Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
#2474774
03/31/18 10:17 AM
03/31/18 10:17 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
I have taken a few years off from building mopars after retiring. Couldn't stand it, and bought a promising project.
It is a 318-2, Short bed, automatic and everything mechanical is in tact other than missing air cleaner and butchered carb swap.
It hasn't ran in years, all of the potting compound in the ecm, voltage regulators have melted and ran down the firewall and the wiring has been messed with.
Floorboards are on order. Someone had already grafted in some metal and used home expanding crack sealer for the gaps.
I have started taking this rig clear apart and am considering a Gen III Hemi swap. Will it bolt up to the existing trans/transfer case set up? Has anyone done this?
Last edited by furious; 03/31/18 10:19 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2474856
03/31/18 01:11 PM
03/31/18 01:11 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,647 in a cattle trailer down by th...
Guitar Jones
Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
|
Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,647
in a cattle trailer down by th...
|
The Gen III Hemi has the same bell housing bolt pattern as the LA small block.
"Follow me the wise man said, but he walked behind"
'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion. '74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NV4500, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Rear disc and hydroboost conversion. 2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: QuickDodge]
#2475266
04/01/18 12:22 PM
04/01/18 12:22 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
From what I've read, the 318 & 360 magnum engine swaps are cheaper than the Hemi swaps. The early (OBD-1) magnums are said to have the easiest wiring, if you want to keep the fuel injection. These engines can also be swapped to a carburetor if desired. Thanks QuickDodge, I appreciate the input. I have thought about a 360, a lot. On my other swaps with small blocks I have always gone 340 but they are getting crazy prices. The Gen III Hemis are getting more common in the salvage yards. What years of 360s are the OBD-1 magnums? 95-98? I had purchased a 91 360 a few years ago due to the roller lifters and shaft rocker combo, but never got around to building it prior to moving.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2475276
04/01/18 12:30 PM
04/01/18 12:30 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400 Trumbauersville PA
ric3xrt
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400
Trumbauersville PA
|
G3 swap has been done a few times, Mounting it in is the easy part,hardest part is deciding on Carb Vs Fuel injection....stay away from the 545 trans too many issues better off with a 727 518/46RH or any manual trans http://bouchillonperformance.com/inc/sdetail/669/742A316/360 Magnum, is an easier swap
Last edited by ric3xrt; 04/01/18 12:31 PM.
Truth has no agenda, but those with an agenda make their own truth. Some of us are so open minded they only see their View
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2475279
04/01/18 12:33 PM
04/01/18 12:33 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,005 Reno, Nevada
NV69B7RR
master
|
master
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,005
Reno, Nevada
|
What choices are there for Auto/OD transmissions to swap in? If Doing a magnum swap can you just swap in the entire driveline it it s a 4wd?
EDIT: Sorry, I didn't mean to hijack the thread. I just figured that it would be a logical question with the talk of swapping a gen3 Hemi or Magnum swap.
Last edited by NV69B7RR; 04/01/18 06:41 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2475326
04/01/18 01:08 PM
04/01/18 01:08 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899 ohio
ruderunner
master
|
master
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899
ohio
|
Easiest fuel injection and overdrive swap would be from 90-93 pickup or ramcharger. Dakota can be used but needs transfer case or front axle swap. Next easiest is 94-97 but need more electrical interface work and either transfer case or front axle swap.
In any of the above you lose full time 4wd transfer case. Up to you if you want to swap the front axle for something with locking hubs which will necessitate a matching rear axle...
Angry white pureblood male
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: ruderunner]
#2475398
04/01/18 03:01 PM
04/01/18 03:01 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
G3 swap has been done a few times, Mounting it in is the easy part,hardest part is deciding on Carb Vs Fuel injection....stay away from the 545 trans too many issues better off with a 727 518/46RH or any manual trans http://bouchillonperformance.com/inc/sdetail/669/742A316/360 Magnum, is an easier swap Thanks! Could I use the 727 that is already in the truck along with the converter? Easiest fuel injection and overdrive swap would be from 90-93 pickup or ramcharger. Dakota can be used but needs transfer case or front axle swap. Next easiest is 94-97 but need more electrical interface work and either transfer case or front axle swap.
In any of the above you lose full time 4wd transfer case. Up to you if you want to swap the front axle for something with locking hubs which will necessitate a matching rear axle... Thank you! I really want to keep the current transfer case and front end if possible.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2475485
04/01/18 05:44 PM
04/01/18 05:44 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899 ohio
ruderunner
master
|
master
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899
ohio
|
The problem with the NP203 case is it only fits the 727 auto or an NP435 manual. There are no overdrive transmission it fits (not without mucho dinero)
Just realized that the od response was to a hijacker not the op.
That said you certainly can put a Magnum engine in front of the 727/203 combo. Mostly bolt in but make sure you have the right converter and flexplate for proper balance. Electric will be the biggest hassle but still way easier than a hemi.
Last edited by ruderunner; 04/01/18 05:46 PM.
Angry white pureblood male
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: Mr onetwo]
#2475861
04/02/18 07:55 AM
04/02/18 07:55 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550 Sacramento CA
Morty426
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550
Sacramento CA
|
Best thing to do is find 1993 W150 or W250 360/518 4wd truck that is rotted out and cheap.Everything you will need is there.W250 will have Dana 60 which is a plus. That is exactly what I did. Bought a totaled 93 Ramcharger and put the drivetrain in my 75 Trailduster
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: bbtrux]
#2478210
04/06/18 08:51 AM
04/06/18 08:51 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
Best thing to do is find 1993 W150 or W250 360/518 4wd truck that is rotted out and cheap.Everything you will need is there.W250 will have Dana 60 which is a plus. Best thing to do is find 1993 W150 or W250 360/518 4wd truck that is rotted out and cheap.Everything you will need is there.W250 will have Dana 60 which is a plus. That is exactly what I did. Bought a totaled 93 Ramcharger and put the drivetrain in my 75 Trailduster Id find a running rusty 91-93 truck. Use the engine, trans, transfer case and maybe driveshafts ,then swap 80-93 knuckles and eliminate the full time garbage. Thanks so much, I am going to look into that angle.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2478217
04/06/18 09:39 AM
04/06/18 09:39 AM
|
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 684 Maine
jerseybud
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 684
Maine
|
Just to clear some things up:
Your targets for donors are 1992 trucks/RCs with 318 or 1993 trucks/RCs with 5.2 r 5.9, The years prior (1988-1991 for 5.2, 1989-1992 for 5.9) were TBI and those harnesses are quite difficult to transition to work on a magnum engine. If you want to keep the fuel injection, the fuel tank really should be acquired for that application- it will make things easier for you. Even the cab harness is different on 3 major wire locations comparing 1991-1992 for example. People used to use 1992-1995 dakota harnesses for this swap alot back in the day, but not as easy as full size harness. Summary- you need the engine, cab and chassis harness
Transmission options if overdrive is required range from 1990-1995. Most 5.2 a518/46RHs were lockup but (1992s were for sure in light duty trucks) but 5.9s are hit or miss til 1993 on lock up. 1994 -1995 will be lockup.
OBD 2 started in 1996 and things get more complicated after that from a wiring standpoint.
Axles can be anything from a 4x4 from 81-93 and for rear axle, from a 2wd from 1985 up. Beware of the 9 1/4 HD. Used on light duty 3/4 ton trucks and everyone calls it a dana 60- people dont bother to look, nor do they care when selling them
Cam and a 4 barrel will make a 5.9 magnum act like a 5.7 hemi. Best years for 5.9 magnum are 1999-2003. The camshaft was changed to the 1998 Grand cherokee 5.9 limited cam. There is no best years for 5.2, thought the 1992-1993 5.2 exhaust manifolds had the 2 1/8 outlets and are thought to flow better
doing a 5.9 magnum should be cheaperthan 5.7. I cannot get a 5.7 in Maine for less than 1900, while I can get a 5.9 for 700 with less than 100k if patient. But the 5.7 needs a special aftermarket ECM harness if going that way that is at least 1000 extra, plus oil pan, motor mounts, oil filter adapter. 5.7 has much more potential but at what cost?
Last edited by jerseybud; 04/06/18 08:48 PM. Reason: change a 1992 to 1993
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: jerseybud]
#2478225
04/06/18 10:21 AM
04/06/18 10:21 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
Just to clear some things up:
Your targets for donors are 1992 trucks/RCs with 318 or 1992 trucks/RCs with 5.2 r 5.9, The years prior (1988-1991 for 5.2, 1989-1992 for 5.9) were TBI and those harnesses are quite difficult to transition to work on a magnum engine. If you want to keep the fuel injection, the fuel tank really should be acquired for that application- it will make things easier for you. Even the cab harness is different on 3 major wire locations comparing 1991-1992 for example. People used to use 1992-1995 dakota harnesses for this swap alot back in the day, but not as easy as full size harness. Summary- you need the engine, cab and chassis harness
Transmission options if overdrive is required range from 1990-1995. Most 5.2 a518/46RHs were lockup but (1992s were for sure in light duty trucks) but 5.9s are hit or miss til 1993 on lock up. 1994 -1995 will be lockup.
OBD 2 started in 1996 and things get more complicated after that from a wiring standpoint.
Axles can be anything from a 4x4 from 81-93 and for rear axle, from a 2wd from 1985 up. Beware of the 9 1/4 HD. Used on light duty 3/4 ton trucks and everyone calls it a dana 60- people dont bother to look, nor do they care when selling them
Cam and a 4 barrel will make a 5.9 magnum act like a 5.7 hemi. Best years for 5.9 magnum are 1999-2003. The camshaft was changed to the 1998 Grand cherokee 5.9 limited cam. There is no best years for 5.2, thought the 1992-1993 5.2 exhaust manifolds had the 2 1/8 outlets and are thought to flow better
doing a 5.9 magnum should be cheaperthan 5.7. I cannot get a 5.7 in Maine for less than 1900, while I can get a 5.9 for 700 with less than 100k if patient. But the 5.7 needs a special aftermarket ECM harness if going that way that is at least 1000 extra, plus oil pan, motor mounts, oil filter adapter. 5.7 has much more potential but at what cost?
Wow, that is a lot of information, thanks so much for going to the trouble. I am leaning heavy to the 360, there seems to be a lot of them available around here. This truck is just going to be a toy, without daily use, so I am hoping to avoid changing the trans/transfer case/axles/converter if possible. My current wiring harness is a total mess, as is the gas tank, so it makes sense to change the harness/engine/gas tank to the 92 as you mention. I hope I am understanding that right, forgive me if I am not. Please correct me if so, you mentioned that the 5.9 was hit or miss in that year. **edit** sorry, that was in reference to the trans, so if I keep the same one with the proper flex plate/converter, I should be ok? I have never driven this truck, only trailered it home. Is the full time 4wd that bad?
Last edited by furious; 04/06/18 10:36 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: jerseybud]
#2478503
04/06/18 09:43 PM
04/06/18 09:43 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615 Table Rock Lake Missouri
furious
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,615
Table Rock Lake Missouri
|
Yes, hit or miss whether it was lock-up. Balance is uniqur to 5.9 magnum if I understand, so you need the flexplate/balancer for your year engine. To make it more complicated, sometime during the engine run from 1993-2003, they stopped putting weights on the flexplate and put them on the convertor (or vice versa, it gets confusing). Bottom line is get everything you can with your donor engine and know what year it is thanks! That is exactly the reason on all of my builds to date I have gone with an internally balanced engine and never a 360 as they are all externally balanced from Mother Mopar. I just have to do this! The 360 makes so much sense.
Last edited by furious; 04/07/18 08:46 AM.
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2478727
04/07/18 09:34 AM
04/07/18 09:34 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899 ohio
ruderunner
master
|
master
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 5,899
ohio
|
Lots of people trash talk the NP203 case but other than weight it's not a bad unit. However it does only fit a couple transmission which in your case is not a problem.
What is more of a problem with the 70's full time trucks is the front wheel bearings. Trouble prone and a pain to work on. Swapping to 80-93 knuckles is the preferred method BUT, they are a different lug pattern so new wheels and rear shafts go along with the swap.
You don't have to change things just keep this in mind.
Angry white pureblood male
|
|
|
Re: Starting on my 79 W150, could use some advice, ideas, help
[Re: furious]
#2478746
04/07/18 10:18 AM
04/07/18 10:18 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 195 Coastal Maine
Mr onetwo
member
|
member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 195
Coastal Maine
|
If you change the wheel bearings(if bad) in a full time axle and grease them per IOM they will last forever.Check the slack in the chain of the 203...strong TC except for chain play.
Last edited by Mr onetwo; 04/07/18 10:20 AM.
|
|
|
|
|