|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: D-50]
#1708380
12/10/14 12:47 AM
12/10/14 12:47 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
What degree are SB Chevy's? Just curious.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1708381
12/10/14 12:55 AM
12/10/14 12:55 AM
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
1967dartgt
master
|
master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
|
Sorry wrong post, I believe they are 48*
Last edited by 1967dartgt; 12/10/14 12:58 AM.
Brett Miller W9 cnc'd heads
STR Chassis fabraction
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: 1967dartgt]
#1708382
12/10/14 12:57 AM
12/10/14 12:57 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
^^^That is the stock valve angle yes, was wondering what their lifter angle is? Isnt that the difference between the 48* and 59* R blocks??
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1708383
12/10/14 02:02 AM
12/10/14 02:02 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,112
LONG ISLAND
fishy340
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,112
LONG ISLAND
|
Quote:
What degree are SB Chevy's? Just curious.
Heads are sb chevy 23*,ford sb 20*,and mopar sb 18* that's stock.
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: 1967dartgt]
#1708384
12/10/14 10:48 AM
12/10/14 10:48 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,784
PA
W5DART66
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,784
PA
|
Quote:
Sorry wrong post, I believe they are 48*
Chevy is 45*lifter
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: SpareParts]
#1708386
12/11/14 12:51 AM
12/11/14 12:51 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar
master
|
master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
|
The X block is a little insurance for the bottom end. As for the lifter angle , it will clearly work with good parts up to 8000 + rpms. But back when the X blocks were as good as it got , serious players moved the lifters around to address pushrod angle. And it was done for us with the advent of the 48 degree blocks. If 59 degree is what you have , go forth and sin no more.  If I was starting from scratch ( like I did ) then the decision was clear. Honestly , it is not as easy now as it was five - six years ago when I embarked on my ordeal. I had my choice of R blocks then. It's definitely a little tougher now. My next deal will be a 59 degree 340 going in an '80 Volare wagon , but it isn't going to be as radical a build as my Dart so I think it will be just fine. But if I intend to make some real steam , the 59 degree stuff would not be my first choice.
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: slammedR/T]
#1708387
12/11/14 01:18 AM
12/11/14 01:18 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,300
Northern Indiana
Dunnuck Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,300
Northern Indiana
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Their are of course limitations but how many push to that limit ?
The head choice is limited but not like before w9,victors and stuff like this came out.
As far as a stock block goes FILL IT they are tuff sobs them 340's...:)
Brad my indy were below 330cfm but it suprised me on the power it makes.
Mine from Ryan went [Email]346@700[/Email] if I remeber. But like I said I would like to see them on the same bench at the same time.
I got a set of 360-1's they are the cnc 245's but the raised port vesion. Ryan did them and said they more around 255cc and I remember a set he did on here in the 365 @ .700" lift range. I also have a magnum block and T&D 1.7 shaft rockers. I have the MRL Performance offset lifters and spin mine to 8K with no issues.
What does your Dakota weigh, if you don't mind me asking???
Keith
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: Dunnuck Racing]
#1708388
12/11/14 01:53 AM
12/11/14 01:53 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Their are of course limitations but how many push to that limit ?
The head choice is limited but not like before w9,victors and stuff like this came out.
As far as a stock block goes FILL IT they are tuff sobs them 340's...:)
Brad my indy were below 330cfm but it suprised me on the power it makes.
Mine from Ryan went [Email]346@700[/Email] if I remeber. But like I said I would like to see them on the same bench at the same time.
I got a set of 360-1's they are the cnc 245's but the raised port vesion. Ryan did them and said they more around 255cc and I remember a set he did on here in the 365 @ .700" lift range. I also have a magnum block and T&D 1.7 shaft rockers. I have the MRL Performance offset lifters and spin mine to 8K with no issues.
What does your Dakota weigh, if you don't mind me asking???
Keith
dakota is around 2765lbs. and 3190lbs. with my fat ass in it.
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: tubtar]
#1708389
12/11/14 01:54 AM
12/11/14 01:54 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
The X block is a little insurance for the bottom end.
As for the lifter angle , it will clearly work with good parts up to 8000 + rpms.
But back when the X blocks were as good as it got , serious players moved the lifters around to address pushrod angle.
And it was done for us with the advent of the 48 degree blocks.
If 59 degree is what you have , go forth and sin no more.
If I was starting from scratch ( like I did ) then the decision was clear.
Honestly , it is not as easy now as it was five - six years ago when I embarked on my ordeal.
I had my choice of R blocks then.
It's definitely a little tougher now.
My next deal will be a 59 degree 340 going in an '80 Volare wagon , but it isn't going to be as radical a build as my Dart so I think it will be just fine.
But if I intend to make some real steam , the 59 degree stuff would not be my first choice.
i was going to try the hard route of locating a good 48* R block, but now I think a Gen III hemi will be my next motor build.
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: tubtar]
#1708390
12/11/14 03:42 AM
12/11/14 03:42 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,563
Janesville, WI
SpareParts
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,563
Janesville, WI
|
Quote:
The X block is a little insurance for the bottom end.
As for the lifter angle , it will clearly work with good parts up to 8000 + rpms.
But back when the X blocks were as good as it got , serious players moved the lifters around to address pushrod angle.
And it was done for us with the advent of the 48 degree blocks.
If 59 degree is what you have , go forth and sin no more.
If I was starting from scratch ( like I did ) then the decision was clear.
Honestly , it is not as easy now as it was five - six years ago when I embarked on my ordeal.
I had my choice of R blocks then.
It's definitely a little tougher now.
My next deal will be a 59 degree 340 going in an '80 Volare wagon , but it isn't going to be as radical a build as my Dart so I think it will be just fine.
But if I intend to make some real steam , the 59 degree stuff would not be my first choice.
I guess it comes down to how you define "real steam" to me Yates' low 5's is pretty damn good. I'd be thrilled if my car ever went that quick and I don't care what the lifter angle is lol.
I have one style and we're considering building a 59* version for little bro but really need W9RP rocker arms to make it happen
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: Leon441]
#1708394
12/11/14 05:12 PM
12/11/14 05:12 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
Look where the center main bearings are anchored to the side of the block near the pan rail. There is extra meat under the pan rail sort of like a TA block just not quite that drastic. Also after clearancing blocks to build stroker motors you can tell the material changed, I am no metallurgist by any means but it is a lot harder to grind. I tend to see less core shift in general (there may be some LA blocks better than bad magnums but they are more the exception than the norm as far as core shift). Last small detail that may add some strength is the extra mount bosses all over the out side, expecially the 02-03 blocks.
I like almost free roller cam set ups also... now I do know about the 89-92 360 block having a roller cam but they are harder to find as they only came in trucks and dodge was not selling a lot of trucks till 94. Also that block does not have the extra meat around the mains.
I am not going to claim they are like an X block or anything but for the price difference (almost none) they are definately worth using if you plan to push a stock block really hard.
I think the difference in bore size does not outweight the blocks other strengths. In a perfect world we would have R3 blocks from the JY at $100 a pop but we don't. Also those LA 360 blocks that could safely go 4.100 are very rare, most of them are lucky to have enough real meat to be safe at 4.030.
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1708395
12/11/14 06:38 PM
12/11/14 06:38 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
Look where the center main bearings are anchored to the side of the block near the pan rail. There is extra meat under the pan rail sort of like a TA block just not quite that drastic. Also after clearancing blocks to build stroker motors you can tell the material changed, I am no metallurgist by any means but it is a lot harder to grind. I tend to see less core shift in general (there may be some LA blocks better than bad magnums but they are more the exception than the norm as far as core shift). Last small detail that may add some strength is the extra mount bosses all over the out side, expecially the 02-03 blocks.
I like almost free roller cam set ups also... now I do know about the 89-92 360 block having a roller cam but they are harder to find as they only came in trucks and dodge was not selling a lot of trucks till 94. Also that block does not have the extra meat around the mains.
I am not going to claim they are like an X block or anything but for the price difference (almost none) they are definately worth using if you plan to push a stock block really hard.
I think the difference in bore size does not outweight the blocks other strengths. In a perfect world we would have R3 blocks from the JY at $100 a pop but we don't. Also those LA 360 blocks that could safely go 4.100 are very rare, most of them are lucky to have enough real meat to be safe at 4.030.
^^this^^
I know in the truck world there are A LOT! of 360 magnums punched out to .040" over and .060" over that are stroker motors with no problems.
But as already stated going more than .030" over bore I would want a sonic test of the block first.
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: what's wrong with 59* sb's
[Re: SpareParts]
#1708396
12/12/14 02:41 AM
12/12/14 02:41 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar
master
|
master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
|
Quote:
I guess it comes down to how you define "real steam" to me Yates' low 5's is pretty damn good. I'd be thrilled if my car ever went that quick and I don't care what the lifter angle is lol.
I have one style and we're considering building a 59* version for little bro but really need W9RP rocker arms to make it happen
X block and 59 degree W-9's are capable for sure.......but hardly representative of the garden variety 59 degree stuff that is readily available.
Not quite unobtanium , but definitely unique.
Real steam starts around 600 h.p. for a small block in my opinion.
And it can be easily done with a stock block and 59 degree pushrod angles.
But there are better options out there.
Why not take advantage of them ?
|
|
|
|
|
