Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2043656
04/01/16 04:54 PM
04/01/16 04:54 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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when is this necessary and can it be checked? what is the cost? There is 2 processes that can be done... boring and honing.. if you change caps or if you go to studs you should have it done.. if you just change to studs you may only need a honing... if going with new caps they will need to be fitted then bored and honed.. they can check the bores for alignment to see if you need it
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2043671
04/01/16 05:22 PM
04/01/16 05:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,213 New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,213
New York
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Don't do it unless you need it - a bad job is worse than none. If you do - you may need new timing setup for reduced C-C distance.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2043692
04/01/16 05:40 PM
04/01/16 05:40 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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I will say that I have put in studs and went cheap and didnt have it checked.. it did live just fine.. had a bit of wear on 1 or 2 of the main bearings... but if you are building a nice engine.. have it checked EDIT when I built my 405 W-9 I was told the mains were bored and honed.. I couldnt even turn the crank with the caps on.. found out later he didnt do the mains
Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 04/01/16 05:42 PM.
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2044073
04/02/16 12:37 AM
04/02/16 12:37 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,315 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,315
Bend,OR USA
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The only two ways I know of checking the main bore alignment involves using a long round straight(.0000 run out!) bar that is right at .0005 to .0008 smaller than the I.D. of the main caps torque down to the proper torque specs with the bar inside the main bores, if it turn your golden, if it doesn't turn you may have a problem Verify the I.D. of each main cap to make sure there within the factory specs on I.D. and out of round The other way is to install the main bearings and crankshaft to see if it turns easily with no main seal or run out on the crankshaft Do the basics and let us know what you find The neccessity comes when you suspect a problem, don't fix what ain't broke
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 04/02/16 12:39 AM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: Stanton]
#2044308
04/02/16 11:04 AM
04/02/16 11:04 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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My R3 block was bored from the factory.. new block.. and the crank wouldnt turn.. had to have it line bored and honed... same thing with my Mega block(new)
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: Stanton]
#2044547
04/02/16 04:59 PM
04/02/16 04:59 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,315 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,315
Bend,OR USA
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I've never had to have a stock block aligned honed to get the main bearing clearances correct when using a turned down(ground down) stock or race crankshaft, never I have had to use different main bearings brands and part numbers to get the clearances I wanted I do have all the blocks I use that have new main caps and main studs put on them aligned hone to get the main bores the size I want and straight
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2044581
04/02/16 05:39 PM
04/02/16 05:39 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506 Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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when is this necessary and can it be checked? what is the cost? One of the first checks you should make is during disassemble. How do the old bearings look ( wear pattern )? Next you want to check the crank for straightness ( V-blocks). All ok, Put the crank back in with the bearings you are going to use. Spin freely, you are good to go. Replacing bolts with studs usually don't warrant a line hone. Replacing caps, always. IMO, line honing or boring is often dune unnecessarily. Save yourself some $ and check it.
Fastest 300
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2044674
04/02/16 08:19 PM
04/02/16 08:19 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,914 Ontario, Canada
Stanton
Don't question me!
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Don't question me!
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,914
Ontario, Canada
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Replacing bolts with studs usually don't warrant a line hone. So I won't be having you build any of my motors!! 1) Stud torque is different than bolt torque 2) Bolts are installed with oil - studs with ARP lube or similar You sure as hell DO want to line hone if switching from bolts to studs !!!
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: Stanton]
#2044795
04/02/16 10:26 PM
04/02/16 10:26 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506 Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Replacing bolts with studs usually don't warrant a line hone. So I won't be having you build any of my motors!! 1) Stud torque is different than bolt torque 2) Bolts are installed with oil - studs with ARP lube or similar You sure as hell DO want to line hone if switching from bolts to studs !!! No problem there!! Check it both ways ( factory bolts and studs ) and see what the bearing clearance difference is.
Fastest 300
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2044918
04/03/16 12:13 AM
04/03/16 12:13 AM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,686 Stuttgart, Arkansas
rickseeman
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,686
Stuttgart, Arkansas
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when is this necessary and can it be checked? what is the cost? Line boring is not necessary unless you have changed something. Line honing is more often done. Usually when one or more of the bores is oversize. Cut the caps to reduce the size and hone it back to spec. It could be checked (if you really wanted to do such a thing) by going thru the motions as if you were going to line hone it (except not cut the caps) and just stroke it a few times to make sure it's straight (and to size). Now you know it's fine. Around $150
2011 Drag Pak Challenger
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: Crizila]
#2045228
04/03/16 12:55 PM
04/03/16 12:55 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506 Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Replacing bolts with studs usually don't warrant a line hone. So I won't be having you build any of my motors!! 1) Stud torque is different than bolt torque 2) Bolts are installed with oil - studs with ARP lube or similar You sure as hell DO want to line hone if switching from bolts to studs !!! No problem there!! Check it both ways ( factory bolts and studs ) and see what the bearing clearance difference is. BTW, the objective is to apply enough clamping force to keep the cap from walking in the saddle. If you apply enough clamping force to distort the cap ( change bearing clearance or bore alignment),that's too much clamping force - and that is not what studs are ment to do.
Fastest 300
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2045302
04/03/16 02:04 PM
04/03/16 02:04 PM
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crabman173
Unregistered
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crabman173
Unregistered
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Most common issue when using studs is that studs will touch inside of cap and prevent proper setting of #3 cap for correct end play--factory bolts 'hang' in the holes and don't touch cap--so..answer is just drill holes in #3 cap out a tad --do that and usually studs will do fine but..we ALWAYS brush through when using studs and make it just right. Boring is done when caps are changed-- Rollmaster and others offer sets that are .005 shorter when needed I agree when you have to bore one it can be tricky and cause all kinds of trouble if not done correctly-- It is also rare when bolts will not hold what you are doing--studs make folks feel better but are a PIA back at the seal holder, with the thrust issue , and really may make you sleep better but I can't prove they are any better or that they prevent anything! Timing errors that cause detonation is what makes caps 'walk" and no stud will prevent that or make it better IMO We do it because customers request it not because we think it is any better
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: can.al]
#2045319
04/03/16 02:13 PM
04/03/16 02:13 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 77 British Columbia Canada
Challenger340
member
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member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 77
British Columbia Canada
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Line BORING is not usually done or required, unless fitting a different set of main caps on a Block. Line HONING is commonly performed to adjust main bearing Clrc's or straighten or bring back main Bores "round", that have subjected to different clamp loads.... ie; changing from stock Bolts to Studs.
We Line Hone everything, just a matter of procedure,because everythibg is "off" the mains and we have to square the Block Decks as well as correct the Bores perpendicular to the mains. and NO... unless you are a dork cutting .010" off the main caps because you can't line hone properly, a shorter timing chain is NOT required.
Better to be a "has been" than a "never was".
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Re: boring the mains
[Re: Challenger340]
#2045556
04/03/16 05:22 PM
04/03/16 05:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506 Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Line BORING is not usually done or required, unless fitting a different set of main caps on a Block. Line HONING is commonly performed to adjust main bearing Clrc's or straighten or bring back main Bores "round", that have subjected to different clamp loads.... ie; changing from stock Bolts to Studs.
We Line Hone everything, just a matter of procedure,because everythibg is "off" the mains and we have to square the Block Decks as well as correct the Bores perpendicular to the mains. and NO... unless you are a dork cutting .010" off the main caps because you can't line hone properly, a shorter timing chain is NOT required. Ya, a procedure that everyone gets to pay for because you think it is necessary every time you do block machining.
Fastest 300
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