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R5/P7+turbos=?????? #225931 02/15/09 05:00 PM 02/15/09 05:00 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA Devilbrad OP top fuel
Devilbrad OP top fuel Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA	OK, so I haven't posted much about my project. Its a 67 Dodge D100 getting all late model '96 C4 Corvette suspension (dont bash, it was way cheap, or I'd run Viper stuff!!). I plan on running a Viper 6 speed trans, but have yet to decide on an engine combo, but it will be turbocharged. I have a std bore 69 340 block and some Eddy Magnum heads, but I don't want to blow stuff up. So I have been considering a 48 degree, siamese R3/W head combo but I just cant ignore how "cheap" the R5/P7 stuff still is. Any thoughts on how much boost the R5/P7's can handle? I'm most concerned with head gasket sealing, not block strength. Do the R5 blocks have a good sealing surface compared to an 18 bolt R3? Perhaps an XR block would be a better choice? Thoughts or opinions? Ryan?

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Devilbrad] #225932 02/15/09 05:10 PM 02/15/09 05:10 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,091 Col. Ohio T The Avg. Valiant super stock
The Avg. Valiant super stock T Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,091 Col. Ohio	I heard those 6 speed trans were very hard to shift quickly. I know alot of the guys at the Viper nationals complained royally about how bad the tranny gates were.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: The Avg. Valiant] #225933 02/15/09 05:15 PM 02/15/09 05:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,090 north cakalaky I instigator super stock
instigator super stock I Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,090 north cakalaky	From what I have read you will have to spend gobs of $$$$ for all the custom pieces that are required for the r5/p7 combo..... The big question is how much power are you looking for.....standard r3 59 or 48 can make gobs of power when turbos are used. 65 Barracuda All aluminum Indy HEMI with some boost! COMING TO A TRACK NEAR YOU!

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Devilbrad] #225934 02/15/09 05:15 PM 02/15/09 05:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	Yeah the stuff is cheap, but how much power do you really need? Biggest disadvantage to a turbo R5 deal is the lack of deck, it's a "jug" style block with no deck. I just had my Coronet out again this afternoon & I'm not sure I'll ever own a car without a turbo again..... they're just brutal. If I had it to do over again I'd just do a tall deck R3, with big inches & ICH heads with a single turbo. Unless you're going heads up/class racing, you can make some pretty big power with a turbo ICH setup.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225935 02/15/09 05:22 PM 02/15/09 05:22 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA Devilbrad OP top fuel
Devilbrad OP top fuel Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA	Quote: Yeah the stuff is cheap, but how much power do you really need? Biggest disadvantage to a turbo R5 deal is the lack of deck, it's a "jug" style block with no deck. I just had my Coronet out again this afternoon & I'm not sure I'll ever own a car without a turbo again..... they're just brutal. If I had it to do over again I'd just do a tall deck R3, with big inches & ICH heads with a single turbo. Unless you're going heads up/class racing, you can make some pretty big power with a turbo ICH setup. Thanks Ryan, thats the info I was looking for. I was actually leaning towards some twin turbos for the "cool" factor. I also wouldnt mind bragging about 4 digit hp numbers, ha ha. Time to start searching for a 48 degree R3 block. Rendering of the truck.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Devilbrad] #225936 02/15/09 05:30 PM 02/15/09 05:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	a new 48* Tall R3 is as close as your nearest MP dealer.... 4.185" bore, R3 Callies 4.0" Crank..... 439 inches.... Will need good rods, ie. Oliver/Dyers/Carrillo etc I'd run a 6.20" Custom Pistons.... ~28 CC dish with a 68 CC INDY chamber would be ~9.5:1 Set of 230 CNC Oval INDY's Solid roller in the 256 @ .050" range, .650's lift on 114ish LSA. INDY manifold, blow though 950 C&S/ CSU/ Pro Systems Borg Warner S480 single 80 MM..... easy 1000+ HP & very driveable/mild.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225937 02/15/09 05:33 PM 02/15/09 05:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 12,419 Kalispell Mt. H HotRodDave I Live Here
HotRodDave I Live Here H Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 12,419 Kalispell Mt.	Ryan you had your set up dynoed yet? I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225938 02/15/09 05:34 PM 02/15/09 05:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA Devilbrad OP top fuel
Devilbrad OP top fuel Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA	I will have to start piecing this together, LOL I do plan on running EFI though. I will contact you Ryan when I am ready for a build. Right now my priority is getting the chassis done.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: HotRodDave] #225939 02/15/09 05:51 PM 02/15/09 05:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	Quote: Ryan you had your set up dynoed yet? No, the owner of the local chassis dyno does not want to run it for safety issues. I talked to him a few weeks ago & he said he just doesnt want to do anything that makes that kind of power anymore for fear of his safety standing there next to it. I'm probably going to take it to Kauffman motorsports later this spring to dyno it after it's painted.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225940 02/15/09 07:19 PM 02/15/09 07:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,697 Renton Wa T topfueldart master
topfueldart master T Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,697 Renton Wa	Ryan, How much power can you throw at an R3 block before your pushing its limits? Are there tall and short deck R3's? And whats the advantage to doing a 48* motor when your using CNC -2's? Im no expert on the 48-59 degree differences/benefits.... 11.48 @ 120 with a 1.80 60' 318, stock 1.88 heads, stock 904, Pump Gas, 13 lbs of boost. 9.94 @ 134, 318 on pump gas, 14 lbs w/ Eddies, transbrake 727, 3600 lbs, 3.54 gear and 28's.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: topfueldart] #225941 02/15/09 07:25 PM 02/15/09 07:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	Quote: Ryan, How much power can you throw at an R3 block before your pushing its limits? Are there tall and short deck R3's? And whats the advantage to doing a 48* motor when your using CNC -2's? Im no expert on the 48-59 degree differences/benefits.... With billet caps, the blocks should be unbreakable..... Yes there are short & tall decks. The one in my car is a short deck (9.0") Tall deck is 9.56".... Then there are 9.20" blocks. All short decks are Siamese..... Tall deck & 9.20's were/are available in both siamese & non. Only real advantage of 48* is ability to drop in roller lifters with no work to block, & then better pushrod geometry. Most people who build ICH motors use 59 blocks, I've done both.... there are advantages & disadvantages.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225942 02/15/09 09:02 PM 02/15/09 09:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,149 M McCandlessboy super stock
McCandlessboy super stock M Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,149	Once you own a twin turbo, you'll never want anything else. Although, I can't imagine having that type of power under an open bed.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: McCandlessboy] #225943 02/15/09 10:00 PM 02/15/09 10:00 PM
Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 1,325 Orlando Fl Dos Snails pro stock
Dos Snails pro stock Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 1,325 Orlando Fl	Well Ryan, You need to make some deck plates like they make for the open deck honda stuff. I thought about a turbo r5 block before I bought a R3 but was sacred of the open deck. The honda guys use a open deck with a turbo so it will work.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Dos Snails] #225944 02/16/09 09:44 AM 02/16/09 09:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	Quote: Well Ryan, You need to make some deck plates like they make for the open deck honda stuff. I thought about a turbo r5 block before I bought a R3 but was sacred of the open deck. The honda guys use a open deck with a turbo so it will work. AS I said, how much power do you really need? The 59* INDY stuff will support over 1000, the W8/9 stuff like I have will support ~1600+ with enough boost.... What are you really gaining by going to the P7 on a turbo app? Why make life complicated, build a simple LA based motor unless you are going for every single last HP for heads up etc, & in that case I still would'nt use an R5 based platform due to short deck.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225945 02/16/09 08:12 PM 02/16/09 08:12 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,145 Melbourne , Australia LA360 master
LA360 master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,145 Melbourne , Australia	Quote: Quote: Well Ryan, You need to make some deck plates like they make for the open deck honda stuff. I thought about a turbo r5 block before I bought a R3 but was sacred of the open deck. The honda guys use a open deck with a turbo so it will work. AS I said, how much power do you really need? The 59* INDY stuff will support over 1000, the W8/9 stuff like I have will support ~1600+ with enough boost.... What are you really gaining by going to the P7 on a turbo app? Why make life complicated, build a simple LA based motor unless you are going for every single last HP for heads up etc, & in that case I still would'nt use an R5 based platform due to short deck. What's the problem with the Short Deck???? AL.... Alan Jones

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: LA360] #225946 02/16/09 08:17 PM 02/16/09 08:17 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA Devilbrad OP top fuel
Devilbrad OP top fuel Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,489 Pacifica, CA	Quote: What's the problem with the Short Deck???? AL.... Too hard to build a big inch low compression setup for turbocharging I'll assume. Pins would be all up in the ring lands.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Devilbrad] #225947 02/17/09 08:31 AM 02/17/09 08:31 AM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 70 Finland mopar396 member
mopar396 member Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 70 Finland	Hi no turbos or R5/P7 but what do you think my engine what i am building?? R3 9.2" 48 degree W8 "lemans" heads Mopar billet crank 3.5" Carrillo 6.2" Ross racing 8.5:1 Steve Morris custom roller cam Procharger F3R C&S aerosol billet 900 tuned E-85 MOPAR OR NO CAR

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: Devilbrad] #225948 02/17/09 06:47 PM 02/17/09 06:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,145 Melbourne , Australia LA360 master
LA360 master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,145 Melbourne , Australia	Quote: Quote: What's the problem with the Short Deck???? AL.... Too hard to build a big inch low compression setup for turbocharging I'll assume. Pins would be all up in the ring lands. There has been no reference to an engine size, hence why I asked. If someone was looking at building a 400+ cube engine with Turbos I can understand the statement. If it was a 300-370 cube engine I would disagree. Boosted or not boosted, I'd want the shortest deck I could get away with. AL... Alan Jones

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: LA360] #225949 02/17/09 07:09 PM 02/17/09 07:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA RyanJ moparts member
RyanJ moparts member Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,547 State College, PA	Quote: Quote: Quote: What's the problem with the Short Deck???? AL.... Too hard to build a big inch low compression setup for turbocharging I'll assume. Pins would be all up in the ring lands. There has been no reference to an engine size, hence why I asked. If someone was looking at building a 400+ cube engine with Turbos I can understand the statement. If it was a 300-370 cube engine I would disagree. Boosted or not boosted, I'd want the shortest deck I could get away with. AL... My motor is 3.58" stroke, & with a 9.0 Deck & a small chamber on the head, that is all the stroke I could run to keep the CR low enough for turbo. Mine's 394 inches.. If I had it to do again I'd have done a tall deck with at least 440 inches, so the motor was more responsive/had better TQ off boost down low & would'nt have to turn as much RPM. But I already had a brand new 9" R3 so... that's what I built. That's why the large CC combustion chamber heads like an INDY have an advantage over something like my W9RP's with a 39 CC chamber... I could have ran hair more stroke if I had a bigger chamber even with the 9.0 deck.

Re: R5/P7+turbos=?????? [Re: RyanJ] #225950 02/17/09 08:08 PM 02/17/09 08:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,090 north cakalaky I instigator super stock
instigator super stock I Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,090 north cakalaky	So Ryan, how you like the feel of your new updated setup...been able to turn up the wick yet???? I'm finally getting my new heddars made up and hope to be up in about a month! 65 Barracuda All aluminum Indy HEMI with some boost! COMING TO A TRACK NEAR YOU!

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