Page 3 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#2379097 - 09/29/17 09:01 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
which one is this? Is this the one I want? (this is the one in the car)


Attachments
support.jpg




Edited by reno340 (09/29/17 09:03 PM)
Edit Reason: clarification
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2379266 - 09/30/17 10:17 AM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
Transman Offline
mopar

Registered: 03/27/11
Posts: 553
Loc: Michigan
For those of you with difficulty sorting out my post - my statement was " there were no changes in ring spacing on WIDE BUSHING PUMPS".

I didn't say there were no change between the narrow and wide pump supports.

As for assembling - I said not suggested. I have seen instances where a guy installed a narrow bushing in a wide bushing drum. It will assemble -

Op - if you are having an issue determining fluid level - get a drain pan under the trans under the dipstick tube area. Remove the bolts holding the tube in. Warm the trans up and run through the gears. Shut engine off and pull the tube out and let it drain until it stops. Reinstall the tube and qualify the stick.

That's ALL the fluid you need. You still have a leak you have issues requiring leak testing.

Top
#2379293 - 09/30/17 11:14 AM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
451Mopar Offline
master

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 4826
Loc: Aurora, Colorado
That photo is the early style pump. The question is you mentioned installing a different, later model, drum. With the later model drum you should have use the pump support from a later pump (or just a later pump assembly?) Also, you need to check the input shaft end play when changing out those parts. The fiber washer on the pump comes in various thicknesses to adjust the input shaft end play.

Top
#2379336 - 09/30/17 12:29 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: 451Mopar]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
That photo is the early style pump. The question is you mentioned installing a different, later model, drum. With the later model drum you should have use the pump support from a later pump (or just a later pump assembly?) Also, you need to check the input shaft end play when changing out those parts. The fiber washer on the pump comes in various thicknesses to adjust the input shaft end play.
what years are good?
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2379361 - 09/30/17 12:56 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
John_Kunkel Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18937
Loc: Rio Linda, CA

This continued dwelling on the vent isn't addressing the root problem. Either vent style will work fine with a properly configured and properly filled transmission.

Again, the FULL mark on the dipstick is about 1/4" above the ledge where the dipstick tube inserts into the case.
_________________________
I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one now.

Top
#2379373 - 09/30/17 01:06 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
RapidRobert Offline
Circle Track

Registered: 11/20/03
Posts: 33004
Loc: Lincoln Nebraska
Quote:
Again, the FULL mark on the dipstick is about 1/4" above the ledge where the dipstick tube inserts into the case.
John is that the same for a 904?
_________________________
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Top
#2379386 - 09/30/17 01:26 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
451Mopar Offline
master

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 4826
Loc: Aurora, Colorado
I'm just trying to figure if changing the drum may have a part in the problem. Maybe excess fluid is blowing out around the drum sealing rings and coming out of the vent?
Really too many unknowns, need to just get in there and check everything.

Top
#2379662 - 09/30/17 10:11 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
Originally Posted By John_Kunkel

This continued dwelling on the vent isn't addressing the root problem. Either vent style will work fine with a properly configured and properly filled transmission.

Again, the FULL mark on the dipstick is about 1/4" above the ledge where the dipstick tube inserts into the case.


Trust me John, I am not ignoring your solution. Your reputation is simply unchallenged in these things. I really don't think the vent has anything to do with it either. After all, there were plenty of '66 and earlier transmissions that functioned well. I do know that one thing is that I have the wrong pump support for my application especially since I am using the later input shaft. I think the best thing to do is to address both of these issues as the possibility is that you two could both be right. We have two separate issues and they aren't necessarily mutually exclusive of each other.
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2379743 - 10/01/17 01:56 AM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
John_Kunkel Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18937
Loc: Rio Linda, CA
Originally Posted By reno340
I do know that one thing is that I have the wrong pump support for my application especially since I am using the later input shaft.


What year support? What year input shaft?

The input shaft is functionally the same for all '67-'77....this input won't fit in a '66-earlier support. If the '78-later input is used in the '67-'77 support there will be no forward gears.
_________________________
I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one now.

Top
#2380252 - 10/01/17 08:08 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
I will have to get back to you on that one
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2380356 - 10/01/17 10:55 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
Originally Posted By John_Kunkel
Originally Posted By reno340
I do know that one thing is that I have the wrong pump support for my application especially since I am using the later input shaft.


What year support? What year input shaft?

The input shaft is functionally the same for all '67-'77....this input won't fit in a '66-earlier support. If the '78-later input is used in the '67-'77 support there will be no forward gears.


Ok, I am getting confused. I do have the earlier style support. (narrow bushing) what years are they? I am assuming that the pump is a 66 since the tranny is. What shaft fits this? when I replaced the torn up front drum and input shaft. the yard sent me the new style input shaft with the 3 sealing rings, It did not fit the tranny due to the bushing in the back being wrong. They sent me another shaft that did fit and I put it in. the pic below is from a different website but it shows the one that did not fit. The thing in the center is almost like a funny shaped washer


Attachments
rearclutch3.JPG




Edited by reno340 (10/01/17 10:57 PM)
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2380372 - 10/01/17 11:18 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
the one they sent that did not work also had 3 sealing rings like the one on the left. not sure what the one they gave me had. are all of the pumps interchangeable?


Attachments
inputshaftcompare.jpg




Edited by reno340 (10/01/17 11:20 PM)
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2380656 - 10/02/17 01:52 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
John_Kunkel Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18937
Loc: Rio Linda, CA

The pump assembly is comprised of several parts, the part that has to be compatible with the input shaft is the "reaction shaft support" (the part that unbolts from the main pump housing). The supports functionally* interchange from '62-'66 and '67-'77. '78 was the first year for the 3-tab thrust washer and the 3rd ring on the rear piston retainer; as you discovered, these won't fit earlier units.


* I say "functionally" because there was a change to the lube circuit in '74 but interchanging parts with earlier has little negative effect.
_________________________
I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one now.

Top
#2382198 - 10/04/17 10:39 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: John_Kunkel]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
Originally Posted By John_Kunkel

The pump assembly is comprised of several parts, the part that has to be compatible with the input shaft is the "reaction shaft support" (the part that unbolts from the main pump housing). The supports functionally* interchange from '62-'66 and '67-'77. '78 was the first year for the 3-tab thrust washer and the 3rd ring on the rear piston retainer; as you discovered, these won't fit earlier units.


* I say "functionally" because there was a change to the lube circuit in '74 but interchanging parts with earlier has little negative effect.


Sorry it took so long to get back to you John. It took me a while to pull the tranny and take it apart. The input shaft seems to be from '67-'77 as I have only 2 sealing rings. I am assuming that the stator support needs to be the same. here are some pics


Attachments
pump5 (1024x768).jpg

pump8.jpg

pump1.jpg

pump6.jpg


_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2382459 - 10/05/17 01:04 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
John_Kunkel Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18937
Loc: Rio Linda, CA
You've got a mismatch of parts, the support is for a narrow bushing and the drum is a '71-later wide bushing drum that somebody has installed the bushing shallow.

Belleville spring in the rear clutch is '74-later.
_________________________
I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one now.

Top
#2382839 - 10/06/17 02:01 AM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
If I get the correct stator support complete with the pump assembly for 71-77, will it work correctly with my case?
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2382920 - 10/06/17 10:26 AM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
JohnRR Offline
I Win

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 73475
Loc: U.S.S.A.
Originally Posted By reno340
If I get the correct stator support complete with the pump assembly for 71-77, will it work correctly with my case?


It should there isn't big changes in the case over those years.
_________________________
running up my post count some more .

Top
#2398867 - 11/05/17 12:02 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
reno340 Offline


Registered: 03/26/05
Posts: 386
Loc: Maryland
OK, I changed the stator, Pump bushing and seals, O rings and the washers. It still leaks. It is wet behind the torque converter clear to the top. I looked by using a camera and saw that it is all wet but that the vent is dry. Will the dye even work in this case? What dye is this and where can I get it?. Any other ideas?


Edited by reno340 (11/05/17 08:29 PM)
_________________________
"There are only three real sports, Mountain climbing, Bull Fighting and Auto Racing. The rest are just games"
- Earnest Hemmingway


If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xQJtN1_6DU

Top
#2398933 - 11/05/17 02:27 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
geo. Offline
member

Registered: 05/11/15
Posts: 102
Loc: n.c.
Originally Posted By reno340
Originally Posted By John_Kunkel

Be sure the dipstick is reading correctly and you're not overfilling it. The FULL mark on the dipstick should be about 1/4" above the ledge where the dipstick tube enters the case.
Is there a way that I can Measure this without pulling the dipstick tube? I hate to have to lose all of that fluid. (I have a deep aluminium pan) The dipstick and tube are an Allstar Performance 69120 dipstick and tube.


Something I've wondered about, with a deep pan can you run a slightly lower amount of fluid(on the stick) since your fluid pick-up is lower too?

Top
#2398937 - 11/05/17 02:39 PM Re: A-727 help [Re: reno340]
geo. Offline
member

Registered: 05/11/15
Posts: 102
Loc: n.c.
I haven't read your engine build-up.
Do you know if block was line bored or honed?
This will affect case alignment with the crank.
Might be worth checking.

Top
Page 3 of 4 < 1 2 3 4 >

Advertisement
Sponsored Link
Forum Stats
25,073 Registered Members
32 Forums
185,636 Topics
2,157,903 Posts

Most users ever online: 882 @ 03/05/17 10:15 PM
Moparts Newest Topics
Oldiron
by actionange
01/19/18 11:24 AM
Sure Grip 8 1/4 & 9 1/4 axles
by QuickDodge
01/19/18 11:05 AM
2 progs check for Meltdown or Spectre CPU security holes
by 360view
01/19/18 10:38 AM
Fiberglass parts.
by mills.mopar
01/19/18 10:35 AM