99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
#1801553
04/12/15 10:07 AM
04/12/15 10:07 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406 north of coder
moparx
OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
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OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406
north of coder
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i finally found a new bus to replace my rotted out 2000 caravan. this thing was super cheap, and came from arazona so the body is totally rust free ! the reason it was cheap is the fact the differential pin come loose, broke in two, and spit the spider gears out of the case cover and created a small hole in the upper case. when this happened, the elderly lady owner was slowing for a stop. she said it made a strange noise [ ], then when she went to go, it wouldn't. anyway, i got it home yesterday and up in the air. the ring gear and axle side gears look ok, as well as the case holes that the "death pin" resides in. i didn't look close at the split pin retainer hole tho. what are the chances of replacing the missing pieces and repairing the case with the trans in the bus ? then have it work again ? what makes this happen in the first place ? i know the obvious correct repair would be to replace the whole transmission. what years interchange ? what could be the electrical differences between 1995 and 2000 be ? this may seem like a "hack" repair, but back in the mid to late 60's, we did stuff like this quite frequently on open diffs of all makes because we liked to have lots of "fun" roastin' the weenies, and we broke lots of parts. those types of repairs lasted a long time from my feeble old mind, so why couldn't it be done on this deal ? sorry for the long ramble, but "inquiring minds want to know " thanks in advance !
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1801556
04/12/15 10:21 AM
04/12/15 10:21 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384 Madison Wi
NTOLERANCE
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384
Madison Wi
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There is a tsb on this. The death pin shears and the cross shaft walks out. There are some small "tangs" you can buy to hold the cross shaft in if the death pin shears
Replace the death pin put the shaft back in - or replace the shaft if it's damaged and it will likely run.
Buy the updated tangs though !
Edit. Try to stay with the same year transmission -people have had issues with different years and controllers.
If it were me if slap it back together and jb weld the case. Got little to lose
Last edited by NTOLERANCE; 04/12/15 10:27 AM.
I used to care but....... things have changed
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1801558
04/12/15 10:24 AM
04/12/15 10:24 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384 Madison Wi
NTOLERANCE
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384
Madison Wi
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Cross shaft retainer pic. Bolts to ring gear
I used to care but....... things have changed
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1801584
04/12/15 11:03 AM
04/12/15 11:03 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889 up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Years ago my 86 Daytona spit a spider gear out and it got embedded in the case.
Put the gear back where it belonged, JB welded the hole int he case and ran it for years.
Of course it was a 5 speed, but the symptoms were similar.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: Supercuda]
#1802090
04/12/15 11:47 PM
04/12/15 11:47 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384 Madison Wi
NTOLERANCE
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,384
Madison Wi
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I don't know the tsb info. I was told that by my trans guy.
I used to care but....... things have changed
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1803017
04/14/15 03:01 AM
04/14/15 03:01 AM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,699 Newport, Mi
Evil Spirit
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,699
Newport, Mi
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Seen quite a few of them with the diff cross pin welded in. Not saying it is the right approach, but done correctly, it is permanent.
Free advice and worth every penny... Factory trained Slinky rewinder.........
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1803074
04/14/15 09:35 AM
04/14/15 09:35 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,433 It's a dry heat
gtx6970
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,433
It's a dry heat
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this will show me a couple of things. one, what one of these things look like when you can actually see something without stuff being in the way. and two, how big is the lube supply hole between the diff and the trans. then i'll think about how i want to proceed. I have one opened up on the bench right now if you want to see anything in particular . Its out of an 02 T+C
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: gtx6970]
#1803172
04/14/15 01:01 PM
04/14/15 01:01 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
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This was a common problem on ford 5-speeds found in early '90s SHOs. The problem is usually caused by a situation where one wheel is spinning and the other is still, like the typical one wheel on ice scenario. The spider gears spin very fast and gall to the cross shaft. This breaks the retaining pin, the cross shaft moves out and becomes a crude boring mill.
On the transmission I repaired, which came out of a running car, the retaining pin had already sheared and there was significant galling on the cross shaft. Fortunately the cross shaft had not made the hole in the differential case any larger. The short shafts were not affected. I was surprised at how soft the cross shaft was.
After this occurred, the transaxle cases were scrap. Your mileage may vary, and the JB Weld repair may be enough. If so, a couple of new used parts and you're good. Making sure the cross shafts won't come out again is just common sense. Welding or staking plus using the roll pin would be a good idea, IMHO.
In the case of the ford transaxle, all the gears were in a common case, there was no oil supply hole for the differential.
R.
Last edited by dogdays; 04/14/15 01:02 PM.
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: gtx6970]
#1804477
04/15/15 10:14 PM
04/15/15 10:14 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406 north of coder
moparx
OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
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OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406
north of coder
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Bearing preload shims are under the carrier bearing cups in the extension housings.....,,no they will not fall out . No is it required to replace them unless your changing the carrier.
The 02 Caravan has a rather large aluminum support/crossmember right behind the trans thats holds the rack and pinion assy and the lower control arms attach to .
I have serious doubts you will be able to get the carrier out of the trans case with this crossmember / support in place,, I always just drop the trans. Odds are you have a busted case anyway . I can have them out in under an hour the more i look at this, you are probably right. i'll bet the case is toast behind the ring gear. so, next question is, what are the differences between 95 & 2000 transaxles, other than the electrics ? is it possible to use a different year and swap in my electrical parts ?
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1806106
04/18/15 09:32 AM
04/18/15 09:32 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406 north of coder
moparx
OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
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OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406
north of coder
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bumping this, as hopefully today, i'll get a bunch of things out of the way and with fabbed "feeler" wires and mirrors, i may be able to see if there are any cracks or holes into the converter area. also, i'll take down the filter pan to see how many chunks made it into that section. in any case, i'll be that much closer to removal if it comes to that. i still need to find out the electrical differences between a 95 [which i have] and the 99, which is the subject of this discussion. many pics have been taken already, with more to follow, but i haven't dumped them from my camera yet. they will be at the appropriate time and posted then. as this is a learning experience for me, i hope it can be a teaching one for others. to be continued.......
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Re: 99 caravan differential question - sorta long & odd
[Re: moparx]
#1806754
04/19/15 10:30 AM
04/19/15 10:30 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406 north of coder
moparx
OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
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OP
"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,406
north of coder
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worst case was confirmed yesterday. after getting a couple of braces and the converter inspection plate out of the way [plus mashing my thumb - which ,luckily, i can't feel anything, but had to stop & find bandaids], giant holes magically appeared allowing me to see what i believe is the edge of the front pump. also, you can shine a light through the flex plate holes and see it in the diff section. so, it gotta come out. today, i need to fab an engine support bridge and unhook every thing. hopefully, getting it on the ground. rats. well, it was a game plan while it lasted. will be able to get some really good pics then to post. if i could just get some definitive facts on the differences between the 95 transaxle and the 99 one. one thing is readily apparent tho..... the under side of this thing is amazing in that everything is RUST FREE ! a very rare thing in western pa. unless you spend time going west or south to import something. i am very happy about this ! so the learning continues.....
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