its seem Brightside can be done with as little as 3 coats and you just aply the paint with no other thiners or anything else? Just open the can and roll. Ive seen the red McLaren(beautiful) who else is using brightside and i will search. And where can u buy Brightside? I live in florida so finding a marine shop isnt difficult just its no intown. also when i searhced for brightside i found this site http://www.pyacht.net/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/online-store/scstore/h-interlux.htm?E+scstoreWhich one is it?!!? lol
Last edited by zhillz; 08/06/06 12:55 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Paint job on a budget!? CONTINUED..page 44........
#25416
08/06/06 12:49 AM
08/06/06 12:49 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475 Ontario, Canada
78D150CLUB
My avatar is a self portrait!!
|
My avatar is a self portrait!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,475
Ontario, Canada
|
Marq would have more info on using Brightside, so I'll leave the details for him. I can't say I had any experience with it. A few pages back, someone posted an Ebay dealer they bought 6 qts of Brightside from for $60, but the only colors available were red and blue. A few calls to local marine shops or boat yards/dealers should find a local source for you, though. You might even check hardware or farm supply stores, with as many boats as there are in Florida, some may stock or be able to order the paint for you. On your link, under Topside Paints, Brightside Polyurethane.
I want to die like my Grampa, peacefully, in his sleep. Not screaming in terror like his passengers.
|
|
|
|
|