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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1836425
05/29/15 02:13 AM
05/29/15 02:13 AM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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Well some good news. Got that Eddy 1411 jetted down 12% lean at cruise and near stock power. Have 13.0 ish at idle and 12.5+ part and 13.5 full throttle. Considering the throttle shaft is loose like crazy, I'm happy with the results. Darn it...2.76 one legger and moshed pedal still smokes one tire....lol. Little ping mid throttle but I can work on that. So New carb! Do I use the QFT 750 or go Holley? Thought for one. Issue #2 - the valve issue. I head it myself coming out the exhaust....I couldn't believe it! So drive it, change the heads...... I await your opinons as they are valued....oh ya...here's the car. [img:left]  [/img]
Last edited by chermik1999; 05/29/15 02:18 AM.
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1836852
05/29/15 07:25 PM
05/29/15 07:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
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About to go away
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Here's a thought, get the 1411 rebushed. A competent machinist should be able to do that for way less than a new carb, especially since you have this one almost tuned perfect.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: Supercuda]
#1836938
05/29/15 10:22 PM
05/29/15 10:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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Here's a thought, get the 1411 rebushed. A competent machinist should be able to do that for way less than a new carb, especially since you have this one almost tuned perfect. Too late. Already bought the Quick Fuel. Plus the outfit in Michigan said if I sent it back, he may get it replaced. Thats better...lol. I still may try the 1413 as I bought a trip kit for it, but we'll see. At least now that I have the AFR working properly, the job just got that much easier for tuning..... cheers
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1839233
06/01/15 09:57 PM
06/01/15 09:57 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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Ok....some new info.
After talking to our service shop today as he also builds race cars, he said if it has been sitting for a while, it's gummed up. So said to throw in some fuel and valve conditioner. So I ran some more Seafoam from the carb and stalled it plus put in the tank. Let sit for an hour, then took it for a chew. Haven't done a leak down yet.
But before that I had the dr. side valve cover off and started to do #3 etc for leak test. Better at 5% leaking. But #1, I played with it a bit. Took a rubber mallet and tapped a few times. Gauge went down then came up from 25 to say 40. Did this numerous times and finally got it up to 75.
So I think that's the problem. There is merit to what he said. It sat for a few years, got gummed up and needs to be freed up on valves, comp rings, etc.
So, any thoughts on that? I would appear I don't need heads, just major cleaning. Hopefully not a rip down????
Experiences of the same here?
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1849349
06/15/15 02:12 AM
06/15/15 02:12 AM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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Results:
Well, I put on the New Slayer 750 VS. WOW! What a difference. A/F at idle between 13.5-14 now. Excellent idle mixture response. Still a bit rich, but Im at 2300' so could go down a couple sizes on the jets which I'll try this week,
Got the MSD Dist dialed in for 36* at 3000 all in with 17* at idle. Went on the road a few times....no more pinging and hooks that 2.76 one legger to smoke that one tire,,,,lol. So 3:55 suregrip going in shortly as well.
So guess the Edel 750 was a bad carb. The 800 was tired, so Slayer wins this round....
Comp seems better as well. Still may have that sticky valve in #1, but will try a leak down again once I run for a few miles with the fuel/chamber conditioner to free up the vales a bit.
I do have a tick under the valley pan...sounds like a bad lifter at idle, but goes away once higher rpm. Not a knock.....but I think may BB's with a lift cam sound like that?
Want to thank all for the support. Now to the next topic sections for any other advice...lol. Like that valley noise....
cheers
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1849415
06/15/15 09:48 AM
06/15/15 09:48 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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Lincoln Nebraska
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You sound pumped! confirm your idle psi is enough (gauges can be crap). check preload. might be a bad lifter or two (press down vertical with a wooden hammer handle while idling on each rocker arm on the pushrod end to pinpoint a bad one (the tone will change). new lifter=go thru cam breakin procedure, remove inner spring/breakin oil etc, all those details
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1849534
06/15/15 12:49 PM
06/15/15 12:49 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,212
Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
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I Live Here
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Someplace you aren't
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Might as well put it here so people can see the progression.
A 750 eddy is a pos. A few on here disagree, but many of us have said that fir years. Just does not seem to flow all through the range as it should. You might think the a/f ratios are right, but they wont run as good as other 750 carbs.
I want my fair share
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1849551
06/15/15 01:11 PM
06/15/15 01:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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They are non adjustable so only thing I can do it change them. Will have to put a mech gauge on to check oil psi. actually if the preload is off (too little) to the point where it is causing the noise then you'd change the pushrods not the lifters but yes I am thinking lifter issue rather than preload but it needs to be checked & it s an easy check & far easier than a cam breakin procedure
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: RapidRobert]
#1849664
06/15/15 03:16 PM
06/15/15 03:16 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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They are non adjustable so only thing I can do it change them. Will have to put a mech gauge on to check oil psi. actually if the preload is off (too little) to the point where it is causing the noise then you'd change the pushrods not the lifters but yes I am thinking lifter issue rather than preload but it needs to be checked & it s an easy check & far easier than a cam breakin procedure OK...so how would you do it then? It goes away off idle and doesn't seem to miss so maybe I'm being paranoid? Would miss if the cam lobes were worn. But since the engine has sat for a while evident of the gummed up valves etc, maybe a lifter or two are near collapsed or stuck? You guys have more experience as I'm a SB guy...lol. Just kidding....I'm a novice for this troubleshooting stuff. What if I run it with the covers off. Then apply pressure to a few rockers and see of that makes a difference as you mentioned earlier? I doubt piston slap with no blow by. And its on the top, so rules out bearing especially when it diminishes off idle?
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1849683
06/15/15 03:38 PM
06/15/15 03:38 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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I'm not really thinking preload but it could be if the pushrods are a bit too short & the cup is too close to the snap ring at TDC then when things get hot the clearance decreases even further till there is contact making in effect a solid lifter sort of. ~.020 is ballpark. put a lifter on base circle and set a 6" thin steel scale "ruler" across the valve cover rails then make a sharpie mark on the edge & slide it over fast till it touches & makes a witness mark on the side of the pushrod then unbolt the rocker shaft evenly till the pushrod JUST stops moving upward (no sideways movement that skews your test) & this is when the lifter cup has reached the snap ring. make another witness mark then measure the distance between the two witness marks & that is the preload distance. its easier to finish removing the whole rocker assy then so you csan remove the pushrod to make it easier to measure it. On the other idling with valve cover(s) off press straight down on each rocker arm on the lifter end with a wooden hammer handle (hurry it is a messy job).
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: RapidRobert]
#1850185
06/16/15 01:39 AM
06/16/15 01:39 AM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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I'm not really thinking preload but it could be if the pushrods are a bit too short & the cup is too close to the snap ring at TDC then when things get hot the clearance decreases even further till there is contact making in effect a solid lifter sort of. ~.020 is ballpark. put a lifter on base circle and set a 6" thin steel scale "ruler" across the valve cover rails then make a sharpie mark on the edge & slide it over fast till it touches & makes a witness mark on the side of the pushrod then unbolt the rocker shaft evenly till the pushrod JUST stops moving upward (no sideways movement that skews your test) & this is when the lifter cup has reached the snap ring. make another witness mark then measure the distance between the two witness marks & that is the preload distance. its easier to finish removing the whole rocker assy then so you csan remove the pushrod to make it easier to measure it. On the other idling with valve cover(s) off press straight down on each rocker arm on the lifter end with a wooden hammer handle (hurry it is a messy job). Ok Rob...thanks. I'll give either a go. The later is easier for me until I figure out what you just said....lol. Naw...I think I got it. I'll make a tall gasket out of cardboard as we used to do with chevys, and do it that way. Bit messy but I have to find that noise....bugging me. Now I did a bleed down again tonight on #1, and still bad. But it runs so nice...damn. Still not better than 13.0-13.5 ish A/F at idle and 12.0 mid throttle, but a huge improvement than the Edel 750 or 800. So ran a can of seafoam again, let sit then a chew on the highway. Now have some in the tank. Will finally drive it for a few weeks to work that gum out hopefully. If not, guess besides redoing the paint will be at least doing heads this winter....lol. Everything else is done with exception of the mufflers that im still waiting for....Borla....oh well. 68 RR...in Canada, like none around so may as well do it right the first time. Will keep on the report side as to how it all pans out. thanks
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: chermik1999]
#1850249
06/16/15 05:13 AM
06/16/15 05:13 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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if preload is OK & that is an easy check wheat I'd do is see if I could pinpoint the noisy lifter(s) & dissassemble em then put em back together (keep same innards in same body) as clearances/passages inside are very small & a piece of debris in the oil (#1 reason I like frequent changes) can make it hang up on occaision & I for sure dont care to do a cam breakin procedure for new lifters
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Edelbrock 1411 lean issues on 440
[Re: RapidRobert]
#1850328
06/16/15 10:31 AM
06/16/15 10:31 AM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 61
Alberta, Canada
chermik1999
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if preload is OK & that is an easy check wheat I'd do is see if I could pinpoint the noisy lifter(s) & dissassemble em then put em back together (keep same innards in same body) as clearances/passages inside are very small & a piece of debris in the oil (#1 reason I like frequent changes) can make it hang up on occaision & I for sure dont care to do a cam breakin procedure for new lifters Good idea. I got my trusty hose in the ear tool...lol going last night. Seems the noise is coming form the right bank. Just above the fuel pump area. So I'll yank off the cover there and try that. But as you say, #1 still has a leaky ex valve too. According to the BOS's/invoices for the car, new motor install, it's likely the motor only has like 8000 miles on it since 2006. If it's true with the odo, then highly likely it's gummed up. So I'll start with lifters first. I'll check straightness of push rods, and try again. Like I mentioned a few posts ago, doing a leak down on #1 for example, I was tapping the valve spring with a rubber mallet. And it was varying in psi readings from 30 - 90 psi. Tells me it's gummed or very bent? But wet comp test has little change. So rings should be fine. I try and report...thanks
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