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Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #1517468
10/17/13 03:31 PM
10/17/13 03:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,068
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,068
Irving, TX
64 Wedgie scoop would work but I'm partial to those.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: feets] #1517469
10/17/13 06:36 PM
10/17/13 06:36 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger Offline
master
72Swinger  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
I dont care for the 6 pack scoops on anything other than a A12 car. A scoop than flows well with the older lines like a 64-65 SS scoop gets my vote too. If its possible no scoop at all would be my first choice.


Mopar to the bone!!!
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1517470
10/17/13 10:09 PM
10/17/13 10:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
3
340duster340 Offline
master
340duster340  Offline
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3

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
i cant find and 64 valients, but here is a 64 baracuda with cowl....i think a cowl like this, but 1 inch shorter and perhaps 2x as wide would look really cool. kinda like a low bulge basically the whole middle of the hood.




here is 64 valiant/or dart? with the early style scoop (not sure what its called)


65 baracuda with aar style scoop


1966 Dart GT ...down to only 1 mopar for the first time in 15 years!
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 340duster340] #1517471
10/17/13 10:22 PM
10/17/13 10:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
3
340duster340 Offline
master
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3

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
here is 64 barracuda (similar lines) with hood scoop like the one OP has rendered


Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 340duster340] #1517472
10/17/13 10:32 PM
10/17/13 10:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
3
340duster340 Offline
master
340duster340  Offline
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3

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Posts: 4,323
NY NY
now that i think of it a vented bulge hood like on a mustang would look nice too.


1966 Dart GT ...down to only 1 mopar for the first time in 15 years!
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 340duster340] #1517473
10/18/13 12:07 AM
10/18/13 12:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
T
TC@HP2 Offline
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TC@HP2  Offline
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T

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Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
I think with the hooked flair line on the fornt fender, an AAR style hood would blend in well and look right at home.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: TC@HP2] #1517474
10/19/13 12:28 PM
10/19/13 12:28 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 126
mass
K
kotacars Offline
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kotacars  Offline
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K

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 126
mass
I spoke to these guys just to see what the suspension saw going to be this will be a purpose built race car not much mopar left

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: kotacars] #1517475
10/19/13 12:32 PM
10/19/13 12:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
Mr Wizzard
ScottSmith_Harms  Offline
Mr Wizzard

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
Quote:


I spoke to these guys just to see what the suspension saw going to be this will be a purpose built race car not much mopar left




To me these currently "in vogue" purpose built (to be basically a rolling billboard ad for the parts suppliers) cars are not very exciting, especially when the only part of the car left after all the parts swapping and mods is the outer skin of the car it once was. Sort of like a modern day NASCAR, nothing much unique or brand specific is left of them.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #1517476
10/19/13 01:16 PM
10/19/13 01:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
autoxcuda Offline
Too Many Posts
autoxcuda  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
Quote:

Quote:


I spoke to these guys just to see what the suspension saw going to be this will be a purpose built race car not much mopar left




To me these currently "in vogue" purpose built (to be basically a rolling billboard ad for the parts suppliers) cars are not very exciting, especially when the only part of the car left after all the parts swapping and mods is the outer skin of the car it once was. Sort of like a modern day NASCAR, nothing much unique or brand specific is left of them.






They are basically skin jobs and custom kit cars. A lot of it is fabrication is for fabrication's sake. It justifies these shops existance and they are going after coorporate advertising dollars.

Also the shop sells a customer on a project for six figures let's say for the parts, labor, and design. Then it get companies to donate the parts to advertise them in magazine articles and other promotions. So the shop just gets to add the free parts to it net profit. Great way to double dip.

These fab shops are popping up all over Southern California. I bet there are over 30 of these shops from a 10 mile radius of where I'm typing this right now.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: autoxcuda] #1517477
10/25/13 09:01 PM
10/25/13 09:01 PM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 47
Indianapolis.IN
prrc Offline
member
prrc  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 47
Indianapolis.IN
Still all mopar here. But the same type of build.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: prrc] #1517478
10/25/13 09:03 PM
10/25/13 09:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 47
Indianapolis.IN
prrc Offline
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prrc  Offline
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Posts: 47
Indianapolis.IN
A shot from thr rear.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: prrc] #1517479
10/27/13 12:07 AM
10/27/13 12:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,813
A collage of whims
topside Offline
Too Many Posts
topside  Offline
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Posts: 20,813
A collage of whims
Two observations, if I may:
1. If it's a high-speed car, I'd be VENTING the hood rather than adding a scoop.
2. Hot-rod fabricators are one thing, but a real racecar fabricator is better for a car that will actually race. There's one such guy in Santa Clarita: his stuff runs at the front, is spot-on out of the box, and I trust the guy with my life.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: autoxcuda] #1517480
10/28/13 10:37 AM
10/28/13 10:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
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TC@HP2 Offline
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T

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
With the proliferation of television car builds that are style over substance, combined with the number of people willing to throw six figure builds at a fab shop, I'm really not surprised by the number of shops popping up that can cut and weld metal, pop suspension points into a geometry program and say they build cutting edge cars.

I agree with topside, if you want to build a race car go to a race shop.

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1517481
11/02/13 01:35 PM
11/02/13 01:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
H
HotRodChassis Offline
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HotRodChassis  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
Greetings! My name is Kevin Tully, and I own Hot Rod Chassis & Cycle. I was browsing around the web, and see that someone posted our build on here. Cool site, and glad to meet you all. I thought if some of you wanted to ask questions during the build, I'd be happy to answer them. Reading many of the posts, I'd like the say thanks for the many kind words.

I'd also like to address some of the comments. Building race cars of just about any type often involves updating the suspension, or modifying the car almost entirely as far as the chassis goes. And we aren't just a hot rod shop. I'm a military aircraft fabricator by trade. That being said, EVERY car we build I ensure to the best of my ability that the person life is safe. Safety is paramount in our shop. We no longer build mild steel cages (and haven't for almost 8 years) because of that. When we observed SFI/NHRA making mild steel cage times slower and slower, we made the decision to pass on those jobs for that time on. Every stick car we build gets a Quicktime scatter shield. They all get drive shaft loops, often front and rear. And many other safety features most builders don't put in an average street car. And for racing, I apprenticed under Mark Constantine at Autofab Racecars in Maryland after I got out. We regularly built cars to dipped into the 5's there. I also built the 2009 World Fastest Nostalgia Super Stock, a legit 1963 Plymouth Savoy Factory Super Stock called "Keep'n The Faith". It no longer runs super stock springs, but a pair of ladder bars and a full race 9" that I also fabricated and used Moser Engineer guts in. We regularly build 8-10 sec dragsters, many of which may look like hot rods, but are full on dragsters. Psycoholic (a 1930 Model A Tudor), The Two Timer (a '32 Ford Pickup), Maximum Evil (a '27 Ford T Coupe), The Hot Rod With No Name (a '31 Ford Model A Coupe), and many others, to include a land speed chassis. We're currently working on a '33 Dodge Coupe with a stroked early Hemi, and a '34 Chrysler Coupe that will run an injected, stroked 440. Both are street strip cars that sport ladder bars.

We've been in business for 10 years, so I'm not sure about "popping up." Everyone's shop has a starting date. Some open a shop to fill a need in an area. Some because of a current craze. Some because someone is crazy enough to open a shop (trust me, running a small business with our current government and the economy is a no light task).

I appreciate all the suggestions on the hood scoop. We wanted to stick with a MoPar hood scoop, but needed one that would enclose the required injector stack height. Trust me, I would love to have used the AAR scoop. It's one of my favorites, and would tie in the Tran-Am feel nicely. But, the Six Pack scoop fit that bill. As for not running a scoop facing forward, many forms of racing use a forward facing hood scoop. Drag racing, land speed, road course. Above say 120 mph, you do have to vent the scoop. If you look at most cars using a hood scoop, you'll find vents in the air pan at the back to prevent over-pressuring the scoop. This will have the same design.

As for receiving donated parts and then "selling them" to the customer to rake in money, I think not. If you ask around, we are one of the most honest shops in our area. I was raised with the Golden Rule and a yard stick. Never, in my life, would I receive a donated part from a manufacturer, and then nefariously sell it for money. And, as anyone in the industry will tell you, that's a quick way to burn all your bridges at once.

Badging, or decaling a car. Well, you see that in every form of racing back to the start of speed parts just about. And it was no different in Trans-Am. Manufacturers want people to know who's parts are on your car, and the decal is a trade. You're advertising their product, and they give you one to use. It's that simple. Other than the shop name, all the other badging are decals that will eventually be removed after a few years of racing.

On the "no MoPar left" comment, how much is none? We'll be using a 440, 2010 Charger Police Pursuit brakes, '64 Super Stock seats (yes, real ones), Legendary is making us an OEM interior kit, 6-Pack hood scoop, '64 Barracuda turn signals, we're keeping the stock steering column and all the trim, etc, etc. I would dare say that many of our favorite Dodge and Plymouth dragsters or land speed cars (like Blowfish) used as much MoPar as is safe, and the rest became fabricated.

Our whole goal here wasn't to bolt on aftermarket parts and go see how well we could do. The goal is to barge into the heavily dominated by General Motors, Autocross and Road Race challenge events. And the cars we're going after are far from being warmed over stock GM cars.

We hope many of you are happy to have someone willing to champion MoPar into a field dominated by the General. And will follow the build and enjoy it. If any of you are ever in or near Chicago, and you'd like to stop by (even on the weekend) just give us a call. I'd be happy to show you the project (even if it means meeting you on a Sunday).

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: HotRodChassis] #1517482
11/02/13 03:08 PM
11/02/13 03:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger Offline
master
72Swinger  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
I still think a more period correct look like a 63-65 Super Stock scoop would blend in way better and still accomplish what you want.


Mopar to the bone!!!
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1517483
11/02/13 03:18 PM
11/02/13 03:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
H
HotRodChassis Offline
member
HotRodChassis  Offline
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H

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
Quote:

I still think a more period correct look like a 63-65 Super Stock scoop would blend in way better and still accomplish what you want.




I don't disagree with you. We actually got one from VFN. It was almost the size of the hood. We also shouldn't be using a 440 (1966), or the American Racing 200s (1971).

Although we'd like to, pleasing everyone with our design just isn't going to happen. I am glad that you've taken the time to look at the design and relay your input though!

Do you have a photo of your '72 Swinger?

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: prrc] #1517484
11/02/13 03:22 PM
11/02/13 03:22 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
H
HotRodChassis Offline
member
HotRodChassis  Offline
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H

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
Quote:

A shot from thr rear.




Awesome!! Maybe we can put them in the same place at the same time when they are both done?

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: HotRodChassis] #1517485
11/02/13 05:36 PM
11/02/13 05:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch Offline
pro stock
Mopar Mitch  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
HotRodChassis/Kevin... Glad to see you're in the Chgo area. I've been autocrossing since 1975 with my Challenger... belong to a few different clubs. We need to meet locally... MCACN?


Mopar Mitch "Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers! Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: Mopar Mitch] #1517486
11/02/13 07:07 PM
11/02/13 07:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
H
HotRodChassis Offline
member
HotRodChassis  Offline
member
H

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 13
Illinois
Quote:

HotRodChassis/Kevin... Glad to see you're in the Chgo area. I've been autocrossing since 1975 with my Challenger... belong to a few different clubs. We need to meet locally... MCACN?




I could go over there. The Outcast will be coming back from Nashville, so we likely won't be displaying anything. The Outcast really isn't appropriate for that show anyway. If I was further along on the Valiant, I'd bring it in progress. Will you have your car there?

Re: Project : Violent Valiant [Re: HotRodChassis] #1517487
11/02/13 09:47 PM
11/02/13 09:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger Offline
master
72Swinger  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
Quote:

Quote:

I still think a more period correct look like a 63-65 Super Stock scoop would blend in way better and still accomplish what you want.




I don't disagree with you. We actually got one from VFN. It was almost the size of the hood. We also shouldn't be using a 440 (1966), or the American Racing 200s (1971).

Although we'd like to, pleasing everyone with our design just isn't going to happen. I am glad that you've taken the time to look at the design and relay your input though!

Do you have a photo of your '72 Swinger?


Yes I do, and the scoop it has may work for you too.

7909758-dad,sdart.jpg (215 downloads)

Mopar to the bone!!!
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