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Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? #1596266 03/21/14 05:49 PM 03/21/14 05:49 PM
Joined: Sep 2013 Posts: 464 KY Telvis OP mopar
Telvis OP mopar Joined: Sep 2013 Posts: 464 KY	What rockers would you use for a set of aluminum Edelbrock heads 6017's and a mild Voodoo cam in a 340? The eddies recommend roller rockers and I am still working to diagnose a valve train noise issue with the stock rockers. So, I am considering going ahead and popping for some adjustable rockers. Are there any adjustable rockers that will work with the Edelbrock heads that will use my stock hydraulic lifters? I thought about 273 rockers but have heard conflicting info on their use with hydraulic lifters. I just built the motor and the lifters are new. Plus I really don't wan't to yank my intake if I don't have to. I'm just skittish about the stock rockers ability to hold up. Last edited by Telvis; 03/21/14 06:18 PM. That's King Weenie to you!

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Telvis] #1596267 03/21/14 10:15 PM 03/21/14 10:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 792 Earth R Rob C super stock
Rob C super stock R Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 792 Earth	I, myself am running Comp Cam roller rockers. The part number escapes me at the moment. I have had them a very long time now. Another place to seriously consider would be Hughes engines. You may need new pushrods. I am currently unaware of a roller rocker that has a cup end. Length is also a issue. Hughes engines can rent you a tool to check pushrod length. They will deduct the rental price if you purchase new pushrods from them off the new pushrods.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Rob C] #1596268 03/22/14 12:19 AM 03/22/14 12:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN A ahy master
ahy master A Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN	I would think any good quality roller rocker would work with the existing lifters. Pushrods... maybe maybe not. For correct oiling and geometry, there should generally be 1 or 2 threads showing on the adjusters after they are dialed in. Push rod length may need to be different to get there. I like and use the Comp cast alloy steel "pro magnum" rockers. The ductile iron rockers are supposed to be good also. Both of these need a hardened rocker shaft.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: ahy] #1596269 03/22/14 01:09 AM 03/22/14 01:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas 70AARcuda master
70AARcuda master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas	Drove my 73 340 duster with eddy heads and stock non adjustable rockers for several years with no problem...also used crane ductile iron rockers too... Hughes sells quality roller rockers... Tony 70 AARCuda Vitamin C 71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield) 71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas) 71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Telvis] #1596270 03/22/14 10:07 AM 03/22/14 10:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,074 Niles , Ohio T therocks oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
therocks oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah. T Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,074 Niles , Ohio	My opinion rollers on a mild cam are a waste of $$$$.Ive had guys run both BBs and SBs that were mild with stock rockers.The iron adjustables are better though.I run irons on my 440 with almost .600 lift.Been on for 5 years.Rocky Chrysler Firepower

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Telvis] #1596271 03/22/14 10:19 AM 03/22/14 10:19 AM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 28,312 Cincinnati, Ohio Challenger 1 Too Many Posts
Challenger 1 Too Many Posts Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 28,312 Cincinnati, Ohio	Quote: What rockers would you use for a set of aluminum Edelbrock heads 6017's and a mild Voodoo cam in a 340? The eddies recommend roller rockers and I am still working to diagnose a valve train noise issue with the stock rockers. So, I am considering going ahead and popping for some adjustable rockers. Are there any adjustable rockers that will work with the Edelbrock heads that will use my stock hydraulic lifters? I thought about 273 rockers but have heard conflicting info on their use with hydraulic lifters. I just built the motor and the lifters are new. Plus I really don't wan't to yank my intake if I don't have to. I'm just skittish about the stock rockers ability to hold up. Both my 440 and my 340 have edlebrock heads on them now. Edlebrock recommends adjustable rockers arms, not roller rockers. Because there are so many variances in even stock engines, that sometimes stock length pushrods are going to be the wrong length. With adj rockers you can compensate for that. Sometimes they are the right length and guys can run stock non adjustable rockers just fine. You must understand how to insure you have the right pre load with hydraulic lifters. It don't matter one bit what kind of rockers you are running. You must have the intake manifold off to setup pre load so you can see the lifter and the plunger inside it,IMO. It's a lot harder to do with a stock rocker on a shaft. Individual adjustable rockers are much easier and more precise to check for proper pre load. FWIW I have been running Crane gold rockers on both my cars with hydraulic cams for over 20+ years on my 340. I used them on both iron and aluminum heads. I have beat the crap out of my 340 over the years and they are still in the motor today. Drove the car last night. Last edited by Challenger 1; 03/22/14 10:43 AM.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Challenger 1] #1596272 03/23/14 10:08 AM 03/23/14 10:08 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN A ahy master
ahy master A Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN	Perhaps a clarification on "roller rockers". I am thinking of "roller tip" rockers with plain bearings on the shaft. Rockers with needle bearings on the shaft are not needed on a MOPAR - even a pretty hot one. The shaft roller bearings are expensive and subject to failure. A good quality steel, iron or aluminum adjustable roller tip/plain shaft bearing rocker should work well in your application. Just stay away from the low cost/cheapie aluminum rockers as they can fail early.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: ahy] #1596273 03/23/14 12:05 PM 03/23/14 12:05 PM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,544 Syracuse,NY CompWedgeEngines master
CompWedgeEngines master Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,544 Syracuse,NY	Rockers with needle bearings on the shaft are not needed on a MOPAR - even a pretty hot one. The shaft roller bearings are expensive and subject to failure. This statement is simply not true. I've been buidling Mopar engines for 27 years, and I have used a lot of different rockers. Within that period, I have used many many sets of roller bearing rockers, and on some pretty stout pieces, without failure.Internet folklore loves to scare people off with roller bearing rocker failures. 99.5% of the time, if one DOES fail, there is another reason that should have been addressed or corrected to begin with. But to make a general statement , they are failure prone, is misinformation. Now, on to your next statement: Just stay away from the low cost/cheapie aluminum rockers as they can fail early. This IS true. This is the only reason that a roller bearing rocker arm typically fails. The offshore rocker arms are garbage. Just to be clear, I am NOT busting your chops, merely sharing many years of experience and subsequent engine diagnosing from stock drivers to blown alcohol engines. RIP Monte Smith Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality. WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: CompWedgeEngines] #1596274 03/23/14 01:28 PM 03/23/14 01:28 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	Quote: This statement is simply not true. I've been buidling Mopar engines for 27 years, and I have used a lot of different rockers. Within that period, I have used many many sets of roller bearing rockers, and on some pretty stout pieces, without failure.Internet folklore loves to scare people off with roller bearing rocker failures. 99.5% of the time, if one DOES fail, there is another reason that should have been addressed or corrected to begin with. But to make a general statement , they are failure prone, is misinformation. Question, have you seen any improvement in power with a plain bearing rocker vs a roller bearing rocker on any Mopar engine? Plain bearing, shaft mounted rockers are fairly low friction setups to begin with and wonder if there is really any documented proof going to a roller bearing in this application is a benefit in power production. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Supercuda] #1596275 03/23/14 01:44 PM 03/23/14 01:44 PM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,544 Syracuse,NY CompWedgeEngines master
CompWedgeEngines master Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,544 Syracuse,NY	That is a debate that will go on long after we're dead and gone....lol...the manufacters will tell you yes, personal proof of JUST the friction aspect...no. ( to be fair, I've never JUST taken a set if ductiles for example, and then swapped JUST for a roller rocker set on the dyno) That being said, what typically happens, is you get a better rocker, with better RATIO and then the answer is yes. Sometimes substantial. When you play with stock eliminator stuff, class engines etc, it really becomes apparent, as well as bigger inch motors where the higher ratio camshafts are used. I'm going to end my answer there, because everytime this comes up, there are 9,000 naysayers that have some sort of negative comment to make about " better " rockers, and they lack of value. Simply not the case, but I'm tired of arguing it for 25 years....lol...there is also reasonable argument, as to WHEN do you need a better rocker arm. Most street cars simply dont care. When a guys says " Iv e been running them for 15 years without a problem", that means nothing to me.How many miles has it ran, how many passes has it made, how many RPMS has it sustained, how much spring pressure does it endure and so forth. Years mean nothing unless there is data behind it. What most good rocker arms DO do, that many others dont, is keep the valve guides and valves from side loading, and wearing out the valve guides, which in trun makes the valve job worse, which hinders valve seal etc. Thats what many forget. Also, there is a huge difference between older rockers, and some newer designs, as far as rocker tip, and roller tip centering over the valves. Some of the older ones are just WRONG for the newer heads. RIP Monte Smith Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality. WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: CompWedgeEngines] #1596276 03/23/14 02:29 PM 03/23/14 02:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,238 Nevada D dezduster pro stock
dezduster pro stock D Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,238 Nevada	25 years worth of insight, that's useful right there.. Thank you for sharing. Having said that I will say. I have had both roller fulcrum Harland Sharps, Crane and now Hughes. I believe the roller fulcrum uses more oil which takes more from the bottom end. This is only my opinion no proof. Any quality one will certainly perform better than stock. I have swapped from stock rockers to Crane rollers on a engine with a small cam and good springs, the results were surprising 500 plus useable RPM. It idled better and pulled harder on our up hill grade in top gear. Considering how bad stock stamped rocker ratios are or can be. I am certain the resulting improvements were a result of that and correct lifter preload.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: dezduster] #1596277 03/23/14 02:55 PM 03/23/14 02:55 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	Quote: 25 years worth of insight, that's useful right there.. Thank you for sharing. Having said that I will say. I have had both roller fulcrum Harland Sharps, Crane and now Hughes. I believe the roller fulcrum uses more oil which takes more from the bottom end. This is only my opinion no proof. Any quality one will certainly perform better than stock. I have swapped from stock rockers to Crane rollers on a engine with a small cam and good springs, the results were surprising 500 plus useable RPM. It idled better and pulled harder on our up hill grade in top gear. Considering how bad stock stamped rocker ratios are or can be. I am certain the resulting improvements were a result of that and correct lifter preload. Ah, but the question wasn't about rocker ratios, just was there any tangible benefit from a roller fulcrum on a shaft mounted rocker that was documented. Not interested in extrapolations based on observed data from stud mounted rockers, not interested in gains based on rocker ratios, whether do due improved accuracy or increased ratios. Just is there a tangible improvement using rollers at the fulcrum over the plain bearing design. Any by relationship is the cost benefit worth it? If I gain 5hp with roller fulcrum bearings but it cost me $200 more for them, not worth it in my book. But if I gain 200hp for an extra $5, then I'd be stupid not to use them. Extreme example but you get the point. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Supercuda] #1596278 03/24/14 03:35 PM 03/24/14 03:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376 D dogdays I Live Here
dogdays I Live Here D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,376	To the OP: You can run stock stamped rockers on your Edelbrock heads IF YOU GET THE PUSHROD LENGTHS RIGHT! You can run 273 adjustable rockers on your Edelbrock heads IF THE PUSHROD ENDS ARE THE RIGHT SIZE AND SHAPE! Speaking from a mechanical engineering standpoint, there is no advantage to using roller bearings in a rocker arm fulcrum, as long as the plain bearings are adequately sized and fed the proper amount of oil to provide the hydrodynamic wedge. Look at Isky's roller lifters that use plain bearings in the rollers. Aftermarket rocker arms are much more likely to have a correct ratio than stamped steel rockers. I don't know why this is so, because it would take no more effort to stamp a correct ratio rocker, but nearly all of them are short on ratio, meaning real valve lift suffers. Now if the engine is overcammed, it probably doesn't hurt. But with a properly sized camshaft, the short ratio really does hurt power. For any rocker that one uses, using the correct length pushrod with the correct ends is a necessity. It's that simple. I believe the reason Edelbrock says to use adjustable rockers is to avoid problems with pushrod length. You know, a customer buys the heads, installs them with stock pushrods that are the wrong length for the assembly, then blames the head manufacturer. Customer goes online and blasts the head manufacturer. They don't need this. R.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Telvis] #1596279 03/24/14 06:54 PM 03/24/14 06:54 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,142 Tucson, AZ C cruzin super stock
cruzin super stock C Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,142 Tucson, AZ	Telvis, I used Comp Cams, Pro Magnum P/N 1622-16 with E-Head 340/416 and a hyd. Voodoo Cam. They come with shafts and spacers. At the time I also order a set of Hughes P/N 15063 which are a 1.6 ratio. The Comps are Chromoly steel the Hughes are aluminum. For me, after mocking them up the Comp rockers got the nod. Good luck.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: cruzin] #1596280 03/24/14 08:16 PM 03/24/14 08:16 PM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 28,312 Cincinnati, Ohio Challenger 1 Too Many Posts
Challenger 1 Too Many Posts Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 28,312 Cincinnati, Ohio	Quote: Telvis, I used Comp Cams, Pro Magnum P/N 1622-16 with E-Head 340/416 and a hyd. Voodoo Cam. They come with shafts and spacers. At the time I also order a set of Hughes P/N 15063 which are a 1.6 ratio. The Comps are Chromoly steel the Hughes are aluminum. For me, after mocking them up the Comp rockers got the nod. Good luck. Edlebrock tech also highly recommend 1.5 ratio rocker arms on LA SB and BB heads. He said install the cam with the lift you want with 1.5 rockers which work the best with the least stress on the valve train/head clearance issues. IMO a 1.5 engine will have a more stable valve train than a 1.6 setup. In other words don't rely on 1.6 rockers to get you the lift/duration, get it from the cam.

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Challenger 1] #1596281 03/24/14 08:33 PM 03/24/14 08:33 PM
Joined: Sep 2013 Posts: 464 KY Telvis OP mopar
Telvis OP mopar Joined: Sep 2013 Posts: 464 KY	Thanks for all the advice. That's King Weenie to you!

Re: Recommended rockers for 340 with Edelbrock heads?? [Re: Challenger 1] #1596282 03/24/14 08:40 PM 03/24/14 08:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 5,105 Western Md. skicker "The Champ"
skicker "The Champ" Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 5,105 Western Md.	^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ He's right. The 1.6's installed on a 340 are a crutch. 1.5 with the cam lift you want is the way to go. ...FAFO...

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