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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1681136
10/03/14 01:10 AM
10/03/14 01:10 AM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 96,655
On The Boat, On The Lake, Wa. ...
amxautox
Still Retired. Still Posting on Moparts. A Lot.
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Still Retired. Still Posting on Moparts. A Lot.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 96,655
On The Boat, On The Lake, Wa. ...
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I have power steering with 12 to 1 ratio. A bit quick for the street and road racing, but great for the autocross.
Tom
"Everyone should believe in something; I believe I'll go fishing."
-Henry David Thoreau
Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths
author unknown
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: amxautox]
#1681137
10/03/14 02:22 AM
10/03/14 02:22 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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I had a 16.1 flaming river box on mine before the Borgeson. A road course would've been totally doable. Autox it would've be easy to get behind IMO. I had 275's on the front and it wasn't that bad at all.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1681138
10/03/14 03:21 AM
10/03/14 03:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 752
AZ - The "dry heat" state
71autoxr
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 752
AZ - The "dry heat" state
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I didn't vote because it is a loaded question. If it is a multi purpose car I would vote for power steering. In this case multi purpose would be casual driving, along with occasional autocross, road race etc. If it were a dedicated, purpose built car I would choose manual for road race car, but probably still power for autocross. My Dart has 16:1 manual and it will never see anything more spirited than a city street, but I do love how it feels. The Challenger has fast ratio pitman, with a power box, and has done both autocross and track days. See if someone local will let you drive their car with a power/manual and see which one you like. I'll leave the keys for the Dart if you can make it to Phoenix!!!
68 AMX mopars red headed stepchild
69 Dart GT Convertible 340 4 speed
71 Challenger - looks like the avatar!
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: 71autoxr]
#1681139
10/03/14 03:45 AM
10/03/14 03:45 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
I didn't vote because it is a loaded question. If it is a multi purpose car I would vote for power steering. In this case multi purpose would be casual driving, along with occasional autocross, road race etc. If it were a dedicated, purpose built car I would choose manual for road race car, but probably still power for autocross. My Dart has 16:1 manual and it will never see anything more spirited than a city street, but I do love how it feels. The Challenger has fast ratio pitman, with a power box, and has done both autocross and track days. See if someone local will let you drive their car with a power/manual and see which one you like. I'll leave the keys for the Dart if you can make it to Phoenix!!!
It's not a loaded question, I'm just curious what people think, although I've never driven a manual steering car. There's no right or wrong I'm looking for.
And I've seen your Dart before. We talked in person at Fall Fling 2 years ago. Hopefully I'll be able to get my Dart ready for the track day at the next Spring Fling. I'm still debating which way I want to go with my Dart after I get my car on the ground again. After next summer I'm not sure if I want to stick with all purpose vehicle or dedicated race car I can drive to the track.
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: 71autoxr]
#1681141
10/03/14 01:43 PM
10/03/14 01:43 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 661
Iowa
jon01
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 661
Iowa
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I'm going through the same questions...have the stock box rebuilt and add fast ratio arms or get a Firm Feel manual box with the faster ratio guts or a Flaming River box.
Leaning towards a FR box, cheaper (500 @ Speedway vs 675 for FF with column adapter) and a bolt in. Some say they are hard to steer at low speeds with bigger tires but it'd be worth it to have everything new.
Borgeson is off the radar at twice the price of a FR.
68 Charger R/T - #'s matching car, 499/727/3.91
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: jon01]
#1681142
10/03/14 07:43 PM
10/03/14 07:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,482
Lake Orion, MI
goldduster318
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,482
Lake Orion, MI
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I have the borgeson box - love it. I do need to do the shimming to it as mine is a little off - but the driving experience is quite good.
'70 Duster 470hp 340/T56 Magnum/8 3/4 3.23 Sure-Grip
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: 71autoxr]
#1681146
10/04/14 01:00 PM
10/04/14 01:00 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
Quote:
And I've seen your Dart before. We talked in person at Fall Fling 2 years ago. Hopefully I'll be able to get my Dart ready for the track day at the next Spring Fling. I'm still debating which way I want to go with my Dart after I get my car on the ground again. After next summer I'm not sure if I want to stick with all purpose vehicle or dedicated race car I can drive to the track.
I remember. If you have the space and the tools and a column adapter you can always swap from one to the other if you are not happy the waynit is set up. The ratio in a manual box makes a world of difference. The offer to drive my dart is a outstanding offer. Besides, phoenix is really nice this time of year.
Thank you. I wouldn't be able to make a trip out there till late March or early April at the earliest. If I were to ever go manual I'd try getting a 16:1 ratio from Firm Feel or something.
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: Dan@Hotchkis]
#1681148
10/04/14 01:51 PM
10/04/14 01:51 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 661
Iowa
jon01
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 661
Iowa
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Sorry for the hijack MuuMuu but what would you consider low enough Dan?
This is going in my 68 Coronet wagon with a 512/TKO600. Already has your springs out back and some misc goodies up front. I have to go manual to run the Procharger…so hardly a light weight. 245 front tires.
68 Charger R/T - #'s matching car, 499/727/3.91
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: jon01]
#1681149
10/04/14 01:55 PM
10/04/14 01:55 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,819
Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,819
Kirkland, Washington
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Automatic tranny? Manual steering Manual tranny? Power steering I would prefer manual tranny, manual steering, but when the going gets spirited the power steering is welcomed. 
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: jon01]
#1681150
10/04/14 02:04 PM
10/04/14 02:04 PM
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 841
Santa Fe Springs, CA
Dan@Hotchkis
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 841
Santa Fe Springs, CA
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Quote:
Sorry for the hijack MuuMuu but what would you consider low enough Dan?
This is going in my 68 Coronet wagon with a 512/TKO600. Already has your springs out back and some misc goodies up front. I have to go manual to run the Procharger…so hardly a light weight. 245 front tires.
I would suggest you look into something like what we are concocting for Kevin's Dart, so that your under hood space remains unaffected.
For example, My wife's dart at 3150 has manual steering and a 255 front tire. Quite a bit of low speed effort and the feedback can be a bit troublesome for her in tighter mid speed corners, as the caster begins to work, and the steering attempts to straighten on throttle input, steering effort increases drastically. I'm a pretty healthy guy, and event I have to be mindful of it.
In another point, a friends 2500lbs Falcon went through a "engineering overhaul" (he is an aerospace engineer). Being a gorilla of a guy, he figured 8:1 manual would be manageable; after one race he immediately went back to power assist. We all thought it was hilarious, he was WHIPPED and had massive blisters on his hands.
IMO, manual steering is good/great for lightweight, small tire cars (go-karts, Formula F/Vee). Anything bigger than that, and you should be looking to power assisted steering.
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Re: Power or Manual Steering Box Prefrance for the Twisties
[Re: HUSTLESTUFF]
#1681153
10/06/14 10:34 AM
10/06/14 10:34 AM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
cdoublejj
member
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member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
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this thread is a great read. i was watching, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8H1bFE_hyEthey mention 14:1 not being toooo touchy @ 3 turns lock to lock. does that mean 3 turns or really 6 turns? then again i'm sure that changes from car to car and setup to setup.
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