Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
#232896
02/22/09 05:29 PM
02/22/09 05:29 PM
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gtx6970
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I get asked every once in a while, just how much of a difference there is between the 2. To follow are a few comparisons of an NOS spark plug wire compared to a reproduction plug wire. 3rd quarter of 1969 . The nos wires box is dated 10-69 . I'll do a ohms resistance comparison on it tomorow afternoon, new versus new. I have an original Hemi plug wire set here , but really wanted to do a comparison of new versus new. In all the following pics NOS is on top and repop is the bottom one. Also shown is an nos single wire plug wire clip still attached on the wire.Click on the attachment to see a much larger picture.
Last edited by gtx6970; 02/22/09 05:30 PM.
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: gtx6970]
#232903
02/23/09 11:35 PM
02/23/09 11:35 PM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 12,129 Cleveland
sunroofgtx
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Bill, great pics. Looks like the repops are laser-jet printed. We have been looking into doin that. Right now, our 8.5's are painted on with a print wheel when manufactured. Nice pics. What are thos 135's ? #8 on a 440 ?
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: Dodge Don]
#232906
02/25/09 09:39 PM
02/25/09 09:39 PM
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1_WILD_RT
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Quote:
Out of curiousity, does anyone make modern style high performance plug wires that are made to look like classic factory correct wires?
Thats exactly what Scott in the post above yours is prodding Rick about...
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: mccannix]
#232913
02/26/09 01:50 PM
02/26/09 01:50 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,901 New Jersey Bada Bing
bremotorsports
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Terry, There is no going east-to-west today: One of the Ice Road Truckers went through the ice and blocked the road! Bill Rolik
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: RT_6_PakShaker]
#232914
02/26/09 05:04 PM
02/26/09 05:04 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,405 It's a dry heat
gtx6970
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Quote:
Bill How about posting a few pics of the distributor cap boots, both the 90* and 180*?
Bruce the NOS wire I have is a service replacement. It does have the dist end boot in the bag . I don't remember if it has a 90 or 180 boot. But it's just 1 single wire in the box. But it's designed to cut the wire where needed and install the boot. anyway I'll take a pic tonight.
I've heard of some cars with white lettering on the coil wire but this is the first i've heard of anything newer than 1967 with white.
I've asked to have a run done in white , and even if I took the entire run, not gonna happen.
I've heard rumors of someone else stepping up and doing wires in all 4 quarters but thats all I have is rumors at this time
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduc
[Re: Paul Jacobs]
#232928
02/27/09 10:04 AM
02/27/09 10:04 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,978 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
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Quote:
The parting lines on the red end of orig versus repos also runs in opposite directions. The repo ends have writing on them where origs usually dont. There are more details too, like wires being inserted into the wire and bent over before theyre crimped etc. Once you really know the fine details you can tell the differences in 5 seconds.
I haven't judged in quite a few years but are the judges now pulling plug wires and pulling off the boots during OEM judging ?
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: RT_6_PakShaker]
#232930
02/27/09 10:34 PM
02/27/09 10:34 PM
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Dist cap 90* repro on the left NOS on right notice the 2Q-70 on the NOS one.
so paul, why cant the reproduction guys get the details correct if they are taking it off an original set? it seems that the boots aren't even close to looking correct. why cant they make them look correct if the patterns are there to reproduce?
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
#232931
02/27/09 11:38 PM
02/27/09 11:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
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1_WILD_RT
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Quote:
Quote:
Dist cap 90* repro on the left NOS on right notice the 2Q-70 on the NOS one.
so paul, why cant the reproduction guys get the details correct if they are taking it off an original set? it seems that the boots aren't even close to looking correct. why cant they make them look correct if the patterns are there to reproduce?
Likely because they cut costs by finding a currently avaliable boot style that is close enough for all but the most detail oriented restorer...
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#232932
02/28/09 09:34 AM
02/28/09 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Dist cap 90* repro on the left NOS on right notice the 2Q-70 on the NOS one.
so paul, why cant the reproduction guys get the details correct if they are taking it off an original set? it seems that the boots aren't even close to looking correct. why cant they make them look correct if the patterns are there to reproduce?
Likely because they cut costs by finding a currently avaliable boot style that is close enough for all but the most detail oriented restorer...
to me it just just make any sense going that ar into the designing of the repro wires with logos and wire color only to come up short with boots that are totally wrong.the angles and shapes are completely wrong. they sell for top dollar and cant get it right. its mind boggling.
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: gtx6970]
#232934
02/28/09 01:00 PM
02/28/09 01:00 PM
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Reproductions are designed to fill a market void. And this is just MY opinion . But in my mind there will be - has to be something to differentiate the originals from reproductions. ( keep sellers honest imo) 2nd - With any reproduction there will be concessions made in regards to some of the smaller details. Think of the costs involved to either tool up for every single piece, or use currently avail smaller pieces. Lets be honest how many here would pay twice( maybe more, maybe less) the price to get an exact duplicate of an original set?
I'm happy with a nice set that looks the part within 90%. Personally,my cars are not garage art/trailer queens. Mine will be driven. So I'm not one of the crowd that needs $400 nos plug wires
Bill, in due respect,and not bashing-i dont buy that one bit. are you telling me to duplicate the plug and distributor boots will double the price of those wires, i dont think so, maybe add $20.00 to the set if that. why take the trouble of reproducing a part only to get it half right. just doesnt make sense. why are the battery cables and shaker bubble brackets,idle solenoids, wire harnesses, etc.so meticulously detailed correct. Dave at ECS goes the extra mile in order to make the correct decals, why cant the spark plug wire vender make is correct. you see almost every restored car out there with these wires on their cars, so its definitely not a quantity needed issue.
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
#232936
02/28/09 02:58 PM
02/28/09 02:58 PM
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Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?
1_WILD_RT
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Quote:
Quote:
Reproductions are designed to fill a market void. And this is just MY opinion . But in my mind there will be - has to be something to differentiate the originals from reproductions. ( keep sellers honest imo) 2nd - With any reproduction there will be concessions made in regards to some of the smaller details. Think of the costs involved to either tool up for every single piece, or use currently avail smaller pieces. Lets be honest how many here would pay twice( maybe more, maybe less) the price to get an exact duplicate of an original set?
I'm happy with a nice set that looks the part within 90%. Personally,my cars are not garage art/trailer queens. Mine will be driven. So I'm not one of the crowd that needs $400 nos plug wires
Bill, in due respect,and not bashing-i dont buy that one bit. are you telling me to duplicate the plug and distributor boots will double the price of those wires, i dont think so, maybe add $20.00 to the set if that. why take the trouble of reproducing a part only to get it half right. just doesnt make sense. why are the battery cables and shaker bubble brackets,idle solenoids, wire harnesses, etc.so meticulously detailed correct. Dave at ECS goes the extra mile in order to make the correct decals, why cant the spark plug wire vender make is correct. you see almost every restored car out there with these wires on their cars, so its definitely not a quantity needed issue.
Think about it this way...So far all they had to do was print logos on a black 7mm wire & install boots that look pretty close... If the exact boots were still being produced they probably would be using them... So to take care of this detail that few really care about they would need to have molds made & do short runs of straight,135 degree, 90 degree plug boots, straight & 90 degree dist. boots, plus red dist boots & coil boots... Costs would go up...At that point how many that would have bought the $100.00 resto wires don't want to pay the extra costs therebe limiting the marketability causing the price to rise to try to recover the costs never mind about making s profit...
There are lots of substandard repo parts that I feel should be done right....At least for me, this isn't one of them... Sheet metal, trim, interior, lots of stuff but plug wires I'd rather have better performing p-arts rather than more correct parts....
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#232937
02/28/09 03:34 PM
02/28/09 03:34 PM
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Anonymous
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i dont know about you but the 1st thing i look at in an engine bay is the correct air cleaner element and plug wires then i stsrt to look around like the wiper motor,coil markings and h bolts. im shocked a guy like roger gibson and frank badalson hasnt taken the wires to a new higher level of accuracy like they did on the battery wires. i think its a no brainer to make these correct. so you have to make a mold for 3 different angles for vthe boots. i dont see a real big problem there. i personally think FIRECORE could have the race cars,FAST and show cars all in his back pocket with a truly correct set of plug wires. with his quality wire and correct details it would be a homerun.
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
#232943
03/01/09 10:41 AM
03/01/09 10:41 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,322
sixbbl69
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Quote:
i dont know about you but the 1st thing i look at in an engine bay is the correct air cleaner element and plug wires then i stsrt to look around like the wiper motor,coil markings and h bolts. im shocked a guy like roger gibson and frank badalson hasnt taken the wires to a new higher level of accuracy like they did on the battery wires. i think its a no brainer to make these correct. so you have to make a mold for 3 different angles for vthe boots. i dont see a real big problem there. i personally think FIRECORE could have the race cars,FAST and show cars all in his back pocket with a truly correct set of plug wires. with his quality wire and correct details it would be a homerun.
I think the reason roger gibson and frank b don't get into this is the same reason they didn't get into the H-wheels. they know there is a market for this stuff but a very small market and they also know its not worth the effort or money to produce parts that only 10 guys like you would ever buy.they also know that 9 out of the 10 would be SHOCKED at the price and on moparts for 2 weeks like the Goodyear red line tires everyone just had to have. iam shocked that a guy like you with all your mopar knowledge and big money hasn't tooled up to produce all this stuff and corner the market?????????
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#232944
03/01/09 02:32 PM
03/01/09 02:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,163 NORTHERN VA
THESHAKERPROJECT
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Quote:
Regardless of the dia. the Firecore wires have a different sheen and overall look as compared to OEM wires, there's really no way you'd get them to look exact to OEMs regardles of boots or stampings. However, I'd still like to get some Firecores with the factory style stamping because even if not 100% correct, they'd look right to most onlookers keeping a generally correct the factory "look"
then you could have the stock/show looks AND better performance as well. Those Firecores are a great upgrade for Mopars and with the factory lettering they would be a home run !!
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Re: Dated plug wires- comparisons - NOS versus Reproduction
[Re: Paul Jacobs]
#232946
03/02/09 12:20 AM
03/02/09 12:20 AM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 12,129 Cleveland
sunroofgtx
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I believe GM was the first to have 8mm wires. In the late 70's , early 80's. Delco I think. I willmake a call tomorrow to see about this "permission slip" neededfor the stamping. A problem that happens with quality race core when building sets, is that when you strip and fold it for the brass terminals to be terminated, about half the time, the core breaks. Guys what, now your lengths are off. Its a piece of cake building the HEI sets. We use stainless dual crimps.We crimp on the core and insulate. Ours is on the left. It sometimes takes 2 hours to get a single set of FactoryFit 8mm wires finished. Thats with automated terminal machines. The race core does not like to be bent. This is why we push the racewire, 8.5mm so much. Its a more-friendly assembly process using the HEI type termianals. To get exact boots made, I believe the minimum count is 10k units, not including the set-up costs for the molds. Thanks for the kind words , guys. It's just nice to build a racewire in 8mm, that would pass as a stock wire to most onlookers. Its tough to get into the exact duplication market , with all of the date code possibilities and print types. If we got it exact, there will always be the people who swear its all wrong. Here is our 8mm. It may look all wrong to some, but customers love the way they fit, and some swear their engines love them too. New orange Max Wedge and Hemi wires. We make sets in either solid core or suppression in 7mm.
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