Todd Marsh is doing a lot with the bigblock versions of these heads. It is important to understand that the ProMaxx and the Sidewinder bigblock heads come out of the same molds in the same factory. They are given names by whoever is selling them. http://www.mopartsracing.com/tmc/ Possibly the same for smallblock heads.
The "I have heard" monster is lurking in this thread. The newest version of ProComp also known as Speedmaster heads has received good reviews from Pittburghracer and the guy who used to call himself Dr. J, Bryce Mulvey. Possibly working with Bryce the PCheads have more meat in the short turn so the short turn radius can be worked on more without hitting water. I suspect that is what the heads pictured above are.
R.
Last edited by dogdays; 05/16/1705:01 PM.
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: dogdays]
#2305588 05/16/1705:46 PM05/16/1705:46 PM
Todd Marsh is doing a lot with the bigblock versions of these heads. It is important to understand that the ProMaxx and the Sidewinder bigblock heads come out of the same molds in the same factory. They are given names by whoever is selling them. http://www.mopartsracing.com/tmc/ Possibly the same for smallblock heads.
The "I have heard" monster is lurking in this thread. The newest version of ProComp also known as Speedmaster heads has received good reviews from Pittburghracer and the guy who used to call himself Dr. J, Bryce Mulvey. Possibly working with Bryce the PCheads have more meat in the short turn so the short turn radius can be worked on more without hitting water. I suspect that is what the heads pictured above are.
R.
Whoa whoa WHOA. I never gave Procomp or Speedmaster good reviews. I never even had a set in my hands (and NEVER will) ProMAXX yes I have in in my hands and on my Flowbench and from what I've seen, I LIKE. They are 10 times nicer than Edelbrock heads and after talking to Mark at ProMaxx I would buy a set tomorrow over an Edelbrock heads if I needed a set. But I don't. I will never buy a procomp now called Speedmaster head. I would continue to FIX Edelbrock heads if it came to that. I can do them in my sleep. LOL
I am not recommending a type/brand/model of head, just recommending upgrading the materials/quality of the seats and valves. It depends on what your boost and temps will be. The heads you are looking at might be OK for 7 lbs of boost, but how will you know? What happens if you drop a valve seat or burn a valve. I'm saying your application may be beyond what the machining and components of the heads are designed for (regardless of price.)
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: 451Mopar]
#2305636 05/16/1707:12 PM05/16/1707:12 PM
I am not recommending a type/brand/model of head, just recommending upgrading the materials/quality of the seats and valves. It depends on what your boost and temps will be. The heads you are looking at might be OK for 7 lbs of boost, but how will you know? What happens if you drop a valve seat or burn a valve. I'm saying your application may be beyond what the machining and components of the heads are designed for (regardless of price.)
Here is what I'm doing. Building a P600B (675hp max potential) blown sb just because I have the short block parts already.
After watching the latest RoadKill garage episode I was convinced to get the best heads I could afford.
This engine will go in my 71ply B body to start. Later I will put it in my daily driver 73 Dart swinger.
My heart would really like to be building my BB 431/451 Stroker as I know it has a stronger bottom end than the sb.
I think my biggest hurdle will be a trans that can handle the power without breaking the bank.
Kinda stinks I can buy a used Lsx and 4L80e for $1500ish with accessories and not have to worry about any of this. 900hp potential easy. Drop in, tune, and go.
Last edited by prochargedmopar; 05/17/1705:03 AM.
"Old" member Registered: Sep 2001 Lost my credentials, I'm Back!! LOL 71 Ply Satellite Procharged 73 Dodge Dart Swinger 73 Ford F-100 390/Sniper efi/back to carb 01 Town and Country Limited 08 Dodge 2500 6.7 5" Deleted 02 Mercedes C230K 19 Camry
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: Prochargedmopar]
#2305649 05/16/1707:54 PM05/16/1707:54 PM
I hope it is not a cast crank engine. My neighbor (about 2 blocks from my house) has/had a 360 stroker with a 6-71 blower that broke the cast stroker crank and destroyed the 360 block. New engine has a forged crank, and a custom crank pulley support? Not exactly what the term would be for the support, but it has a bracket that connects to the front of the block and has a bearing in front of the crank pulley to support the front crank/pulley assembly. It's a cool piece.
I haven't built a boosted engine, but was thinking of doing the 6.1L Hemi and was reading about the valve seats falling out? And after I broke the intake valve on the B1-B/S heads, I replaced them with Manley Severe Duty valves which can also take higher temperatures than standard stainless valves.
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: Prochargedmopar]
#2305734 05/16/1710:10 PM05/16/1710:10 PM
I wouldn't worry about a cast 360 crank at 675hp... mine has a cast crank in it (has never even been turned) and makes somewhere in the 850hp range.
Obviously there is some difference between the blower and the turbo... but if mine will make 850hp, your's can make 675hp.
If you're talking 100% stock short block... you'd be pushing it REAL hard to go to 675hp. I'd say 500~550hp on cast pistons with a good tune is about the limit (we're just about finished with a 100% stock magnum 318 with a 69mm turbo going in a Demon... so we'll see).
If you're talking about main studs, rod bolts, and forged pistons... you should be able to make 675hp as long as the tuneup is good, and you have the proper fuel for the boost numbers you're talking about.
Mine with a stock 1/2 filled block, stock crank, main studs, ARP rod bolts, and off the shelf forged pistons made over 700hp. That was the point I put good rods and better pistons in it.
My guess is you'd be able to max that blower with a good intercooler and good fuel before it ever broke the block. Especially if it's partial filled.
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: dizuster]
#2305891 05/17/1704:15 AM05/17/1704:15 AM
I wouldn't worry about a cast 360 crank at 675hp... mine has a cast crank in it (has never even been turned) and makes somewhere in the 850hp range.
Obviously there is some difference between the blower and the turbo... but if mine will make 850hp, your's can make 675hp.
If you're talking 100% stock short block... you'd be pushing it REAL hard to go to 675hp. I'd say 500~550hp on cast pistons with a good tune is about the limit (we're just about finished with a 100% stock magnum 318 with a 69mm turbo going in a Demon... so we'll see).
If you're talking about main studs, rod bolts, and forged pistons... you should be able to make 675hp as long as the tuneup is good, and you have the proper fuel for the boost numbers you're talking about.
Mine with a stock 1/2 filled block, stock crank, main studs, ARP rod bolts, and off the shelf forged pistons made over 700hp. That was the point I put good rods and better pistons in it.
My guess is you'd be able to max that blower with a good intercooler and good fuel before it ever broke the block. Especially if it's partial filled.
Wow, great news from the voice of experience. Always somebody busting through the glass ceiling.
I was looking into partial filling my block 15yrs ago before I took a hiatus from muscle cars.
So you are saying filling is much more important than a girdle as long as studs are used?
As stated earlier I do have diamond forged pistons, the cheezy version of eagle rods, ARP main studs were acquired recently, etc. Bought this stuff over a decade ago.
Going to take my CAST crank to get it turned down to 2.1 rod throws and .010 off the mains to clean it up.
I'm head hunting now. Having trouble deciding on the 171cc or 185-190cc heads. Going back and forth.
I know for a fact I will buy the victor equivalents when I build my BB. 265cc range. Got a forged crank for it already and chevy rods are cheap. Biggest durability expense will be the pistons I"d suppose.
Last edited by prochargedmopar; 05/17/1704:19 AM.
"Old" member Registered: Sep 2001 Lost my credentials, I'm Back!! LOL 71 Ply Satellite Procharged 73 Dodge Dart Swinger 73 Ford F-100 390/Sniper efi/back to carb 01 Town and Country Limited 08 Dodge 2500 6.7 5" Deleted 02 Mercedes C230K 19 Camry
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: Prochargedmopar]
#2305971 05/17/1711:36 AM05/17/1711:36 AM
Personally I'd pass on a cast crank. Even our low powered iron head 360 combo developed cracks in the factory cast piece. Glad we caught it. Forged piece in it now.
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: Prochargedmopar]
#2305982 05/17/1711:45 AM05/17/1711:45 AM
Whoa whoa WHOA. I never gave Procomp or Speedmaster good reviews. I never even had a set in my hands (and NEVER will) ProMAXX yes I have in in my hands and on my Flowbench and from what I've seen, I LIKE. They are 10 times nicer than Edelbrock heads and after talking to Mark at ProMaxx I would buy a set tomorrow over an Edelbrock heads if I needed a set. But I don't. I will never buy a procomp now called Speedmaster head. I would continue to FIX Edelbrock heads if it came to that. I can do them in my sleep. LOL
Ha, Never say never. What's your address?
Last edited by prochargedmopar; 05/17/1701:22 PM.
"Old" member Registered: Sep 2001 Lost my credentials, I'm Back!! LOL 71 Ply Satellite Procharged 73 Dodge Dart Swinger 73 Ford F-100 390/Sniper efi/back to carb 01 Town and Country Limited 08 Dodge 2500 6.7 5" Deleted 02 Mercedes C230K 19 Camry
Re: Chinese head choice for Blown/Turbo Smallblock
[Re: Prochargedmopar]
#2306043 05/17/1701:25 PM05/17/1701:25 PM
Whoa whoa WHOA. I never gave Procomp or Speedmaster good reviews. I never even had a set in my hands (and NEVER will) ProMAXX yes I have in in my hands and on my Flowbench and from what I've seen, I LIKE. They are 10 times nicer than Edelbrock heads and after talking to Mark at ProMaxx I would buy a set tomorrow over an Edelbrock heads if I needed a set. But I don't. I will never buy a procomp now called Speedmaster head. I would continue to FIX Edelbrock heads if it came to that. I can do them in my sleep. LOL
My apologies to Pittsburgracer. I am going to have to look back to see how I could have come to that mistaken conclusion.
R.
No big deal but I've heard some horror stories about ProCOMP, (Speedmaster) and wouldn't take the risk. Doctor J or whatever his name was has disappeared. lol
My point was that higher CFM isn't a reliable indicator of superior boosted flow. The infamous 2JZ-GTE Supra factory twin turbo head needs no mods, not even a valve job, to produce 700 hp from 183" on high boost. The extremely similar (by flow and mean cross-sectional area) RB26, 7M, etc. are down by hundreds of hp under the same conditions. Why is the GTE head so superior? Toyota doesn't know, the port locations were compromised to allow larger water jackets (the N/A GE head has better ports, but only NA). It was an accident.
