This is kind of a broad spectrum thread with regard to road racing. I'm building a pro touring 73' duster and i'm at the point of needing to figure out my suspension/transmission.

1. Where do people stand on the modified torsion bar setups vs. the coilover setups(either alterkation or HDK)

2. If the coilover is the way to go. What's a good "temporary" way to make my car handle better on the torsion bars without breaking the bank?(if i go coilover, i want to still do some autox while i save)

3. My car is currently an automatic 904, but its worn out and need to be replaced. But i'm not sure if i should stay auto(either 904 w/ GV or a 200r4 conversion) or if i should spring for a stick shift? Has anyone tried the RS/SS trans from keisler on an A-body? The pictures look like it could fit with nothing more than a shift hole.


The car has a freshly rebuilt suspension using oem rubber parts and has a small factory sway bar. It just handles poorly, my DD truck(lowered on QA1 coilovers) feels like a corner carver in comparison even though its got some body roll issues.

Any advice is appreciated, thanks.

a 73 foot long car will never do good in a road race

Maybe that's the circumference and it WOULD be hard to pass.

Andy, you are starting a long journey, a lot of your questions have been addressed here in numerous other threads, you likely will get a more thorough response if you base your questions after reading up on some of those threads. There is a lot of knowledge here, just re inventing the wheel can get tiring, and i only speak for myself, so take this with the usual large grain of salt.

Here is MuMu's thread on trying to figure out A body suspension upgrades in $ order.

https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=7454875&page=0

Andy,
One typo and you're already getting ribbed. haha.

Franken and JCC make good suggestions. Do a search within this forum for torsion bars, sway bars and oversteer and I think you'll get some good background.

For competition purposes the only time one 'has to' go to coil over is when the cost of staying with torsion bar suspension becomes prohibitive. For example the need for a big bar that is not easily available and/or a lot of custom or development time. For SCCA autocross, coilover would only be alowed in Prepared (CP) or Modified classes (but I don't think Street Modified which is based on 'Street Prepared' rules).

For autocross, swapping to manual transmission is no advantage. For continuous high speed driving aka 'track days', time trials, a manual transmission will have less power loss.
All you need to do for autocross is:
- make sure suspension has no play
- brakes are adjusted properly
- a somewhat aggressive alignment helps (a little neg on camber, positive on caster)
- a front sway bar is big help, poly endlinks or bushings help too. but not neccessary*
tires that you don't feel bad about abusing

If you're looking at track time, if your in the LA area, show up at one of Tim Herron's AllTimeRacing track days and see what's involved and what people are doing.

* edit: Seeing you have a factory bar, the cheap quick step is the poly bushings and endlinks. Use super thick aftermarket washers and tube with the poly end link bushings or they will punch through.
Alighnment, tires are the first places to start making improvements. Reading between the lines it seems you don't like the body roll. Tolerance of roll varies heavily from driver to driver, but a bigger front sway bar is the place to start, and then some stiffer torsion bars. If you can afford the ground clearance, lower the front 'ride height' and move the front leaf spring eye up using an AR hanger.

Not sure anyone has shown up at an open track day with a coil over conversion Mopar and beat up on the torsion bar cars. Maybe it could happen, maybe not.

If you look around a little bit you'll see that the torsion bar cars can be built to run really hard. Of course, when they are set up that way they ride like dump trucks but you can't have your cake and eat it too!

John Sandberg's SCCA C/Prepared Solo/autocross race AAR Cuda swapped his front end over from his 1.24 TBs and factory k-frame to coil-over front suspension for a couple reasons:

1. Reduced overall weight on the front end (included rack-pionion steering setup and customer k-frame)

2. Stiffer front suspension than his 1.24 TBs for competition

He's driven the car on a couple road course lapping session events and the car handles is awesome (even as its setup for medium speed Solo.autocross).

Always have to remember.. its not just the TBs/stiffness.. its an overall "package" -- front, rear, etc.

Even with 1.24 TBs (speaking from my E-body experience), the ride is not bad at all for the street/hwy... and great for a "component" towards improved "competition" autocross and/or road course events (just part of the "package").

Right. But as Ryan explained, going larger than 1.24" t-bars was not on the table for them at that time. We know its been done ('70 transam e-bodies) and its in the Oval Track book for banked circle tracks. If you can get the parts, or have them made, its still doable (withtime and money). But anyway that's way off track (so to speak) for this guy. He wasn't asking about building a competition car, just a pro-touring look and maybe some occassional autocross. For that, there's no performance or economics advantage to go to coil over.

"....there's no performance or economics advantage to go to coil over."... for the OP.

Agreed.

not trying to steel this thread but on the F bodies would it be worth going with the rms altraKtion frame over the sideways torsion bars?

thanks for the input

the complete car is being redone

I have found a used AlterK system at a very reduced price and know the guys that is selling because he is going

thanks again for all your inputs

George

As far as I've seen AlterK is the only aftermarket company making tubular K frames for the FJM bodies. Additionally, it must be a specific FJM AlterK frame as you cannot adapt an A or B body unit to these very easily. All the primary mounting dimensions are different. The FJM cars are a bit of an anomaly as they are as wide as a B body, as heavy as a B body, but come in a wide variety of lengths despite being touted as a replacement for A bodies.