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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: sshemi] #1625578
05/28/14 08:57 AM
05/28/14 08:57 AM
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The Great White North
RAMM Offline OP
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Quote:

Wow. Those heads must be HUGE making peak power that high!




The heads were an exercise in CSA exploration as they were previously used on a 416 cube engine. That engine made 563 hp with this induction and bigger hyd roller cam. I'm thinking the exhaust side is the next cork in the equation. I can't remember exactly what the CSA was but it was 2.35 or 2.45" at the pinch. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625579
05/28/14 11:53 AM
05/28/14 11:53 AM
Joined: Aug 2004
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sweden
S
sshemi Offline
top fuel
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sweden
Offset rockers?

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: sshemi] #1625580
05/28/14 01:09 PM
05/28/14 01:09 PM
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Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline
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I just had Bullet grind me a small solid roller for my 440 W2

CRA 284/292-09UR
(U means its the old Ultradyne grind)
284/292 @.020
251/259@.050
172/178@.200
.605/.605 (1.5:1)
.645/.645 (1.6:1)
109 spread

With the right springs I bet it would be a pretty good fit for this one as well, probably as good or better torque out of the basement with a bit better breathing (.200-up) capability up top. I'm looking for the same wall to wall type torque curve but tring to 'use it all up' by about 6000-6200.

So at 370" 4600-7300 should (roughly) correlate to 3900-6100 in a 440, which was right where I was targeting.

Any flow numbers onthe heads? Just curious what they do in the mid lifts, they must be killer at ~.400 to make that kind of power up top with such a small and low lift cam


WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: sshemi] #1625581
05/28/14 01:47 PM
05/28/14 01:47 PM
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The Great White North
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Quote:

Offset rockers?




Not really. I did not fill the pushrod tunnel in any way. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Streetwize] #1625582
05/28/14 01:51 PM
05/28/14 01:51 PM
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The Great White North
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Quote:

I just had Bullet grind me a small solid roller for my 440 W2

CRA 284/292-09UR
(U means its the old Ultradyne grind)
284/292 @.020
251/259@.050
172/178@.200
.605/.605 (1.5:1)
.645/.645 (1.6:1)
109 spread

With the right springs I bet it would be a pretty good fit for this one as well, probably as good or better torque out of the basement with a bit better breathing (.200-up) capability up top. I'm looking for the same wall to wall type torque curve but tring to 'use it all up' by about 6000-6200.

So at 370" 4600-7300 should (roughly) correlate to 3900-6100 in a 440, which was right where I was targeting.

Any flow numbers onthe heads? Just curious what they do in the mid lifts, they must be killer at ~.400 to make that kind of power up top with such a small and low lift cam




Not as good as you might think. I don't think back-cut valves are a smart move in a lot of cases. J.Rob

8158033-chartgo.png (61 downloads)
Last edited by RAMM; 05/28/14 01:53 PM.

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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: dizuster] #1625583
05/28/14 03:06 PM
05/28/14 03:06 PM
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sweden
1
1Fast340 Offline
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Quote:

Very impressive numbers...can't wait to see what it does in the car.

Jeez I hope my new MCH CNC Eddy's don't want to turn that much rpm...my cast crank hates me enough as it is...lol




you should be safe aslong as that crank keeps on hating you,start worry about it if the crank start loving you enough to descide to get out of the block to see you.

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625584
05/28/14 04:19 PM
05/28/14 04:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 458
Michigan
BPE Offline
mopar
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Michigan
What bore size were the heads checked on?

Rod

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: BPE] #1625585
05/28/14 04:51 PM
05/28/14 04:51 PM
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The Great White North
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Quote:

What bore size were the heads checked on?

Rod




Good question! The heads were flowed with a 4.06" sleeve installed in the fixture. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625586
05/28/14 08:07 PM
05/28/14 08:07 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
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Michigan
BPE Offline
mopar
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Good Job!

Rod

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: BPE] #1625587
05/29/14 11:42 AM
05/29/14 11:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,044
Victoria, Australia
Ian Offline
super stock
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nice job did you flow carb and intake bolted to the head and how mush loss was there.


1.37 60 ft [email]6.0@113[/email] [email]9.57@141[/email] 408 glide 3550lbs
new video http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Xvq3ZObywQE
Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Ian] #1625588
05/29/14 12:44 PM
05/29/14 12:44 PM
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I actually did. I can only say that the flow loss was substantial when tested this way. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625589
05/29/14 01:50 PM
05/29/14 01:50 PM
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Quote:

I actually did. I can only say that the flow loss was substantial when tested this way. J.Rob





You can say that again. I am running the Super Victor on my car now as I received it for a very good deal in a group parts buy but it took a lot of work to get it to flow decent numbers. I would NEVER buy one again unless it was a heck of a good deal.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: pittsburghracer] #1625590
05/30/14 02:46 AM
05/30/14 02:46 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,044
Victoria, Australia
Ian Offline
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from memory my out of the box with mild match port indy and carb on my 245-1 loss was around 28 cfm ,after heavly porting it and dominator on my 230 cnc heads the loss is around 16 cfm ,how close have you guys got .


1.37 60 ft [email]6.0@113[/email] [email]9.57@141[/email] 408 glide 3550lbs
new video http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Xvq3ZObywQE
Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Ian] #1625591
05/30/14 09:16 AM
05/30/14 09:16 AM
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Posts: 1,051
The Great White North
RAMM Offline OP
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Closer to -50 cfm through intake OOTB. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625592
05/30/14 11:40 AM
05/30/14 11:40 AM
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Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline
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Raw air numbers really only tell part of the story, creating a charge in the plenum can more than offset "raw" port numbers...particulary when you consider any given intake valve is completely closed roughly 2/3'ds of the time. Not to mention solid fuel volume displaces about ~7.5% of that air in a carb'ed motor. So a raw 300 cf/minute can really only meter ~100 cf within the roughly just over 20 seconds of each minute it gets to do it. And for half of that 20 seconds (on a street cammed motor like this one, more like ~27-28 total in a high RPM race motor) the valve is on it's closing ramp. It's pretty amazing the A/F can get in there (let alone out) as well as it does.

Last edited by Streetwize; 05/30/14 11:44 AM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Streetwize] #1625593
05/30/14 12:12 PM
05/30/14 12:12 PM
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The Great White North
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Quote:

Raw air numbers really only tell part of the story, creating a charge in the plenum can more than offset "raw" port numbers...particulary when you consider any given intake valve is completely closed roughly 2/3'ds of the time. Not to mention solid fuel volume displaces about ~7.5% of that air in a carb'ed motor. So a raw 300 cf/minute can really only meter ~100 cf within the roughly just over 20 seconds of each minute it gets to do it. And for half of that 20 seconds (on a street cammed motor like this one, more like ~27-28 total in a high RPM race motor) the valve is on it's closing ramp. It's pretty amazing the A/F can get in there (let alone out) as well as it does.




This is exactly why I don't put a lot of stock in intake manifold flow numbers. I have seen 400+cfm heads with sheetmetal TR's lose nothing when flowed on the head and not make any more power than an intake that imposes a severe penalty in flow. Flow just isn't the end all be all--especially when applied to the intake manifold. J.Rob


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Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625594
06/01/14 06:58 PM
06/01/14 06:58 PM
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SoCal
Brian Hafliger Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Impressive #'s. Big time port work to get 300 cfm from those heads. Nice combo. Torque curve nice and broad - and not too far up in to the rpm range.




Thanks guys. Yes the heads are worked extensively as is the intake manifold. I don't find the torque to be all that impressive. I tested at 4000 rpm and it produced 410-415 ft/lbs. However what is impressive is the little .507" net lift after .018" lash cam made even what it did. I was expecting much less to be honest maybe 485-500 hp max. J.Rob




What don't you like about the TQ...is it the curve or amount or both?

I love that cam, works so good in dirt track engines.


Brian Hafliger
Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: RAMM] #1625595
06/01/14 07:30 PM
06/01/14 07:30 PM
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Posts: 5,894
Florida
Locomotion Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Raw air numbers really only tell part of the story, creating a charge in the plenum can more than offset "raw" port numbers...particulary when you consider any given intake valve is completely closed roughly 2/3'ds of the time. Not to mention solid fuel volume displaces about ~7.5% of that air in a carb'ed motor. So a raw 300 cf/minute can really only meter ~100 cf within the roughly just over 20 seconds of each minute it gets to do it. And for half of that 20 seconds (on a street cammed motor like this one, more like ~27-28 total in a high RPM race motor) the valve is on it's closing ramp. It's pretty amazing the A/F can get in there (let alone out) as well as it does.




This is exactly why I don't put a lot of stock in intake manifold flow numbers. I have seen 400+cfm heads with sheetmetal TR's lose nothing when flowed on the head and not make any more power than an intake that imposes a severe penalty in flow. Flow just isn't the end all be all--especially when applied to the intake manifold. J.Rob




Going another step from the dual plane that Streetwize suggested, if you weren't so happy with the torque numbers, have you considered a more conservative single plane, like a Holley Strip Dominator or M1 single plane and experiment with 4-hole, tapered and open spacers? I know the original Victor has a bigger plenum than the intakes I mentioned, so I would assume that the SV intake is even bigger.

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Locomotion] #1625596
06/01/14 10:55 PM
06/01/14 10:55 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
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Toronto
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mshred Offline
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Maybe off topic, but is the engine internal or external balance? I assume internal with the aftermarket steel crank, but thought I'd ask.

Nice numbers

Re: 360 Street/Strip Bruiser-Dyno results inside [Re: Brian Hafliger] #1625597
06/02/14 01:50 AM
06/02/14 01:50 AM
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The Great White North
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Impressive #'s. Big time port work to get 300 cfm from those heads. Nice combo. Torque curve nice and broad - and not too far up in to the rpm range.




Thanks guys. Yes the heads are worked extensively as is the intake manifold. I don't find the torque to be all that impressive. I tested at 4000 rpm and it produced 410-415 ft/lbs. However what is impressive is the little .507" net lift after .018" lash cam made even what it did. I was expecting much less to be honest maybe 485-500 hp max. J.Rob




What don't you like about the TQ...is it the curve or amount or both?

I love that cam, works so good in dirt track engines.




I guess I am a little dissatisfied with the amount I saw at 4000rpm followed by the steep rise to 5200 rpm. I figured the TQ would be a little broader considering the length of the runners of the intake manifold. J.Rob


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