Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: ZIPPY]
#2297891
05/02/17 07:44 PM
05/02/17 07:44 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
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Basically a 451 is a 440 in a slightly smaller package. As Mopar used such heavy parts, the first popular 451s, which were made with aftermarket lighter parts, revved quicker and felt stronger than the equivalent displacement mostly stock 440s.
One important thing to remember is cost. Way back when, people were just about giving 400 blocks away. I could have bought dozens of brand new 400 shortblocks in the crate for $400 or less, and used 400s were a $100 block. So when 451boy (AndyF) showed us how to use those cheap blocks, it didn't take long to catch on. And that happened just about the same time as the cheap parts started coming in from China. It was synchronicity. The only thing missing was cheap heads. That's when 440Source bit the financial bullet and developed the Stealth head. They also talked about a block, but like so many other people have found out, blocks are much harder to cast than heads. So they wisely dropped the block idea, which probably saved the company.
R.
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2297906
05/02/17 08:15 PM
05/02/17 08:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,928 Akron, Ohio
ProSport
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,928
Akron, Ohio
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One of my old cars was a '73 DartSport, #3050#. Low deck 451, Eddy heads CNC ported, 590 purpleshaft, M1 TR with two 750 Quickfuel carbs. 727 with 8" ATI converter, 4.56 gears, 14x32 tires. 9.89 at 136 best. Sixty foot was a 1.36 footbraking. Very fun pump gas combo that's been beat on for years.
1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: ProSport]
#2297912
05/02/17 08:28 PM
05/02/17 08:28 PM
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,449 nc
earthmover
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,449
nc
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[img]http://i1123.photobucket.com/albums...fkg9x.mp4[/img] Sounds great zippy.. Low deck 451 eagle assembly je dome tops.bullet soils roller 724int. 709ex. Indy intake Ron's toilet injection 727 8 inch 5500 verta 9inch ford with Moser 456 aluminium bolt thru rear ..2x4 squared chassis strut front ladder bar rear glass front end doors deck lid and back bumper all aluminium interior full 7.50 cage...just seeing what most have done or been with the little motor..ohh -1 heads td 1.6 rockers 2.25 custom headers pecan windows
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298004
05/02/17 11:38 PM
05/02/17 11:38 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570 UK
rb446
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
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Koffel 451 motors ran 10.0's over here in the early 80's (same as the later "Rossi" car), in your average for then 3000lb+ race cars and cost approx £5000. Think they were .043" top ring motors with mega ported 452's, .750 rollers, big CR. Most got the s*it blown out of them as their owners put N20 at them, rather a silly/expensive move!!
Last edited by rb446; 05/02/17 11:45 PM.
1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990 1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298093
05/03/17 02:10 AM
05/03/17 02:10 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
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Mines not real fast, but I think it runs pretty good for what it is though. It's a low-deck, low-budget 451 combo at .040 over, so 452 cubes. At the time I built it, I was on a shoestring budget; built the whole thing on side work I found for around $5000 total. Found a 400 long block a guy had pulled out of a pickup and let go of of for $75. It's a 230 casting but not the thick web variety. I used a 413 crank I bought for $50, found both locally on Craigslist. Had the crank magged and turned to fit. Block had to go to .040 to clean up, and I had it line honed with ARP studs. Pistons are Iconn flat tops with 5cc reliefs, fitted with Mahle plasma-moly rings. Rods are CAT H-beam (spare me the flaming, it's a budget motor) I had them looked at by my machinist and he said they were good to go. It balanced up with a bobweight of 2314. Its pump gas friendly at 10.5:1, and uses an Engle solid flat tappet cam spec'd by Moparts member Jeff Patterson. It's street friendly at only 252 degrees at .050 on a 109 cl. Square pattern at .573 lift with ProComp 1.5 steel roller tip rockers. Heads are OTB stealths with only springs & retainers swapped out. Intake is an Eddy RPM dual plane, and after 6 years with an old 2nd hand 830, it now breaths through a new annular 1000 HP & exits gasses via Hooker Comp 1-7/8" headers swith 3" cutouts that I open at the track.
Car is a full weight all steel & stock glass, 67 Satellite with every single thing that it came with from the factory in tact and working properly. I weighed it once with the original 383 in it and it was an even 3600 lbs; 3770 with me in it. Since then I think I've shed a few lbs by way of wheels, aluminum water pump & housing, alum heads. I'd guess it at about 3675 with me in it today.
The first weekend I had the car out, I think it went a best of 12.40. Since then, I've managed to whittle nearly a full second off the time slip with only suspension, chassis, & tranny work. Nothing except head gaskets has changed under the hood since the motor was assembled 7 years ago now, with the exception of the carb I mentioned earlier, and I haven't even begun to play withthat yet, it's exactly as it came from Holley. I think I've got it to where I'm making pretty good use of the power it's making. Last time out the car went 11.54 at 114.9, [edit: this past weekend it went 11.50 @115.3] and has 60'd in 1.581. Slow by race car standards, but then it's not a racecar. Although it's become a pretty decent bracket ride and I plan to race it quite a bit this year.
I jump in it and run to the store Every chance I get, hit some local cruise ins, and I took it on the NW drag tour in '15 logging around 400 freeway miles in 3 days with no mechanical issues.
Future plans are to send the heads out to Modern for a CNC port job and good valve-job. Of course the car will need a bar installed if I go any faster..... so there is that......
Much thanks to all the help from some pretty smart guys here at Moparts over the years!
Last edited by StealthWedge67; 05/07/17 03:25 PM.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298121
05/03/17 03:37 AM
05/03/17 03:37 AM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar
master
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master
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
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Early 1990's build with Muscle Motors turned down 440 crank, 440 rods, ROSS dished piston, and Koffels B1-B/S heads (Unported) using Mopar M1 4150 single plane intake. Used a mild Ultradyne solid street roller 251/251 @ 0.050" duration, and I think about 0.600" lift?
In the 4,150 lb Charger set for street driving, and at Bandimere Speedway (DA usually way over 7,000 ft) would run consistent 12.5 @ 110 MPH. Took it to Las Vegas, and off the trailer, no tuning, went 11.8s @ 115+
This was with 3.91:1 gear, 3,500 stall converter, 10.5"x27" M/T Street ET tires.
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298257
05/03/17 01:07 PM
05/03/17 01:07 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,578
KOS
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,578
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As the title say let's here your 451 Car weight Time Parts 68 charger 3840lbs 10.9s with only 2 times at the track (primarily a crusier) stock crank,rods,comp 286xr,eddy rpm heads ported,eddy rpm dual plane ported,850ootb,1 7/8 hookers,727 4900stall,dana 60 4.10s
Last edited by KOS; 05/03/17 01:08 PM.
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298657
05/04/17 01:34 AM
05/04/17 01:34 AM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 259 Scatchamatoon
Saskabusa
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 259
Scatchamatoon
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As the title say let's here your 451 Car weight Time Parts 451 500hp/500tq Turned down 440 crank eagle rods compression 10 to 1 Crane roller cam holley street dominator Stealth heads exhaust manifolds It was built to look stock ad go in my 74 Roadrunner. Plans changed and it wound up in my 67 Charger. 3900 pounds race ready Only made two runs lat year 12.1@112 or so. I put some headers on it for this season so it should get into the 11's runs on pump gas and no drama. it is a nice change
Last edited by Saskabusa; 06/15/18 01:29 PM.
1974 Roadrunner
1967 Charger
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: Saskabusa]
#2298689
05/04/17 02:39 AM
05/04/17 02:39 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173
CT
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As the title say let's here your 451 Car weight Time Parts 451 500hp/500tq Turned down 440 crank eagle rods compression 10 to 1 Crane roller cam holley street dominator Stealth heads exhaust manifolds It was built to look stock ad go in my 74 Roadrunner. Plans changed and it wound up in my 67 Charger. 3800 pounds race ready Only made two runs lat year 12.1@112 or so. I put some headers on it for this season so it should get into the 11's runs on pump gas and no drama. it is a nice change Which roller cam?
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2298831
05/04/17 12:30 PM
05/04/17 12:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,531 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,531
So. Burlington, Vt.
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From about 20 years ago......it's a "452"(4.380 bore).
400 block, 440 crank cut down, BME rods, Ross domes(12.5cr), mild port std stage 6's(300cfm), UD roller, RB TG4500, 1150 carb, 2-1/8x4 headers. 650hp/565tq.
Went a best of 9.31 @143 in a 2700lb S/G Cuda.
RB 451 from a few years ago:
Ross domes(13:1), ported MW SR heads(340cfm), 440-3, 1050 carb, .650 comp roller, 2-2 1/8x4 headers...... 712hp/600tq.
Never got run in a car like that. Sold the top end, then sold the bottom end to a member here, put his ported rpm heads on it with a flat tappet cam, victor w/adapter 1050, made 650hp..... Has gone 10.0's @131 at 3470lbs.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2299236
05/04/17 10:59 PM
05/04/17 10:59 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 535 Ohio
racerAL
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 535
Ohio
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Mine surely isnt the fastest but it does pretty good for what it is. .055 over 440 stock stroke K1 Hbeam rods Arias piston (12.2-1) Crane .620 solid cam Crane gold roller rockers MP aluminum 452 heads (76 cc) unported Tick Flow Track Heat intake 950 cfm Holley E85 carb best 1/8 et is 6.72 best 1/4 et is 10.74
Last edited by racerAL; 05/04/17 11:02 PM.
-1967 Plymouth Satellite #3555 446 cid on E-85 best 1/4 et 10.577 @ 127.58 best 1/8 et 6.722 @ 100.68 best 60ft. 1.419
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2299605
05/05/17 04:42 PM
05/05/17 04:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 250 Iceland
BadMoonRacer
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 250
Iceland
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I like this info; especially the combos similar in description to mine. Gives me ideas about where I stand regarding my combo (see sig line). Thanks earthmover for starting this thread.
Ragnar in Iceland
66 Charger, 451, .582" lift, 11" conv. 4.10:1. 4118 lbs 11.75@117 mph on regular Firestone Firehawk radials. Icelandic Champion in MC 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2022.
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: BadMoonRacer]
#2299667
05/05/17 07:01 PM
05/05/17 07:01 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,031 ohio
67mprfan
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,031
ohio
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I like this info; especially the combos similar in description to mine. Gives me ideas about where I stand regarding my combo (see sig line). Thanks earthmover for starting this thread.
Ragnar in Iceland Yes it is a good thread my rb 451/452 is also in my sig
71 demon stock stroke 440/indy ez-1 running 10.10 @ 132.14 mph in the 1/4 and 6.36 @ 107.46 mph in the 1/8 not in the same weekend but It did it then I sold it. 67 Belvedere that worked it's way in the 10's
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Re: Let's here about those bad 451 .
[Re: earthmover]
#2299669
05/05/17 07:08 PM
05/05/17 07:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,492 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,492
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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Lenny Melton's Dart (8secDart) was an impressive runner. 451" low deck w/ 440-1 Indy heads, single dominator, cast Indy manifold, one stage of nitrous and 10" tires in a street legal '68 Dart. Ran 8.60s at over 3000 lbs.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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