Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328471
06/29/17 08:43 AM
06/29/17 08:43 AM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696 jersey
Spaceman Spiff
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Posts: 3,696
jersey
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Why do you want to leave at 3000rpm? Stock cam? Headers? Your engine probably stops making power before 5,000 rpm, a 3,000 isn't going to help, especially with 3.55 gears and a 318. What's your MPH? That will help determine how much power you are making.
526 cubes of angry wedge, pushbutton shifted, 9 passenger killer!
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328490
06/29/17 10:34 AM
06/29/17 10:34 AM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,207 New York
polyspheric
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master
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New York
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“K” factor: RPM = K × (T^.5)
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Hemi ragtop]
#2328512
06/29/17 11:35 AM
06/29/17 11:35 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,081 Michigan
A727Tflite
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Michigan
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K factor is not specific to lockup or non-lockup. As for what factory k factors are - depends on application. Mopar diesel was 95 k from early 90's to 2007, then we went to 105, 115. Old converters in 727 were usually around 145. The new 8 speed is around 175. NAG has two different k's depending on engine. With your torque rating and if truly 250 k you should stall up to 6300+ - 250 k out of an eleven inch sounds pretty stout - what stall are you getting? As you go larger on a converter it's harder to get higher stall. Think large prop versus small on a boat. Larger usually is more efficient than smaller.
Last edited by Transman; 06/29/17 11:48 AM.
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328540
06/29/17 12:43 PM
06/29/17 12:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,504 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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I Live Here
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Old school shoot from the hip analysis.......
-318 with j heads...... Unless a bunch of milling was done, it lost some compression, and now has bigger runners with lower port velocity in the rpm range where the stall is happening. (Depending on what vintage the short block is/which pistons it has, it could easily end up under 8:1cr.)
-750 carb...... Way too big for this application
-cam??
More than likely it would take a tight 10" to be able to get a true 3000rpm flash stall behind that motor....... And even that converter might require a few tweaks to the motor before seeing all of 3000.
Then the question becomes...... Is a 3000 stall converter what that motor combo really needs?
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328697
06/29/17 04:32 PM
06/29/17 04:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,504 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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Using the Moroso calculator, 89mph in 1/4 is 18.5 lbs/hp.
So, 189hp @3500lbs.
A 318 can easily make over 250hp, so even if the car combo is far enough off to use up 10% of the available power, that would still put you at 225hp, as it sits in the car. That would show about 94mph at 3500lbs. These numbers will vary depending where you're racing at, obviously.
Perhaps addressing the apparent low-ish power output might help make the converter act more like you want it to.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328837
06/29/17 10:06 PM
06/29/17 10:06 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,207 New York
polyspheric
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New York
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why is car faster than when I had a 600 eddy carb
Fuel curve closer to what the engine wanted, very common. 750 was less wrong than 600.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Hemi ragtop]
#2328852
06/29/17 10:36 PM
06/29/17 10:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247 Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366
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I Live Here
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Sorry, I am not a math guru, explain K factor equasion? yeah me too, I sucked at algebra.
Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
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Re: Torque Converter Questions.
[Re: Crabra]
#2328880
06/29/17 11:13 PM
06/29/17 11:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,166 Plymouth, MI
Blusmbl
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Plymouth, MI
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This is a nice simplified description: http://kennedysdynotune.com/torque-converter-tech-tips-selection/Labeling a converter as having a specific stall without reference to the motor it is behind is misleading and naive. That stock converter, which stalls at ~1,500rpm behind a stock motor, might stall at 3,000rpm or more behind a blown big block, if it didn’t blow up first! To elaborate a bit: stall speed is not just a function of the converter. It is also a function of engine torque. This can be relatively easily described by defining the “K” factor. K is simply the constant in the equation K = rpm/sqrt{torque}. The equation describes the observed behavior of the converter behind a specific engine. What this allows us to do is determine what the stall speed of a given converter will be if we put it behind a different engine.
For example, if a motor has 400 ft-lbs. of torque and stalls a particular converter at 3,000rpm, K = 3,000/sqrt{400} = 150. Since we know K = 150, we can predict the new stall speed if torque is increased to say 500 ft-lbs by rearranging the equation to rpm = K*sqrt{torque}. In this case, the new stall would be rpm = 150*sqrt{500} = 3350. This formula isn’t perfect. It won’t work if the engines have wildly different torque curve, for example. And it won’t tell if a particular converter will hold together under markedly increased torque. But it gives a decent ballpark estimate and serves to illustrate a basic aspect of torque converter function. For most street and street/strip, you probably want a stall in the 2,500-3,500rpm range. But do not buy an off the shelf converter thinking it will give you the advertised stall unless it has been proven to do so on an identical setup. Speak to the manufacturer first to be sure you are getting what you need for your particular combo.
'18 Ford Raptor, random motorcycles, 1968 Plymouth Fury III - 11.37 @ 118
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