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400BB build up #1658702 08/13/14 11:32 PM 08/13/14 11:32 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Hi guys, finally getting a chance to build up my 400BB that i have had forever, was foolish and young and listened to the advice of others and tore it down with no budget to rebuild it, now as it sits I have a 400BB , nothing real special just a '78 (date code 10-4-78) block stock bore stock (to my knowledge) 906 heads and i was told this is a forged steel 383 crank the red stuff you see is HD bearing grease to protect the journals can anyone confirm this is a forged steel crank ? Also with this crank does my stock 400 rods and pistons have to get balanced as a whole ? What kind of crank damper do i need to run ? one for internal balance or external ? got a bone stock '67 727 that i am getting tomorrow from a guy here local, worked when pulled, I will still go through it before i bolt it all up together. What kind of flex plate should i use ? I can't imagine this thing making gobs enough torque to break a stock one in stock form, also does a slant flex plate fit a BB 6 bolt crank ? I will need a cam for this and i plan on milling the heads to raise compression, is there any way to figure out how much to whack off to bring the CR up ? I have been hearing good things about a few summit cams, Summit Racing� Camshafts SUM-6400 Camshaft, 1-Bolt, Hydraulic Flat Tappet, Advertised Duration 288/298, Lift .444/.466, and Summit Racing� Camshafts SUM-6401 Camshaft, 1-Bolt, Hydraulic Flat Tappet, Advertised Duration 298/303, Lift .466/.488 Any mopar cam recommendations for helping wake the 400 up ? How much can i mill the heads before i need to worry about adjustable rockers ? I know alot of questions, but i come from boosted slant land (max'ed at 18lbs of boost before i lost the head gasket all stock engine with a good tune on the carb) and really haven't dabbled to much in big blocks, i will eventually have an all forged as close to stock, (bore/stroke) and run a pair of holset hx-35 turbos, but for now i just need to get it running, so its gonna be bearings, rings and seals, but really looking at cam and head recommendations from those in the know P.s The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658703 08/13/14 11:56 PM 08/13/14 11:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA S StealthWedge67 master
StealthWedge67 master S Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA	First: you're going to want to figure out exactly what the end game is here. Building a stock motor will not yield the same advice as building a twin hair-dryer big block. Next: If you don't already have a copy of Don Taylor's "How to Rebuild Big Block Mopars" book. go get one now Assuming a stock (non-turbo) rebuild: Yes, that is a forged crank Yes, you'll want to balance the whole assembly Stock 383 flex-plate should work and can be found cheaply. The summit larger cam is generally spoken of as a pretty good stick for a street application. Compression is what you'll want to focus on to wake up the 400. Milling the heads and / or decking the block will be in order to do that. You'll have to CC the heads in order to find out what they are now and where how far you'll want to cut them. keep in mind that cutting them enough to effect the compression will likely mean you'll have to also cut the intake to fit. It won't take much work on those heads to get into the price range of a set of Stealth heads. And those would address the compression issue and offer a ton more potential.... just a thought. BTW: I wouldn't mess with adjustable rockers. Just get new pushrods at the correct length. not too tought to figure out pushrod length, much cheaper and simpler. Adjustable rockers are not designed to make up for milling, and likely wouldn't fit correctly with the standard length pushrods anyway. Again, if you want to keep playing with the turbo.... NONE OF THE ABOVE APPLIES. Last edited by StealthWedge67; 08/15/14 01:45 AM.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658704 08/14/14 12:26 AM 08/14/14 12:26 AM
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,395 Pa Hot 340 master
Hot 340 master Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,395 Pa	You GOTTA tell us about the slant build first. Waay more interesting.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Hot 340] #1658705 08/14/14 09:45 AM 08/14/14 09:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,010 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart I Live Here
gregsdart I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,010 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	How much cylinder bore ridge at the top of ring travel is there? That needs to be removed. Also, not a good idea to try and rebuild a block with too much piston to wall clearance from wear. Go by the max bore wear in the factory manual, or very close. KB lists a piston that is hypereutectic (stronger than stock, and lighter) that will fit with your stock rods and give you 8.9 to 9.3 compression depending on head volume of the 906 heads. This is your cheapest route with an overbore. The motor will love the extra full point plus compression, and the pistons show big valve reliefs for all the cam you need. Depending on how much converter stall you will have (assuming automatic here) you can go pretty big on cam if you have a high stall ( 4000 or more) . I have run a 268 at .050 and .540 lift on stock rockers with a mild lobe that lived with the stock valve gear up to 6,000 rpm. Less stall will dictate staying pretty short on duration, go by cam manufacturer recommendations. Stock converters come in low stall or high stall, obviously you want the high stall if you want to go with a stock factory converter. Remanufactured converters can be had for around $120 in high stall. High stall will be somewhere between 2200 to 2600 rpm as a guess. Low stall is listed at 1800, real low end killer. Hear is a small stroker combo that yields 9.6 to 1 compression at 4.350 bore. 4.375 bore also available with these pistons. Ross forged pistons, 99907 4.350 bore or 99906 4.375 bore. (max overbore for most 400s. Chevy big block rods ,aftermarket 6.800 long Offset grind the crank to 3.525 for a stroke increase of .150 This will produce a light rotating assembly that will make 418 cubes with 4.350 pistons, or 424 cubes at 4.375 bore This is a cheap stroker combo for a 400 when you consider that you will need to rebuild the old rods, and buy pistons anyway, and possibly regrind the crank. 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658706 08/14/14 03:32 PM 08/14/14 03:32 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA	Before you start this build make sure you know what you want IT to DO before starting it is very easy to get the wrong parts and machine work when you start of wanting to make it run now as easy as possible but know that you want to add more power later, like your suggesting with the turbos Stop, take a breath and think first before starting donwn the path to making this motor run Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: StealthWedge67] #1658707 08/15/14 03:11 PM 08/15/14 03:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I have the chuck senatore "BIG BLOCK MOPAR PERFORMANCE" book, its got a lot of good general build tips, but i feel it focuses more on stroker and all out race engines, I will have to check out that book. I would prefer just a piston change if i can help it. For right now this is a "lets get it running" build. so stock cast 4bbl manifold, was going to homeport it, block the heat crossover, 440 source heads would be nice but, not really in the budget now, being military, me and the family are getting ready to move down to keywest, and houses aren't cheap down there, and i prefer not to trailer her all that way. Now why will the whole thing need to be balanced ? or is that just added insurance ? what kind of crank damper do i need to run ? do the SFI fluid damper's not care what crank they are on ? I understand about the adjustable push rods, but even say i only knock .010 to clean up the heads, can stock pushrods still work effectively on a stock hyd flat tappet set up ? Is there anyway to measure CC volume of the heads with out one of those fancy kits ? I mean its just a syringe and flat piece of glass with a tiny hole it right ? I noticed on the rod oiling holes that well, they are not perfectly round, more like jagged holes, can they be rounded and counter sunk to help improve oil to the rods ? speaking of mains and rods mains measure 2.622" using a brown & sharp 2"-3" micrometer rods measure 2.344" all measurements were taken in several spots at each main and rod journal. which are .30 over(ish) size If i am correct, mains are stock, I am going to have the oil holes chamfered and a micro polish on the crank, then get bearings after that, which bearing should choose for durability, clevite, dura-bond, etc I haven't been able to find a domed KB piston, I did find the KB240KTM , they have a bunch of numbers listed below, Compression Ratios 72-10.6 80-9.8 85-9.3 90-8.9 Is the first number added to the end of the part number to determine size ? KB Pistons I found step pistons, would they be as effective ? again I am just trying to keep machining cost down, that and I really have no way to transport a block. If i remember right the slant and BB share a few things in common, i wonder if flexplates/flywheels are included in that as well ? The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658708 08/18/14 03:08 AM 08/18/14 03:08 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	bump The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658709 08/18/14 10:27 AM 08/18/14 10:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,010 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart I Live Here
gregsdart I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,010 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	The KB piston you listed is heavy, but if it is the same weight as a stock piston and pin you can skip balancing the motor. If it is not the same weight within a few grams, then balancing is a must to keep the motor from shaking badly. I would use this piston on a cheap rebuild, very mild performance build. The rings are 5/16 which will cost power compared to 1/16 rings used on most newer pistons. A good quality stock replacement damper will work ok if you are staying under 6,000 rpm or so. On the stock pushrods, they can work ok provided the rate of lift on the cam and spring rate aren't too high. They are on the weak side, and the stock rockers will not provide advertised lift because they aren't a true 1.5 rocker. There is enough travel in the lifters to handle more than .010 cut on the heads. To measure head CCs a cheap syringe from a drug store, plastic plate and grease to seal it up and you are in business. 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: 400BB build up [Re: gregsdart] #1658710 08/18/14 11:54 PM 08/18/14 11:54 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Well i got the bearings and pushrods on order, should be here wednesday, sealed power/felpro gasket kit with blue perma-torques, not digging the cork op and valve cover gaskets, but i will work with what i got. Thinking about using a summit damper, $100 stock replacement, seems like a good deal. So how much can be whacked off the heads before the stock (8.55" 3/8 comp ball and ball ) pushrods need shortened ? which would be better as far as cams go Summit Racing Part Number:SUM-6400 Cam Style:Hydraulic flat tappet Basic Operating RPM Range:1,500-5,000 Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift:214 Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift:224 Duration at 050 inch Lift:214 int./224 exh. Advertised Intake Duration:288 Advertised Exhaust Duration:298 Advertised Duration:288 int./298 exh. Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.446 in. Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.466 in. Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.444 int./0.466 exh. Lobe Separation (degrees):112 or Summit Racing Part Number:SUM-6401 Cam Style:Hydraulic flat tappet Basic Operating RPM Range:2,000-5,500 Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift:224 Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift:234 Duration at 050 inch Lift:224 int./234 exh. Advertised Intake Duration:298 Advertised Exhaust Duration:303 Advertised Duration:298 int./303 exh. Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.466 in. Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.488 in. Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.466 int./0.488 exh. Lobe Separation (degrees):114 I think the summit 6400 would be a better choice for a mostly stock motor, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658711 08/19/14 12:42 AM 08/19/14 12:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN A ahy master
ahy master A Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN	Lots of good advice. Just a question and comment. To the best of my knowledge, all 400's were made with cast crank. I wonder how it got a forged 383 crank and still stock bore? Also a comment. The 400 is often compression challenged. With lowish compression and 400 ci, the small Summit cam may make you happier in terms of low/mid range torque.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: ahy] #1658712 08/19/14 02:12 AM 08/19/14 02:12 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md 3 383man Too Many Posts
383man Too Many Posts 3 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md	This is a 400 we have in my boys Dart. We used the forged 383 crank and of course had it all balanced as it uses stock rods and KB pistons. Also use the internal crank balancer. It had Eddy RPM heads that were cut a bit for 10.6 comp. We use the MP .557 solid flat tappet cam and the RPM intake with a 750 DP. It has a 9.5 Dynamic converter and 3.91 gears. At 3550 lbs with him in it he has dipped in the 11.40's @ 117 and it is a driver street car and runs on pump. Course this build wont help you if you are going to go with the turbo. Ron

Re: 400BB build up [Re: ahy] #1658713 08/19/14 10:12 AM 08/19/14 10:12 AM
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 6,563 Downtown Roebuck Ont Twostick Still wishing...
Twostick Still wishing... Joined: May 2003 Posts: 6,563 Downtown Roebuck Ont	Quote: Lots of good advice. Just a question and comment. To the best of my knowledge, all 400's were made with cast crank. I wonder how it got a forged 383 crank and still stock bore? Also a comment. The 400 is often compression challenged. With lowish compression and 400 ci, the small Summit cam may make you happier in terms of low/mid range torque. If the 400 came out of a manual trans vehicle, it will have a forged crank. No manuals with cast cranks in a BB. Kevin

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Twostick] #1658714 08/19/14 09:50 PM 08/19/14 09:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,766 Central Valley, CA. Quicksilver440 I Live Here
Quicksilver440 I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,766 Central Valley, CA.	I think you would be wasting your money to mill the heads to try and gain compression when using stock pistons. The pistons are so far in the hole that the gains will probably not be worth the money spent. Those 400's are good engines...but they are advertised as 8.2:1 compression, but if they are like every BB Mopar I have dealt with, the compression is likely actually much less. I did some quick calcs and assuming the piston is .120 in the hole like a smogger 440 usually is, I get 7.58:1 compression with a .020 shim gasket. I get 8.17:1 compression by milling a typical 906 90cc chamber down to 80cc's. If I'm wrong on this....someone please correct me though. If your set on using the stock pistons, that is ok...I would just use a stock shim style head gasket and not bother milling for compression. To mill enough to matter you would have to mill the intake side as well and this will all cost money. You could just spend a little more and buy some cheap ($350ish) KB hyper pistons like Greg suggested and get much more gain. But you will have to rebalance because KB's are lighter than stock pistons are. Or just leave it all stock and live with the compression and use the smaller summit cam listed. It will still have good/ok power.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 383man] #1658715 08/20/14 12:52 AM 08/20/14 12:52 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	@AHY I bought the crank from a guy here local thats into BB Dakota swaps, for dirt cheap, got a set of pistons with the deal( still for sale std bore if I remember right) I have been talking with AllMotorDuster about getting his 2800 stall TCI converter, shes running a 2.94 sure grip rear, eventually getting a 4.10 ford 8.8, I figured a 2800 stall would be a good step in waking her up. I want to keep the compression between 8.0-8.5 to 1. especially when the hair dryers get bolted on. Anyone know if these are any good dampers ? ebay damper Talked to the seller they are made by a company called C.A.T Performance, are they any good ? Now since I am using stock 400 pistons and rods, but a 383 forged crank, will i still need to get everything balanced, or get the crank polished, double/triple check the rod and main diameters and put it together as normal ? -Mike Last edited by Volare4life; 08/20/14 01:04 AM. The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658716 08/20/14 01:45 PM 08/20/14 01:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376 D dogdays I Live Here
dogdays I Live Here D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376	There were 383s with cast cranks There were 383s with forged cranks. There were 400s with cast cranks. There were 400s with forged cranks. Cast to cast, forged to forged, the cranks are the same. For all I know they are the same casting or forging number. If you're using a forged crank with either 383 or 400 stock crank and rods, and neutral balance converter/harmonic damper, no need to balance. If you're using a cast crank with either 383 or 400 stock rods and pistons, you will need the cast crank harmonic damper and converter. Then, no need to balance. Of course, MOPAR balance jobs were the worst of the Big Three, so the stock balance jobs can definitely be improved. BUT, at this stage in your automotive development, you don't need to. I'd pick the smaller camshaft. 383s and 400s are very easy to overcam. R.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: dogdays] #1658717 08/21/14 12:55 AM 08/21/14 12:55 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	right on Dogdays, I appreciate the info, got more parts ordered tonight, can't wait to get'em -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: dogdays] #1658718 08/21/14 09:44 PM 08/21/14 09:44 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well scored a nice TM-6 with a holley 2bbl on it for $80 locally,, gonna clean up and sell the holley and recoup at least some beer money lol The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658719 09/26/14 02:26 PM 09/26/14 02:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so got the block spotless, and guess what a few of the cylinders got some deep pitting, its bad enough after running a "dingle-berry" hone to knock off the varnish i could clearly see the pitting. Oh damn now i have to bore it out, So what do you guys recommend for a really good forged piston ? Also how much HP/TQ can stock 400 rods take ? I think it would be a good time to upgrade the rods to h-beams, any good brands out there that can take a bunch of abuse ? looking to make around 400+ crank HP, and going either blown or boosted, but i want to build a stout forged bottom end. Speaking of bottom ends, already drilled out the pick up to 1/npt, suction side of the block, blended and smoothed the OP suction and discharge sides, drilled out the discharge with a 9/16 till about 3/16 from the oring. I won't know the overbore for a few days, but I want to build this right the first time, and yes I will be keeping the iron heads for now. which i know even with porting and maybe another round of decking (had the shop just machine them enough to clean them up). While we are at it, I am returning the cardone reman dizzy, thing is a real piece of work, it needs its mag pickup replaced because it is not only almost flush with the tanish rubber insulator, but is angled and is smacking the reluctor, I do have a few slant dizzy's lying about i was gonna take a pick up off of one of them and just install it, but aside from MSD what is a quality dizzy for a low deck, and i already know to avoid that procomp crap, And i was thinking magnecor wires for it as well,But i am open to suggestions, already have the GM HEI up grade as well, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658720 09/26/14 02:46 PM 09/26/14 02:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass. 8 80fbody mopar
80fbody mopar 8 Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass.	Time to build a simple badazz 451 out of that block. Probably get 500hp even with the stock 906 heads. Old school and pretty easy. New pistons, 440 crank turned down, 440 rods & a balance. Will last forever if put together right & good heads with net you 600hp in the future.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: dogdays] #1658721 09/26/14 02:50 PM 09/26/14 02:50 PM
Joined: Dec 2013 Posts: 403 Romulus, MI GTS340 mopar
GTS340 mopar Joined: Dec 2013 Posts: 403 Romulus, MI	Quote: There were 383s with cast cranks There were 383s with forged cranks. There were 400s with cast cranks. There were 400s with forged cranks. Cast to cast, forged to forged, the cranks are the same. For all I know they are the same casting or forging number. If you're using a forged crank with either 383 or 400 stock crank and rods, and neutral balance converter/harmonic damper, no need to balance. If you're using a cast crank with either 383 or 400 stock rods and pistons, you will need the cast crank harmonic damper and converter. Then, no need to balance. Of course, MOPAR balance jobs were the worst of the Big Three, so the stock balance jobs can definitely be improved. BUT, at this stage in your automotive development, you don't need to. I'd pick the smaller camshaft. 383s and 400s are very easy to overcam. R. Forged 400 cranks? What year and what applications were forged cranks used in 400s?

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658722 09/26/14 03:17 PM 09/26/14 03:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,260 Las Vegas NV moparmanjames pro stock
moparmanjames pro stock Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,260 Las Vegas NV	The rods should be good for your application but looking at your build it is very mild and all the stock components should be fine. Both the cams you are looking at are mild and should work. I would not mill the head, I would pick up a cheap set of closed chamer heads instead like some 516's. These are plentiful and cheap. I would run the .022" steel shim gaskets to keep the compression up and just surface the heads and block to make them true.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTS340] #1658723 09/26/14 03:24 PM 09/26/14 03:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,260 Las Vegas NV moparmanjames pro stock
moparmanjames pro stock Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,260 Las Vegas NV	Quote: Quote: There were 383s with cast cranks There were 383s with forged cranks. There were 400s with cast cranks. There were 400s with forged cranks. Cast to cast, forged to forged, the cranks are the same. For all I know they are the same casting or forging number. If you're using a forged crank with either 383 or 400 stock crank and rods, and neutral balance converter/harmonic damper, no need to balance. If you're using a cast crank with either 383 or 400 stock rods and pistons, you will need the cast crank harmonic damper and converter. Then, no need to balance. Of course, MOPAR balance jobs were the worst of the Big Three, so the stock balance jobs can definitely be improved. BUT, at this stage in your automotive development, you don't need to. I'd pick the smaller camshaft. 383s and 400s are very easy to overcam. R. Forged 400 cranks? What year and what applications were forged cranks used in 400s? I never saw a forged 400 crank in a stock engine but I've only seen about 200 so who knows?

Re: 400BB build up [Re: moparmanjames] #1658724 09/26/14 04:23 PM 09/26/14 04:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376 D dogdays I Live Here
dogdays I Live Here D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376	Some early 4-speed cars and trucks had forged cranks in 400s. It's been discussed here before. R.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: dogdays] #1658725 09/26/14 06:49 PM 09/26/14 06:49 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I said the crank was a forged unit from a 383, I wanted to keep a stock displacement, but up compression with pistons to a solid 8-8.5, so its a better setup for boost by blower or turbos. The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658726 09/26/14 08:40 PM 09/26/14 08:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass. 8 80fbody mopar
80fbody mopar 8 Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass.	I would drop the crank back in with a couple bearings (1,3,5) & install a couple pistons to check your deck height. I have a few 400 blocks and the pistons are WAY down in the hole. Also make cc kit and assemble one chamber on the head and check the cc's. These two measurements will allow you to accurately understand & set your compression the 1st time.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 80fbody] #1658727 09/28/14 02:36 AM 09/28/14 02:36 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	can't really do that, block is already at the machine shop. Just waiting to hear back from them to see how much they are boring it over, they want the pistons,rods, full set of rings for one piston, flex plate, and balancer so they can weigh and balance the whole set up and fit the pistons, know i know forged pistons expand more than the hyper's from what i am reading so how much piston to cylinder wall gap should i run ? What about a quality forged piston ? Icon, CP are names i keep seeing but haven't heard much about anyone running them ?? I saw these Wiseco Pro Tru Pistons PT108A55, its listed for a BB chebby,4.375 bore, flat top with 4 valve reliefs, has a Compression Distance (in):1.250 in. Piston Head Volume +10.00cc, and of course a .990 pin and the more desirable 1/16x1/16x3/16 ring pack and for about $530 not a bad deal The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658728 09/28/14 07:27 AM 09/28/14 07:27 AM
Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL E EchoSixMike mopar
EchoSixMike mopar E Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL	Those Wiseco pistons are for a 3.75 stroke low deck with a 6.800 chevy rod. S/F.....Ken M

Re: 400BB build up [Re: EchoSixMike] #1658729 10/02/14 08:52 PM 10/02/14 08:52 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	So I am looking at either the KB240 Bore (in):4.382 in. Bore (mm):111.303mm Piston Style:Flat top, with a trough Piston Material:Hypereutectic aluminum Compression Distance (in):1.908 in. Piston Head Volume (cc):-5.00cc Wrist Pin Style:Press-fit or floating Pin Diameter (in):1.094 in. Piston Ring Thickness:5/64 in. x 5/64 in. x 3/16 in. or the KB280 Bore (in):4.382 in. Bore (mm):111.303mm Piston Style:Step head, with two valve reliefs Piston Material:Hypereutectic aluminum Compression Distance (in):1.327 in. Dome Height (in):0.155 in. Piston Head Volume (cc):0.00cc Wrist Pin Style:Press-fit or floating Pin Diameter (in):1.094 in. Piston Ring Thickness:5/64 in. x 5/64 in. x 3/16 in. I am confused as to which with help with the compression bump, oh and I have to go 40 over, already magna fluxed and sonic checked to make sure and they said it could 60 over with no worries. So which pistons should i go with ? and these will be going on stock length rods THanks, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658730 10/03/14 08:55 PM 10/03/14 08:55 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Bump for info on pistons The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658731 10/03/14 10:43 PM 10/03/14 10:43 PM
Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass. 8 80fbody mopar
80fbody mopar 8 Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass.	KB240 is the one. The KB280 is for the 451 stroke setup. That's why the comp distance is so much smaller. Do look into Probe, Icon, etc forged pistons. They're not typically much more than those KB hypers and much stronger. Oh and Icon is KB's forged line. You also can get 1/16" rings with forged pistons which make more power and give more options than the old style 5/64" rings that the hypers use. This guy has some pretty good piston prices usually. http://www.cnc-motorsports.com/pistons-1.html Last edited by 80fbody; 10/03/14 10:46 PM.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 383man] #1658732 10/04/14 03:17 AM 10/04/14 03:17 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 3,245 Between a rock & a hard place C cudadoug master
cudadoug master C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 3,245 Between a rock & a hard place	Quote: This is a 400 we have in my boys Dart. We used the forged 383 crank and of course had it all balanced as it uses stock rods and KB pistons. Also use the internal crank balancer. It had Eddy RPM heads that were cut a bit for 10.6 comp. We use the MP .557 solid flat tappet cam and the RPM intake with a 750 DP. It has a 9.5 Dynamic converter and 3.91 gears. At 3550 lbs with him in it he has dipped in the 11.40's @ 117 and it is a driver street car and runs on pump. Course this build wont help you if you are going to go with the turbo. Ron Not to hijack but Ron...do you realize that with light race wheels and a glass hood/sealed scoop your sons Dart is knocking on the 10 secon door? Holy smokes!

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 80fbody] #1658733 10/04/14 03:43 AM 10/04/14 03:43 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I appreciate the info and link 80fbody, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658734 10/08/14 12:03 PM 10/08/14 12:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	got a set of eagle H-beams with arp 8740 bolts, and kb240's .040 over ordered up through cnc-motorsports, great guys to deal with and great prices too. Now I am looking at what dizzy to get, I have heard great things about both firecore and MSD, I want vacuum advance, and currently have an HEI setup on the car, just wondering which dizzy is easier to tune, also looking at some magnecor wires, I used them on my boosted slant and loved them, but I am open to suggestions as to what people have used and liked. -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658735 10/08/14 02:31 PM 10/08/14 02:31 PM
Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass. 8 80fbody mopar
80fbody mopar 8 Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass.	I went with the Firecore as it clears pretty most all BB aluminum heads & I got a great deal on a new in box one. That said, MSD truly has the market cornered on the these. Quality product with plenty & plenty of guys run them on here so there's no shortage on help available.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 80fbody] #1658736 10/08/14 09:23 PM 10/08/14 09:23 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Very true, but for the price you can't beat a firecore vacuum dizzy, and i hear its a lot easier to recurve it vs losing your mind breaking a MSD down lol Are you running firecore wires as well ? I was thinking about going with magnecor wires, but i don't know how they compare to firecore -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: cudadoug] #1658737 10/09/14 01:56 AM 10/09/14 01:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md 3 383man Too Many Posts
383man Too Many Posts 3 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md	Quote: Quote: This is a 400 we have in my boys Dart. We used the forged 383 crank and of course had it all balanced as it uses stock rods and KB pistons. Also use the internal crank balancer. It had Eddy RPM heads that were cut a bit for 10.6 comp. We use the MP .557 solid flat tappet cam and the RPM intake with a 750 DP. It has a 9.5 Dynamic converter and 3.91 gears. At 3550 lbs with him in it he has dipped in the 11.40's @ 117 and it is a driver street car and runs on pump. Course this build wont help you if you are going to go with the turbo. Ron Not to hijack but Ron...do you realize that with light race wheels and a glass hood/sealed scoop your sons Dart is knocking on the 10 secon door? Holy smokes! He is actually in the process of getting a glass hood with the 6 pk scoop so he can run a taller intake if he wants to try some other intakes also. He has not had it out or driven it much in the last 2 years as he got married and his wife had my grandson about 3 months ago so he has been very busy. But he plans to get more serious with the Dart some day soon. Thanks , Ron Last edited by 383man; 10/09/14 01:57 AM.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 383man] #1658738 10/16/14 09:07 PM 10/16/14 09:07 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	got everything but the torque converter, flex plate, just real quick I am looking at roughly 9.5:1 compression with my build, what would everyones recommendation be for a DP carb and would a 2400 stall be a enough to help motivate my 3400lb 2dr volare with a 2.94 rear gear ? or should i be looking for a higher stall ? -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658739 10/16/14 10:18 PM 10/16/14 10:18 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion	Quote: got everything but the torque converter, flex plate, just real quick I am looking at roughly 9.5:1 compression with my build, what would everyones recommendation be for a DP carb and would a 2400 stall be a enough to help motivate my 3400lb 2dr volare with a 2.94 rear gear ? or should i be looking for a higher stall ? -Mike Looks pretty good but why r u stuck on a DP carb? Also, there`s a fine line in my opinion w/verts and gearing especially n/a and that`s a TALL gear.............. Last edited by Thumperdart; 10/16/14 11:11 PM. 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Thumperdart] #1658740 10/17/14 12:21 AM 10/17/14 12:21 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	never could get vac secondary carbs to run right, and always had good success with DP carbs, and I just want lower rpms while cruising, might step up to 3.23, but its still a daily driver for now The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658741 10/17/14 01:02 AM 10/17/14 01:02 AM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	750 for the double pumper, and I'd go with 3.55s. 2.94s just suck, especially with a tall tire. Did you pick a cam? Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658742 10/17/14 12:24 PM 10/17/14 12:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass. 8 80fbody mopar
80fbody mopar 8 Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 596 Mass.	I'd also go 750dp,3:55 gears & a 3000 rpm converter.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658743 10/17/14 01:04 PM 10/17/14 01:04 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion	Quote: 750 for the double pumper, and I'd go with 3.55s. 2.94s just suck, especially with a tall tire. Did you pick a cam? Agreed.............and the carb needs to be "THUMPAFIED" ...... 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Thumperdart] #1658744 10/17/14 02:30 PM 10/17/14 02:30 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Gtx Matt, see above for cam specs. What do you mean by thumpafied ? The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658745 10/17/14 02:39 PM 10/17/14 02:39 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion	Quote: Gtx Matt, see above for cam specs. What do you mean by thumpafied ? Hi, I`m Thumper and I`m a carboholic............get it? Thumpafied........... 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658746 10/17/14 04:23 PM 10/17/14 04:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	Quote: Gtx Matt, see above for cam specs. What do you mean by thumpafied ? Did you pick the 6400 or 6401 though? I read through I never saw the final choice. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658747 10/17/14 05:46 PM 10/17/14 05:46 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	6400, and I am still not getting what your putting down thumper lol, are you talking about what mods you do to carbs ? Also are 2" headers to 3.5" collectors too big for the current build ? The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658748 10/17/14 11:46 PM 10/17/14 11:46 PM
Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,458 oklahoma F forphorty pro stock
forphorty pro stock F Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,458 oklahoma	Quote: 6400, and I am still not getting what your putting down thumper lol, are you talking about what mods you do to carbs ? Also are 2" headers to 3.5" collectors too big for the current build ? Yes, much.

Re: 400BB build up DELETED [Re: forphorty] #1658749 10/17/14 11:49 PM 10/17/14 11:49 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion	Post deleted by Thumperdart 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Thumperdart] #1658750 10/18/14 12:03 AM 10/18/14 12:03 AM
Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,458 oklahoma F forphorty pro stock
forphorty pro stock F Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,458 oklahoma	Quote: Quote: Quote: 6400, and I am still not getting what your putting down thumper lol, are you talking about what mods you do to carbs ? Also are 2" headers to 3.5" collectors too big for the current build ? Yes, much. Yes sir...........Unless DP does the things others and myself do, I guarantee I can make it cleaner and better............GUARANTEED! To clarify, I meant, yes, I believe a 2x3.5 header is much too big for the current build. Something more like 13/4 x3 would probably be better.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: forphorty] #1658751 10/18/14 12:21 AM 10/18/14 12:21 AM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,317 State of confusion	My bad, I clicked on your name............. 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Thumperdart] #1658752 10/22/14 05:57 PM 10/22/14 05:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	bump for GTX MATT opinions on my cam choice 6400 summit ? or would the tried and true .509 be a better option ? cam recommendations are always welcome -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658753 10/22/14 06:31 PM 10/22/14 06:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 3,575 The Netherlands BigBlockMopar master
BigBlockMopar master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 3,575 The Netherlands	I've recently wrenched together a bone stock 400 as a simple cruiser engine. Didn't change much on the stock internals, except for a slightly larger than stock cam and new cambearings. I did use 0.020" steel headgaskets and lightly milled a set of 915-heads to up the CR a bit but I didn't cc or measure anything to find out where I was at. Used an Offenhauser dualport intake. It was the only 4-bbl intake I had. Needed to enlarge the intake boltholes slightly because of the headmilling. Engine vacuum is fairly low still so I suspect the piston rings have seen better days. Recently recurved the ignition which woke it up nicely. Before After BigBlockMopar.com

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658754 10/22/14 06:51 PM 10/22/14 06:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2011 Posts: 559 Idaho L LaRoy Engines mopar
LaRoy Engines mopar L Joined: Oct 2011 Posts: 559 Idaho	So you might have some idea what the 6400 cam will do.......... Just built a .030 over 400 using the 6400 camshaft. Used the 346 heads with some minor porting so they flowed 250 cfm @ .500" lift. The engine was 7.515:1 compression and with the factory 2bbl carb and the factory 2bbl cast iron intake and dyno headers it made 371 lb-ft and 285 horsepower. Went to the shelf and grabbed a 383 Street Dominator intake and the old reliable 950 Quick Fuel and it made 397 lb-ft and 361 horsepower.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658755 10/22/14 07:09 PM 10/22/14 07:09 PM
Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 11,632 SHELBY TWP,,MICHIGAN 72N96RR I LOVE WEDGIES
72N96RR I LOVE WEDGIES Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 11,632 SHELBY TWP,,MICHIGAN	Quote: so got the block spotless, and guess what a few of the cylinders got some deep pitting, its bad enough after running a "dingle-berry" hone to knock off the varnish i could clearly see the pitting. Oh damn now i have to bore it out, So what do you guys recommend for a really good forged piston ? Also how much HP/TQ can stock 400 rods take ? I think it would be a good time to upgrade the rods to h-beams, any good brands out there that can take a bunch of abuse ? looking to make around 400+ crank HP, and going either blown or boosted, but i want to build a stout forged bottom end. Speaking of bottom ends, already drilled out the pick up to 1/npt, suction side of the block, blended and smoothed the OP suction and discharge sides, drilled out the discharge with a 9/16 till about 3/16 from the oring. I won't know the overbore for a few days, but I want to build this right the first time, and yes I will be keeping the iron heads for now. which i know even with porting and maybe another round of decking (had the shop just machine them enough to clean them up). While we are at it, I am returning the cardone reman dizzy, thing is a real piece of work, it needs its mag pickup replaced because it is not only almost flush with the tanish rubber insulator, but is angled and is smacking the reluctor, I do have a few slant dizzy's lying about i was gonna take a pick up off of one of them and just install it, but aside from MSD what is a quality dizzy for a low deck, and i already know to avoid that procomp crap, And i was thinking magnecor wires for it as well,But i am open to suggestions, already have the GM HEI up grade as well, -Mike Diamond custom dish piston 18cc..10.95 to 1 with 75cc head... 4.250 low deck stroker crank 6.535 big chevy H beam rods 1972 Road Runner / GTX 440 4spd Dana 3.54 Just about to turn 26K original miles.. A boat, a GMC truck, some Craftsman Tools, LOTS of Zombie Protection, and a few Goldfish.. If you love someone set them free.. If they come back it means nobody else wanted them either..!!

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658756 10/22/14 07:26 PM 10/22/14 07:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	Quote: bump for GTX MATT opinions on my cam choice 6400 summit ? or would the tried and true .509 be a better option ? cam recommendations are always welcome -Mike How racy/radical do you want it to be? At this point you're upping the compression, you're going to give it good induction and exhaust, pretty much everything it needs with the exception of gear. If you want it to run harder NA I would go with the 6401. I'd stay smaller than the 509 unless you plan to go to 3.91s or more eventually though. IMO the 6401 isn't too radical, and with your converter and decent compression you're not losing anything to the 6400 really. The 6400 is really basically a stock HP cam, or what people call and RV/Towing cam. I think with the 6401 it would be a 400-425 horse engine Last edited by GTX MATT; 10/22/14 07:27 PM. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658757 10/22/14 10:28 PM 10/22/14 10:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 164 Savannah, GA mopar400 member
mopar400 member Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 164 Savannah, GA	Here is a free Desktop Dyno you can download to get an idea of what you're working with. To get more accurate you can google your head flow and enter that in too. Old school program but works. http://www.colorado4x4.org/vbb/showthrea...o-Free-Download 1965 Fury II 1970 Challenger 440, 509 cam, 11:1 w/ 452 iron heads, 6.99 1/8, 11.29@ 120mph 1/4 (1999 Magnolia Drag strip track champion) 1992 Jeep XJ Crawler

Re: 400BB build up [Re: mopar400] #1658758 10/23/14 01:02 AM 10/23/14 01:02 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Appreciate the dyno software MOPAR400. Laroy those are pretty decent numbers considering the compression, I will be about 9.3/9.5-1 according to eagles calculator. 72N96RR, i already have KB240's and eagle H beams (6.358, but thank you for the recommendation. GTX MATT I plan on running a 3000-3200 stall, just realised Turbo Action is literally 30mins from my house here in jacksonville fl. Gonna give them a call, they seem to get good reviews on there converters. Unfortunately my order that was supposed to be here today, but fedex yet again has let me down and my order is still in georgia !! So one more day before I can get the rotating assembly balanced. The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658759 10/23/14 12:13 PM 10/23/14 12:13 PM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 164 Savannah, GA mopar400 member
mopar400 member Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 164 Savannah, GA	Quote: Quote: bump for GTX MATT opinions on my cam choice 6400 summit ? or would the tried and true .509 be a better option ? cam recommendations are always welcome -Mike How racy/radical do you want it to be? At this point you're upping the compression, you're going to give it good induction and exhaust, pretty much everything it needs with the exception of gear. If you want it to run harder NA I would go with the 6401. I'd stay smaller than the 509 unless you plan to go to 3.91s or more eventually though. IMO the 6401 isn't too radical, and with your converter and decent compression you're not losing anything to the 6400 really. The 6400 is really basically a stock HP cam, or what people call and RV/Towing cam. I think with the 6401 it would be a 400-425 horse engine I ran a 400 for years with the .484 and .509 cam later on. I think the .484 was a lot better fit for my combo (only 8-8.5:1). I'd go with the 6401. Should run strong. 1965 Fury II 1970 Challenger 440, 509 cam, 11:1 w/ 452 iron heads, 6.99 1/8, 11.29@ 120mph 1/4 (1999 Magnolia Drag strip track champion) 1992 Jeep XJ Crawler

Re: 400BB build up [Re: mopar400] #1658760 11/02/14 03:58 PM 11/02/14 03:58 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Well got the old summit cam all packaged up ready to ship back, I am just hoping that the 6401 cam will pull to redline (5,500 RPM)like advertised, Like i said I am open to other suggestions anything to anything bigger,also wondering if stock springs would be ok to reuse with the 6401 cam, I have cut the valve stem guides to .530 with teflon seals, remember it should be around 9.5:1 compression on a set of lightly decked 906 heads with KB hyper pistons, ferrea SS valves, and eagle H-beam rods, still need to get over to turbo action, but I need to finish the engine and get it to the dyno to figure out which converter to mate to it,gonna give my engine machine shop a call monday and see how things are going, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658761 12/03/14 04:08 AM 12/03/14 04:08 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so got everything back from the machine shop, getting ready to assemble the engine, I do have a few questions before I fire it up, and I have killed the search button, but there are just so many different ways to cut the cake, it gets a bit confusing, and looking for clarity so i do it right, since this is my first real (mild) performance build. I have read that you can run just straight water, then once its broke in drain and fill with anti-freeze, which makes sense especially if (knock on wood) you have leaks, but any truth to running it with no t-stat for break in ? I also remembering hearing when breaking in a fresh motor, that you should run exhaust manifolds vs headers, any truth to that ? Is the general rule of thumb to start it and set timing then bringing it up to the varied 1800-2000/2500rpms or start it bring it up to the varied rpm for break in, then bring it to idle and set the timing ? What is the go to oil for break in, straight 30W, any 30W with a ZDDP additive ? conventional dino, semi or full syn ? I have also heard "break it in with what you plan on running in it" ? How soon to change it after the break in is complete ? I have heard right after, 200-500 miles of mild driving, so ?? And I know this topic has been beaten worse then a tough chunk of meat, BUT who uses normal dino oil with an additive vs say brad penn/gibbs/VR1 etc ? I don't mind paying extra for quality, but if you get the same results at the end of the day and can save a bit, hey its a good day. How much ZDDP is too much ? in a diesel vs reg/semi syn/full syn,I know that the higher zinc is good, higher phosphorus is bad. Thanks as always, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658762 12/03/14 09:34 AM 12/03/14 09:34 AM
Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 167 maryland 7 74yellowduster member
74yellowduster member 7 Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 167 maryland	Quote: Appreciate the dyno software MOPAR400. Laroy those are pretty decent numbers considering the compression, I will be about 9.3/9.5-1 according to eagles calculator. 72N96RR, i already have KB240's and eagle H beams (6.358, but thank you for the recommendation. GTX MATT I plan on running a 3000-3200 stall, just realised Turbo Action is literally 30mins from my house here in jacksonville fl. Gonna give them a call, they seem to get good reviews on there converters. Unfortunately my order that was supposed to be here today, but fedex yet again has let me down and my order is still in georgia !! So one more day before I can get the rotating assembly balanced. i put a 400 in my duster my "stage 1" engine lol. i spent about 5500 kb 240 pistons, zero deck 400 stock crank, eddy rpm heads had to be milled slightly, 10:1 eddy rpm inake, eddy cam that came with the kit 750dp carb the lil 400 got 460hp peak on the dyno at 6100 stage 2 i might get some nice heads either full ported or maybe some stage v's or something. stroker kit etc. and efi. or i may choose to put in a gen3 i havent decided yet. my tubular k frame will take sb/bb/gen2/gen3 so i have many options lol

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658763 12/03/14 09:39 AM 12/03/14 09:39 AM
Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 167 maryland 7 74yellowduster member
74yellowduster member 7 Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 167 maryland	Quote: so got everything back from the machine shop, getting ready to assemble the engine, I do have a few questions before I fire it up, and I have killed the search button, but there are just so many different ways to cut the cake, it gets a bit confusing, and looking for clarity so i do it right, since this is my first real (mild) performance build. I have read that you can run just straight water, then once its broke in drain and fill with anti-freeze, which makes sense especially if (knock on wood) you have leaks, but any truth to running it with no t-stat for break in ? >>> most shops with a dyno run with no t-stat and straight water for 25 min at 2000 rpms. I also remembering hearing when breaking in a fresh motor, that you should run exhaust manifolds vs headers, any truth to that ? >>> yes because the headers can get red hot/ so use the dyno headers or some old manifolds. not new shiney headers definitely Is the general rule of thumb to start it and set timing then bringing it up to the varied 1800-2000/2500rpms or start it bring it up to the varied rpm for break in, then bring it to idle and set the timing ? What is the go to oil for break in, straight 30W, any 30W with a ZDDP additive ? conventional dino, semi or full syn ? I have also heard "break it in with what you plan on running in it" ? >>> Brad Penn 20w50 or some other racing oil not straight weight not rotella fleet oil or some cheap stuff. run the good stuff. How soon to change it after the break in is complete ? I have heard right after, 200-500 miles of mild driving, so ?? >>>first 500 miles vary the speeds dont drive at a constant 55 or something. continued high rpms can damage bearings and lots of jack rabbit starts before it's broke in can damage the rings. depends on your setup and how well everything is clearanced and built though. if everything is perfect it will take a lot of abuse. change oil at 500 or 1000 ... a good idea And I know this topic has been beaten worse then a tough chunk of meat, BUT who uses normal dino oil with an additive vs say brad penn/gibbs/VR1 etc ? I don't mind paying extra for quality, but if you get the same results at the end of the day and can save a bit, hey its a good day. How much ZDDP is too much ? in a diesel vs reg/semi syn/full syn,I know that the higher zinc is good, higher phosphorus is bad. >>>just use Brad Penn, it's good stuff. you can order it off summit. valvoline has a racing oil as well. there are a few others but why experiment Thanks as always, -Mike

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 74yellowduster] #1658764 12/03/14 05:00 PM 12/03/14 05:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	To answer your questions on valve springs no, do not run stock springs. Comp 911s or something similar. Take off springs from Stealth or Eddy heads would work fine too. For break in what kind of distributor are you running? If its points get it pointed to number 1 and turn it until the points just start to open. If electronic get it pointing to number 1 and advance it a little, 10 degrees or so. Then snug it leaving it loose enough to turn if you need to. Plug in the vacuum advance. Use a real break in oil, 30W is good. I used the Comp Cams break in oil. Dump it after break in. If you want to take a ride around the block before dumping it you won't hurt anything, but the sooner the better. After you dump it refill with oil with another bottle of break in additive. I would do this for the first 2 oil changes. 500 miles on the second batch of oil after break in, and you can increase the second oil change if you want. I change my oil often, cleaner oil is better. Once you're done with break in VR1 or Brad Penn, either is fine. I used VR1 for my first few oil changes with a bottle of the comp cams additive. I put the Brad Penn in last time with the additive. Both of these oils have enough zinc and in a 20W50 both of these oils are extremely sticky and will keep your cam lubed when your engine sits so it wont be starting dry. I'm probably overdoing it adding the break in bottle to either, but I've got a 9 quart pan and rather be safe than sorry (too much zinc is not really good though, over 2000 PPM). No truth to manifolds vs headers IMO, maybe they think the back pressure will help seat the rings? I say old wives tale. If its because of glowing headers they aren't running enough timing, which brings me to: Pre-fill your carb bowls. If its a Holley remove the sight plugs. Pour some fuel in a dry water bottle and get a clean cap from a gear lube bottle. Trim it so it fits in the vent tube. Now fill the bowls until the fuel is at the sight plug bottom, just like setting the floats. Put the sight plugs back in. Hook up your choke if you have it. Turn the curb idle screw in far. If you've got the timing close it will fire up immediately. HAVE A HELPER. Hold the RPM above 2000 if the curb idle screw isn't enough. Have your helper adjust it until it is. If that isn't enough adjust the throttle cable to hold it. Now check your timing. This depends on how your dizzy is curved, but shoot for 40-45 degrees with the vacuum advance for now while running at 2000-2500 RPM. This is conservative but should be enough to keep your headers from glowing/EGTs being high. When you're done you can get it dialed up perfect. Come back for tuning advice if you need it. You can run water, no problem. Just make sure the engine will be out of close to freezing temps before you dump it. No thermostat? Might ask for trouble but should be fine. I'd put a 180 stat in it. If you run hot you have cooling or tune issues. If you can run half 110 leaded and half 93 pump for a break in on a street engine. The lead helps the engine run cooler. Vary the timing. 2000 minimum, so have it set to run there or slightly over. Get behind the wheel and bring it up to 2500 and hold it every few minutes. I like to wack it up to 3K or so a few times in between it running at 2000 and holding it at 2500. Once done get your timing set right. Then dump the oil and refill. With that cam shoot for a baseline of 15 initial, 34 total mechanical all in by 2500 or so, then find what the engine really prefers. I would run vacuum advance as well. Then take it out and put it under a load. Mat the pedal in high gear a few times, bringing the revs up higher each time (try to avoid a kickdown though, IDK if you have a MVB). Start 2K to 3K, back off. Let the engine slow down don't hit the brakes. Then 2K to 4K, etc. Then go burn some rubber Last edited by GTX MATT; 12/03/14 05:19 PM.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658765 12/03/14 07:51 PM 12/03/14 07:51 PM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	Depending on the dist you can set the damper at about 30* BTDC then set the rotor to just point at the #1 tower and thats gonna be close(if you run a vac and mech dist set the dammper at 18* then set the rotor at #1... if the exhaust turns red during break in ADVANCE the dist more(you will hear the revs come up)... the above data is on the compression stoke(both valves closed)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1658766 12/04/14 02:51 AM 12/04/14 02:51 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	There is a guy on here that is hooking me up with a new set of springs and retainers off a set of stealth heads, I am going to be using a firecore vacuum dizzy and their pro-fit wires, msd blaster 2 coil, with the HEI upgrade for the ignition system. Getting a good deal on a case of brad penn 10w-30 right at $60 for a 12pk, the break in oil I am sure is gonna be cheaper still, and also have a case of wix filters standing by, I am going to be running an external pickup and I am concerned about the size difference in the HV vs external milodon pump covers, should I worry about enlarging the holes at all ? so your saying to use an additive for the break in, and first 2 oil changes ? I thought that the BP had high enough ZDDP to not need anything else ? I should use 20W-50 in a freshly rebuilt motor ? I figured 10W-30 would be plenty thick. I run an aeromotive 340 stealth intank pump, so the bowls should fill quickly lol I appreciate clearing up on the header vs manifold issue as well, Thanks as always guys, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658767 12/04/14 02:59 AM 12/04/14 02:59 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Also no mufflers on the break in correct ? And 30mins is still the time to shoot for yea ?( my neighbors hate me anyway, good thing I am moving soon lol) -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658768 12/04/14 03:08 AM 12/04/14 03:08 AM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	I would run mufflers for sure so I could hear the engine, I don't think there is any advantage there to not running them. You should choose your oil weight based on your main and rod bearing clearances. 10W30 in general is good. But that 20W50 BP and VR1 is stickier. It gives me a warm fuzzy feeling when the car has been sitting for weeks so I run it. And yeah I'd run boosted zinc levels in the first oil change or two after break in. It may be overkill but better to be safe than sorry. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658769 12/04/14 03:08 AM 12/04/14 03:08 AM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	Quote: Also no mufflers on the break in correct ? And 30mins is still the time to shoot for yea ?( my neighbors hate me anyway, good thing I am moving soon lol) -Mike Muffs or not.. no matter... your playing at about 2000 rpm and fluctuate the rpm up to about 2500 rpm EDIT have you assembled this yet... I think you MIGHT have screwed up buying your push rods so early... normally you test the PR length when you mock up AFTER all the machine work is done.. if the block is decked or the heads are cut or you change head gasket thickness any or all of these factors will change the PR length.. I hope your OK Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 12/04/14 03:19 AM.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1658770 01/10/15 02:19 AM 01/10/15 02:19 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well sorry for bringing this thing back from the dead, in a unrelated note I ended up replacing the frame rails in my volare while waiting for parts from here or there, and it sucks, every single thing about it sucked, from cleaning up and fully welding the crappy factory spot and 1" weld beads, to boxing in and eliminating the factory jig holes, except painting them, that I enjoyed from this to this ALL FAITH AND MEASURED 50+ times got this built up after several federal mogul bearing issues..... and then i sent the heads out to get a good cleaning which worked great except I found 2 tiny cracks in a valve guide boss.... and this happened better here on the bench the at 6,500 through the first shift So the heads are going back to the shop monday for a set of guides, and probably gonna do hardened seats at the same time, not unless I can blend this out without needing to replace the guide, anyone in FL got a spare 906 head ?? sometimes I swear its like its not meant to be, that Gods saying hey dumb a$$ should have stuck with the slant..... The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658771 01/10/15 03:36 PM 01/10/15 03:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,144 Central NC gch master
gch master Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,144 Central NC	Buy some heads

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658772 01/10/15 05:52 PM 01/10/15 05:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot Skeptic master
Skeptic master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot	Good work, I like the wheels This one has a stock stroke 400 as well. 8391635-RicerCuda06.JPG (270 downloads)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Skeptic] #1658773 01/10/15 05:57 PM 01/10/15 05:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot Skeptic master
Skeptic master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot	Here's a pic with the new bullet. 8391641-DSCF0012519.JPG (305 downloads)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Skeptic] #1658774 01/10/15 10:52 PM 01/10/15 10:52 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Sick fish bro, anyone have any opinion on the jacked up intake guide ? Do they even make a sleeve thick enough to make up the difference of the chunk missing ? I am strongly thinking about blending it in smooth and sharp edge free to prevent future cracks, and at the spring pressures I am running I think it will be ok The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658775 01/11/15 01:29 AM 01/11/15 01:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot Skeptic master
Skeptic master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,395 The Pale Blue Dot	Quote: Sick fish bro, anyone have any opinion on the jacked up intake guide ? Do they even make a sleeve thick enough to make up the difference of the chunk missing ? I am strongly thinking about blending it in smooth and sharp edge free to prevent future cracks, and at the spring pressures I am running I think it will be ok Thanks, I'd just have bronze guide(s) installed. Should be fine.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Skeptic] #1658776 01/18/15 01:57 AM 01/18/15 01:57 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well heads are at the shop, should have them back Monday/Tuesday, and the motor running by next weekend, pretty excited !! The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658777 02/11/15 02:55 PM 02/11/15 02:55 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so heads are back new valve guides, got the motor fully assembled when I realized the milodon external oil pump cover isn't going to work with the swap spool mounts, so I am planning on either going back to the stock cover ( Yea clearence !!!) or go big ( thank you tax return) and splurge on the milodon 21815 single line pick up, since I already drilled and tapped the block, IF i decided to go back to an internal pickup, would there be any issues with the slightly larger tapped hole for the pick up under the HV pump ? I am wanting to start building the car to road race, but she will be a street warrior for now, so a few pics and I wait to see what everyone thinks of the milodon 21815 pump, and yes I know i will have to switch out the OP drive shaft for a slightly longer milodon unit with a steel gear since I am running hyd flat tappet The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658778 02/11/15 05:41 PM 02/11/15 05:41 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA	Dude, with all this time, money, effort and hard work why are you still using the stock rocker set up Stop and buy better ones now Not later Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Cab_Burge] #1658779 02/13/15 11:33 AM 02/13/15 11:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I would but, #1 its a mild setup for now, #2 I haven't found a decent set of iron adjustable rocker's ( not real trust worthy of aluminium, and the ones that are high quality are just as much as if not more than a set of iron adjustable rockers. Well since I haven't received any input on OP choices, I will go with my original plan, ported HV pump and cover and 1/2" internal pickup, slightly baffled pan and windage tray with extra louvers and a stepped center section, time to get fabbing, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658780 02/13/15 05:25 PM 02/13/15 05:25 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA	Quote: I would but, #1 its a mild setup for now, #2 I haven't found a decent set of iron adjustable rocker's ( not real trust worthy of aluminium, and the ones that are high quality are just as much as if not more than a set of iron adjustable rockers. Well since I haven't received any input on OP choices, I will go with my original plan, ported HV pump and cover and 1/2" internal pickup, slightly baffled pan and windage tray with extra louvers and a stepped center section, time to get fabbing, -Mike If you haven't already opened up the block for the 1/2 inch oil pickup you really don't need to do that, it is overkill for most motors I used the stock 3/8 oil pickup and stock Mopar 6 quart 1970/1971 Street Hemi and 440 6 pak oil pan in my 518 C.I. low deck pump gas stroker motor for year and years of abuse I did use the Federal Mogul full narrow groove truck main bearings and there HP rod bearings, both clearances where above .0030 I used Valvoline 5W20WT oil in that motor from day one, never a oiling issue as long as I kept the oil level above the add oil line on the calibrated dipstick BTW, that motor ran 9.99 ET motor only in my 3450 Lb duster through the complete exhaust system on Oregon 91 octane pump swill My main message is there is a lot of misinformation out there on Mopar oiling systems, get it(the motor) ALL right and the stock stuff works fine I have and do use the Milidon oiling parts on some of my race motors, not all of them though If your planning on shifting the motor below 7000 RPM and not having it revved past 7000 RPM at the finish line you really don't need those expensive racing oil system parts I use the high volume Mellings and Speed Pro oil pumps in all my builds, I cut the bypass spring so I have 10 lbs of pressure per 1000 RPM of intended use, that is with hot thin oil The 518 motor had 18 to 20 lbs idling at 850 RPM with 180 + F oil temps, it would have 35 lbs at 1200 RPM and 65 lbs at or above 5500 RPM withthe 3/8 pick up and high volume Mellings oil pump with the spring cut back a coil or two IHTHs Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Cab_Burge] #1658781 02/14/15 12:11 AM 02/14/15 12:11 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I will have the melling HV pump, block has already been opened up for 1/2" and smoothed, just going to run the deep pan, I just wanted to make sure i was going to have zero oiling issues, i know i know, as long as the pick up remains covered I am good, but whats an extra $350 for the oil pump and dizzy drive when you have $3k in the motor ? I do want to push this car and see if a Silver state challenge 200mph+ is possible, motor has full groove bearings on the mains, so the added psi shouldn't be an issue, I was planning on running 10w-30, I mean we are in floridas winter month and a half right now so it is a bit brisk out, but I don't think it should be an issue for the other 10 1/2 months lol, especially in all the damn stop and go here in jacksonville, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1658782 02/15/15 03:35 PM 02/15/15 03:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,876 Weddington, N.C. Streetwize master
Streetwize master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,876 Weddington, N.C.	Having built Many of these, my .02 is not to Over-think these things. for a high torque 550-670'is horse motor theyt can't be beat. Find a good solid block like this one 71 230 but not a cold weather uber-thick main and drop in a 4.15 to 4.30" crankwith a decent st of 280-320 CFM heads with a streetable 250-265 ish @.050 cam and let it go; there's really not much point making more top end power if you can't make the torque you already have hook up. The best, most reliable motors are the ones that keep the torque peak in the 3800-4400 RPM range, when you really turn up the wick with big 360-380 cfm Max Wedge heads they can make 675-725+ HP but it requires a lot more spring/cooling/converter and tire to really make it pay off and 90% of people won't even know the difference between a 620HP and 720HP motor below ~5000 RPM anyway. Torque is what sets you back in the seat and as strong as B/RB blocks are they are (after all) 2 bolt main motors designed for modest RPM torque peaks... If you think about it....there's a reason Hemi's had/have cross bolted Mains....durability. I'm not saying you can't build a reliable 700 hp motor and drive it on the street, it';s just that it generally costs a lot more to achieve a powerband improvement that is usually only appreciated above an RPM you (for most people) seldom get to use outside of a drag strip. Again, don't over-think things, build it the way you want it, this is the Race forum so (although well-intentioned) a lot of what you'll hear on this forum will lean toward "super-sizing" the build. You can, but don't feel you need to. MHO only WIZE World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI In Car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1805441 04/17/15 05:24 AM 04/17/15 05:24 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so after having several issues with timing, running the coyles "tru roller" double roller timing set up. and changing out to a msd blaster 3, she fired right up. And all was right with the world, until it started bubbling and geysering water from the radiator. immediately shut it down, had no clue what could have caused it. oh joy time to trouble shoot, so here we go down the rabbit hole; So the radiator is a thicker 2 core out of a 80's ramcharger with ac, copper/brass, capped it put a gallon of distilled vinegar and topped it with distilled water, gave it a 5-10 minute shakey shake, let it sit for an hour vertically so all the crap would settle at the cap, did that for about 4 hours, got it nice and clean before the install. **TSTAT WAS OUT THE WHOLE TIME OF BREAK IN****plugged the lower rad hose and filled up the block with garden hose water, once full popped the plug and continued to flush block the best I could to get all the crap out. best thing I can figure is the arp head studs need a retorque, and the main reason I went with studs instead of bolts is a better clamp load, and yes I cleaned, cleaned cleaned the crap out of the bolt holes, bottom tapped them, arp lubed them. Once I get off watch I am going home, tearing it down to get to the studs, torque checking them and if any turn break them all loose and retorque them, put back together and fire it up......again and pray it fixed the exhaust in the coolant, weird thing was car didn't miss a beat, no knock or ping, nothing, hell we'll see. still need to get the wide band hooked up ( weld the bung in place ) and get my tune on and as always thank you everyone for the continued help with this project -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1805673 04/17/15 03:39 PM 04/17/15 03:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA	How long and what RPM did you run it at before the troubles started? Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1805864 04/17/15 09:22 PM 04/17/15 09:22 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	only about 5 mins, just set timing at 2,500rpm 34deg vac plugged on carb and dizzy ( fire core vac dizzy not the RTR), thought it could have been a hella air bubble trying to burp out, but it didn't seem right so i shut it down and it kept spewing brown EXTREMELY HOT WATER every where, I just finished retorquing the head studs to 80 ft/lbs per ARP instructions, all but 2 moved, started it back up same issue, belt not hooked up and still puking fluid out of the rad fill hole, so heads are coming off, off to the shop for a magnaflux and pressure check, i may say f it and quite wasting money on these iron heads and go with some 440 source heads, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1805954 04/17/15 11:33 PM 04/17/15 11:33 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA D davenc mopar
davenc mopar D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA	Before you pull the heads, you could connect an air line to each cylinder, with the piston at TDC, and look for bubbles in the radiator. It may help you find which cylinder is leaking into a coolant passage. It might just be a gasket problem.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1806015 04/18/15 01:26 AM 04/18/15 01:26 AM
Joined: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,708 jax. fla. 70Dustmite440 master
70Dustmite440 master Joined: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,708 jax. fla.	I have a radiator pressure/coolant system tester tool I could loan out, it may help and im here in Jax. Also, i've had water puke out forever on a dry engine until all the air is purged... but im always using a t-stat in mine so that could be why. 8sec. street car, been there done that. Quitting when your ahead isn't the same as quitting. [img]https://scontent-atl.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...amp;oe=55DB3E4C[/img] https://www.facebook.com/eric.norton.1048 R.I.P.UN.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1807109 04/19/15 06:58 PM 04/19/15 06:58 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Dustmite it would be appreciated, but I plan on ripping it down tonight to get the heads ready for turn in tomorrow, I thought it might have been a wicked air bubble as well, but with the water pump/ alternator belt off it still gurgles and pukes from the rad. Dave I hope its just a gasket problem, other wise it might be time to pull the trigger on a set of 440source heads, already have about $400 in the iron heads -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1810347 04/23/15 07:03 PM 04/23/15 07:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so they magnafluxed the heads again, and still good, double checked the flatness, still good, so i got another set of felpro blues, lets see if if this works, thinking about making sure the studs are a bit more then hand tight this time, and running a torque check at least twice before i fire it up again, trying what the shop suggested and sprayed them with copper coat, lets hope all is right this time. also I noticed the cooling holes in the gasket are just tiny slots, should i use a hole punch and atleast punch them out round to max coolant flow through the heads ? The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1810738 04/24/15 05:04 AM 04/24/15 05:04 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,213 Bend,OR USA	Don't modify the head gaskets I drill several .125 holes in the thermosat flange to let any air out of the cooling system when filling it initially, I've seen more than one new motor act just like yours did because they weren't full of coolant As far as tightening the studs more than finger tight They don't need it, you can try inserting a short handle allen head wrench and snug them slighty, if that will make you feel better AKA, you can also try filling the block through the top radiator hose with the drilled thermostat to make sure it fills all the way up I have filled them up and then squeezed the top radiator hose to make sure water squirts out of it into the radiator on radiators that the upper outlet is in line with the radiator cap fitting You do know that Murphy hates hot rodders, correct Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1831262 05/21/15 01:09 AM 05/21/15 01:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 580 Shelby, Ohio JeffL mopar
JeffL mopar Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 580 Shelby, Ohio	How's the Volare coming? I just got my 440 back in my Volare last weekend.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1831738 05/21/15 09:49 PM 05/21/15 09:49 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	its coming, had issues with the rag joint and 1 7/8" hooker headers, that's a post in and of its self, just been working alot more than normal ( thanks navy training squadron), but I am shooting to have it up and running this weekend, and hopefully fixed its coolant demon The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1831742 05/21/15 09:51 PM 05/21/15 09:51 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	btw thats a really good looking car, very clean install The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: JeffL] #1832254 05/22/15 03:27 PM 05/22/15 03:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,427 Michigan MarkZ Worthy
MarkZ Worthy Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,427 Michigan	Sorry to hijack... Jeff, what headers are those? I'm stuffing a BB into my M body and the engine compartment is exactly the same as an F. Are those shorties? Very clean install! Thanks... 1987 Fifth Avenue - 512/518/D60

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1849874 06/15/15 08:15 PM 06/15/15 08:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well I am stuck like chuck, the rusty color all over everything is from the radiator and block flush/ first explosion of water. So I have kept having problems with what i assume is head gasket issues, but now i am thinking more head issues, and not willing to go aluminium just yet ($1,000 is a big chunk just to throw at something for trouble shooting) but if thats what will fix it, heres the story in the short, -73 vintage block .040 over -906 heads decked to clean up -block decked to clean up -calculated comp is right around 9.8-1 -stock length eagle h-beams -KB 240 hyper pistons -383 forged crank cleaned up stock specs - felpro gasket kit (felpro blue gaskets) -GMB aluminium WP -440source aluminium pass side water pump housing -ARP bolts for mains -ARP head studs - firecore dizzy and wires first issues with was on first start, brought up rpms for break in, then water puked from the rad filler neck, I just figured huge air bubble, shut it down to cool continued to try and burp it, nothing was working. disconnected wp/alt belt and it still was puking from the rad filler neck, not good, pulled off the valve train and retorqued the head gaskets ( installed finger tight with the arp lube, on re torque #3 i broke them all loose snugged them down with an allen key, then retorqued them) and still same issue. ripped the heads back off the motor, took them back to the machine shop, had them go through them again, re magna flu them, and still all checks good. put it all back together, except this time copper spray the gaskets, and now all seemed right with the world. except now it still does this...... [video:youtube]https://youtu.be/GO94yMbJUiU[/video] and the [censored] is driving me insane, and no i broke the mic on my iphone so no sound, but still shows how even theres no belt it still bubbles and gurggles, also once shut it down, refilled it with water, put the radiator cap on, drove it around the front yard, parked it and shut it down, i could hear an audible hiss from the passenger side right around the 4-6 cylinder region, which has me thinking i have a crack in a water jacket, but...... no water in oil no oil in water no visible water leaks no "white smoke" or any smoke/water vapor from either muffler I am really getting irritated with this, like to the point of selling it and going back to the boosted slant, kinda pissed... but jesus i have so much $$$$$$ into the build, and so much $$$ into the iron heads, I need help guys, and if your in the local jacksonville, fl area feel free to come by, i have a beer fridge in the garage lol -Mike Last edited by Volare4life; 06/15/15 08:28 PM. The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850181 06/16/15 01:32 AM 06/16/15 01:32 AM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	Is there a thermostat in it? What kind of radiator? Are you running it with the cap on it first? And it starts to overflow? Or? Last edited by GTX MATT; 06/16/15 01:37 AM. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850350 06/16/15 11:27 AM 06/16/15 11:27 AM
Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL E EchoSixMike mopar
EchoSixMike mopar E Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL	When the shop "checked the heads out" did they pressure test the effing things? S/F....Ken M

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850378 06/16/15 12:07 PM 06/16/15 12:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada WO23Coronet master
WO23Coronet master Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada	So it looks like its pushing compression/exhaust out by the heat crossover on the driver side, I agree to double check with your shop to see if they pressure testing them. You could also fill the cylinders in the trouble spot yourself with compressed air and see what happens, maybe the heat cross over is cracked?

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850447 06/16/15 01:48 PM 06/16/15 01:48 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	Hmmmm missed the part with the heat crossover. It would seem that its cracked where the heat crossover is. If you were close I'd lend you a set of stock heads to bolt on and see if they work. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850475 06/16/15 02:18 PM 06/16/15 02:18 PM
Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 336 Creston, Iowa 3 340man4ever enthusiast
340man4ever enthusiast 3 Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 336 Creston, Iowa	I had a similar experience with a 360...heads were milled.......decks milled......ended up the intake needed corrected for proper fitment...... acted and sounded just like you are describing Curator at Adams County Speed Shop

Re: 400BB build up [Re: 340man4ever] #1850505 06/16/15 02:59 PM 06/16/15 02:59 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	Originally Posted By 340man4ever I had a similar experience with a 360...heads were milled.......decks milled......ended up the intake needed corrected for proper fitment...... acted and sounded just like you are describing On a small block it would make sense, but remember, big block's don't flow coolant through the crossover Last edited by GTX MATT; 06/16/15 02:59 PM. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850539 06/16/15 03:46 PM 06/16/15 03:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada WO23Coronet master
WO23Coronet master Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada	It shows it on the video, u can see coolant bubbling by the heat cross over

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850628 06/16/15 07:34 PM 06/16/15 07:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	the coolant you see bubbling in the video is just excess water from when i was rinsing the motor down from its first explosion of water from the radiator neck. @EchoSixMike, no they didn't pressure test them, just a magnaflux twice @GTXMatt no tstat, just finished the break in process and was still having this coolant issue, the radiator is a 18" high by 24" wide HD 2 core from a ramcharger, and no i didn't have the cap on when it first puked, wp/alt belt on, tried it again the first time before pulling the heads with cap on and it pissed out the over flow tube hook up, gonna go try another new rad cap and see if the china/mexico junk motorad one was just a turd, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850849 06/17/15 12:46 AM 06/17/15 12:46 AM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA D davenc mopar
davenc mopar D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA	Have you tried putting air pressure into one cylinder at a time and look for bubbling in the radiator? It would be good to try to narrow down where the leak is. If you end up with the heads off again, use a straight edge on the block around all sides of each cylinder to make sure there isn't anything funny on that surface. Given that you have tried two gaskets, it must be something either in the head or head surface or block surface.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850919 06/17/15 03:39 AM 06/17/15 03:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL E EchoSixMike mopar
EchoSixMike mopar E Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL	Well, magnaflux is fine if you're looking for cracks in the valve seats and the like, but if you have some problems in the coolant passages etc, pressure testing is the only choice AFAIK. I sorta thought it was fundamental when checking if heads were worth spit, but I see I'm hopelessly optimistic. S/F....Ken M

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1850987 06/17/15 11:36 AM 06/17/15 11:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada WO23Coronet master
WO23Coronet master Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada	Pressurize each cylinder as a start and see what happens, if nothing then take the heads back off and get them pressure tested

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1851228 06/17/15 06:26 PM 06/17/15 06:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	Yea i know, and i even asked before in sunk in almost $450 in parts and labor to them, should have not been cheap and got source heads, going to pressure check the cylinders and look for bubbles......at this point i hope something either positive or negative happens, getting real sick of tearing apart and putting back together, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1851245 06/17/15 07:11 PM 06/17/15 07:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2011 Posts: 319 jonestown,pa D dmking enthusiast
dmking enthusiast D Joined: Apr 2011 Posts: 319 jonestown,pa	you could pull one plug out at a time and run it. even wire off plug should make a cylinder pressure difference.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1851266 06/17/15 07:53 PM 06/17/15 07:53 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I figured it might even be a good idea to re torque check the heads since i did have issues with them "sealing?" the first time, so i will pull the valve train and plugs and pressurize the cylinders one at a miserable time, what kind of psi should i pressurize them too ?? -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1851477 06/17/15 11:53 PM 06/17/15 11:53 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA D davenc mopar
davenc mopar D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 598 NC, USA	Put the cylinder on top dead center (approximately) and use 70-80 PSI. The piston might move a little but that shouldn't be an issue. Leave the cap off the radiator and look for bubbles.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: davenc] #1851504 06/18/15 12:18 AM 06/18/15 12:18 AM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT GTX MATT master
GTX MATT master Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,163 CT	I dont know if this is going to find anything. IMO you've probably got a crack between a waterjacket and the exhaust crossover passages, you need need to feed pressure with the #3 or #5 exhaust valve open somehow. Not sure how you'd really do that. I think you need to pressurize the coolant system. Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1852475 06/19/15 01:05 PM 06/19/15 01:05 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	I really don't know what to do then, they put in new guides and valve seats, and I am not sure if either of those things had anything to do with it, hell at this point I think i am gonna buy a set of stealth heads off my buddy and call it a day, -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: GTX MATT] #1852483 06/19/15 01:35 PM 06/19/15 01:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada WO23Coronet master
WO23Coronet master Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 4,255 Canada	It's probably still worth a try, the OP said that the bubbling by the heat cross over was some water that splashed onto that area and was boiling off. To get that much pressure into the water jacket I'd guess it's probably in the combustion chamber? Not sure how much pressure is in the exhaust port but it's still worth a try

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1852871 06/19/15 11:07 PM 06/19/15 11:07 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well earlier in the thread ( and the reason for the valve guides) was because once i got the heads back from the machine shop for being surfaced and cleaned,I noticed one of the guides was cracked on the intake side, so back they went for a set of guides, seals, hardened seats etc between parts and labor about $450 later on a set of iron heads..... yea i know that was stupid to do, but again the goal was to get it running, now hindsight being what it is I plan on tearing the motor out of the car through the bottom rolling it in the garage, check it, and when it fails testing, i have a nice set of aluminium heads I plan on picking up from Chris2342 tomorrow evening. Now with aluminium heads that are out of the box new, and a set of felpro 8519 pt-1's, do i need to worry about copper spraying them as well ? I figured new gaskets would be cheap insurance, rather then trying to reuse a set that are barely broke in, or could i reuse them ? its gonna be a long night tonight....... -Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1854646 06/22/15 08:06 PM 06/22/15 08:06 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	so motor, trans and front k-frame are all out, not fun by yourself btw pulled the intake, and pulled all the plugs out, hooked up the compression checker hose ( pulled the valve core out) made sure it was a tight seal, pulled the rocker gear so i would have to keep rolling the motor over for tdc, put 110psi to it and i heard ait hiss from all eight cylinders, but no bubbles...........not a single damn bubble, I am thinking about putting a thermostat in it and running it on the "factory motor stand" and run it, other wise i pull the heads take them to the machine shop tomorrow, have them pressure check, hopefully at no cost to me since they have told me with 2 magnafluxs that they are good and then I dumped soo much $$$ into iron.... frustrating, I am open to any ideas and suggestions guys, -Mike Last edited by Volare4life; 06/22/15 08:06 PM. The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1854710 06/22/15 09:14 PM 06/22/15 09:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,540 Milwaukee WI T TRENDZ master
TRENDZ master T Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,540 Milwaukee WI	Its likely that there is nothing wrong. With no water pump running, and no pressure in the system, you are boiling the water in the heads. Reading through this thread... It seems you never gave the engine a chance to burb out the air without jumping to conclusions. "use it 'till it breaks, replace as needed"

Re: 400BB build up [Re: TRENDZ] #1855270 06/23/15 03:56 PM 06/23/15 03:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 740 Anderson, IN 1 1969RR super stock
1969RR super stock 1 Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 740 Anderson, IN	Originally Posted By TRENDZ Its likely that there is nothing wrong. With no water pump running, and no pressure in the system, you are boiling the water in the heads. Reading through this thread... It seems you never gave the engine a chance to burb out the air without jumping to conclusions. I have to agree. My 512 did the exact same thing, twice. Then, I purchased a tool from Snap-On that puts the cooling system into a vacuum (dry, empty, of course) and then "sucks" in the coolant thru a separate hose. I pulled almost 3 gallons into my system. I do have a large, Mark 7 radiator. when I filled the system this way, no getting hot at all. We now fill every new engine build this way and never have an air bubble issue. I bet you just had an air pocket somewhere. I would not run it without a stat and for sure not without belts to turn water pump. I just can't see the heads causing this issue. I think Harbour Freight sells this same tool. Hope this helps.

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1855356 06/23/15 05:57 PM 06/23/15 05:57 PM
Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 4,457 Washington M madscientist master
madscientist master M Joined: Sep 2014 Posts: 4,457 Washington	If your radiator had that much brown [censored] in it you need a NEW radiator. 2 cores with a MINIMUM of 1 inch tubes. 1.25 or 1.5 inch tubes would be even better. No way would I ever put that radiator back on. Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston

Re: 400BB build up [Re: Volare4life] #1953459 11/18/15 01:59 AM 11/18/15 01:59 AM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl V Volare4life OP member
Volare4life OP member V Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 119 Jacksonville , Fl	well I feel stupid...... really stupid, after all the bullspit about this carb, when i bought it it was "running ready to go" so i swapped the plastic pump cam arms for metal, turned on the aeromotive pump and it leaked checked good..... the freaking base gasket to carb body was the wrong one and caused the super lean condition !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! motor and all is finally back in and running like a champ, it was a bit delayed since we just had our second son on Oct. 7th, but its all back together and running amazing, except for the trans, 1st and 2nd shift great, 3rd and reverse slip alot, now i adjusted the bands per the transgo TF-2 instructions, but something isn't right I have my ATSG 727/904 rebuild book, and from what i gather all i need to do is retighten the front band, and it should be good to go, is this correct ? I mean 72in lbs on the front kickdown band is not tons of pressure, Mike The answers are out there you just got to look hard enough

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