sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
#1560835
01/08/14 02:59 PM
01/08/14 02:59 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
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New England
Q5_Ed
OP
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OP
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New England
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I am restoring an A12 road runner and putting in a 493 stroker. The car is a post coupe but Im thinking I should do something to stiffen it but don't really want to cut into the new floor. So should I do nothing, weld in connectors, or just install torque boxes?
This will be 99 percent street with a rare trip to the track for fun.
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69 A12 road runner ,Q5, post coupe, 4 speed, former Drag car restored to "Driver" condition in the early 90's, Showing some Patina. SS/E Track Record Holder 1980 10.40 @ 130mph
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: Q5_Ed]
#1560836
01/08/14 03:34 PM
01/08/14 03:34 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
Polarapete
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I put homemade sub-frame connectors in my '68 Coronet bracket car. They were rectangular 2"x3" tubes that sliced through the floor pan and were welded front, back and to the floor pan. Made a noticeable difference in how the car felt, more so after the roll cage was installed. Even so, the leading edge of the left quarter panel would crack right next to the door. Of course, I had a race 440, 727, Dana 60 w/ 4.88s and 13x31x15 M/T slicks. I think that if you subject your car to the same stress level as I did mine, you should expect the same results. Big motor + sticky tires + full-throttle starts = body flex 
1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: Polarapete]
#1560837
01/08/14 04:46 PM
01/08/14 04:46 PM
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Posts: 2,431
SK,Canada
gregsrt
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You could use the Mopar Performance style, they are bolt in but I always weld them in. The don't go through the floor. Here's the best pic I have
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#1560839
01/08/14 05:19 PM
01/08/14 05:19 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
Polarapete
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 My install was part of a larger project that involved building boxes that held the front spring eye and recessed them into the rear subframe. I drilled four pairs of spring mounting holes in each box: an upper and lower for the stock spring length and an upper and lower for the SS springs that I never got around to buying. I built the wheel tubs from sheet steel that I bent to fit. With the big tires, the car was amazingly consistent and always drove straight...particularly since I built it all by myself in a big truck shop (Totem Truck & Tractor Repair), with no precise measuring tools, an unfamiliar arc welder, etc.. I remember falling asleep, late at night, under the car more than once and the guys would wake me up when they came to work the next day. I got the shop use if I helped the truck mechanics some during the day. My project went into high gear when the shop owner told me the IRS was going to be locking up his shop because he had not paid his 941 taxes. My car was nearly the last one in the shop 
1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: JohnRR]
#1560847
01/09/14 12:57 PM
01/09/14 12:57 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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Quote:
Torque boxes keep the front spring hangers from being distorted, frame connectors stiffen the unibody. You can put in frame connectors and still distort the front spring hangers because the connectors only connect to the frame rails and not the front spring hanger mount.
Torques boxes at a minimum and if you want to put in connectors too use a tube size that will not touch the floor ... or get the US car tool type that weld to the underside of the floor.
I thing we are comparing apples to oranges, for the OP, I don't think distorting spring hangers is in the cards in any situation, and IMO n all but the most demanding High HP situation,frame connectors welded in would eliminate the majority of any possible distortion on the spring hangers. And if that is the real concern their are better solutions, and when moving springs inward, a dead issue. All this means, I disagree. 
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: ahy]
#1560848
01/09/14 02:52 PM
01/09/14 02:52 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,168
Vancouver, WA
MoparMarq
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super stock
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Vancouver, WA
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Quote:
I run the 2" welded connectors. They make a huge difference in stiffness and run under the floor. I used ART (Auto Rust Technicians) connectors. I believe they offer similar for B body's or you can DIY.
If I had to choose one, torque boxes or conectors, I'd choose the connectors... I actually run both.
Same here (connectors and boxes). Mine are on a '72, so the connectors run through the floor. But regardless, at least get the connectors - even if they are only the weld-on-the-underside style. I can lift the car at one corner now and still open either door without jamming. Before, no way.
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: JohnRR]
#1560849
01/09/14 08:02 PM
01/09/14 08:02 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,896
New England
Q5_Ed
OP
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OP
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John I think the hotchkis would eliminate the distortion issue? Not crazy about how they hang down, but looks like easiest for future removal if ever desired.
WANTED : ...A New Sponsor or Winning Lottery Ticket
69 A12 road runner ,Q5, post coupe, 4 speed, former Drag car restored to "Driver" condition in the early 90's, Showing some Patina. SS/E Track Record Holder 1980 10.40 @ 130mph
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: jcc]
#1560850
01/10/14 07:19 PM
01/10/14 07:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,978
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
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U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
Torque boxes keep the front spring hangers from being distorted, frame connectors stiffen the unibody. You can put in frame connectors and still distort the front spring hangers because the connectors only connect to the frame rails and not the front spring hanger mount.
Torques boxes at a minimum and if you want to put in connectors too use a tube size that will not touch the floor ... or get the US car tool type that weld to the underside of the floor.
I thing we are comparing apples to oranges, for the OP, I don't think distorting spring hangers is in the cards in any situation, and IMO n all but the most demanding High HP situation,frame connectors welded in would eliminate the majority of any possible distortion on the spring hangers. And if that is the real concern their are better solutions, and when moving springs inward, a dead issue. All this means, I disagree.
Yes it may be apples and oranges but he asked about BOTH, Hemi cars have boxed spring hangers from the factory for a reason. Sub frame connectors do not touch any part of the front spring hanger so there is zero chance of them adding any support.
Ed's going to be show poodling the thing anyway so he is just wasting time and money having either installed 
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Re: sub frame connectors b-body vs torque boxes only
[Re: Q5_Ed]
#1560851
01/10/14 07:23 PM
01/10/14 07:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,978
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
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I Win
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Quote:
John I think the hotchkis would eliminate the distortion issue? Not crazy about how they hang down, but looks like easiest for future removal if ever desired.
If you are thinking of removing them already do not even bother, you know when the time comes you are going to not have them installed after you have already bought them ... remember the mini tubs and springs were going to be moved in , now they aren't ...
You're undoing all the buthchery and you know you won't want to undo it again ...
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If they will anything is better than nothing 
If you do decide to make and use some cut the front edge of the rear sub frames so you can slide the connector into them several inches and weld them into the rear sub frames 
