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Holley and Tune Up Questions #1451877
06/12/13 07:27 PM
06/12/13 07:27 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,723
North Austin
KnuckleDuster Offline OP
top fuel
KnuckleDuster  Offline OP
top fuel

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,723
North Austin
Looking to learn more about how to tune my engine,distrubuor and carb.

-What reference books/ videos have you found to be the most informative?

-What do I really need as far as tune up parts for a Holley and MP distrbutor.

Moparts is such a great source of info but I usually have too many questions and would like to have more info on hand in the garage.

Thanks!

Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: KnuckleDuster] #1451878
06/12/13 08:08 PM
06/12/13 08:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,457
oklahoma
F
forphorty Offline
pro stock
forphorty  Offline
pro stock
F

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,457
oklahoma
http://www.smotherssupercars.com/engineclass.html member Bigsqueeze. I could use a copy of this myself.

Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: KnuckleDuster] #1451879
06/12/13 08:44 PM
06/12/13 08:44 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
GTX MATT Offline
master
GTX MATT  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
Is this a newer, Mallory stile distributor? If so all you need is a re-curve kit from Mallory for the dizzy(MP may sell it also).

The Mallory based distributors have an easy to tune advance slot setup, in which you loosen a few screws and clock the advance plate to limit total advance. If its the older style Mopar the springs for a stock Mopar dizzy work, Mopar sells them, Mr Gasket, and some others. For these you will need to weld up the slots in the advance plate to get your desired total mechanical advance, or buy one of the advance limiter plates from Don at FBO.

First you want to figure out what initial timing works best, which will depend on your overall setup, mainly your cam specs but everything will come into play. You will most likely find that an initial advance between 15 and 25 degrees works best, anything over 18 or so MAY kick back the starter when the engines hot though. Generally the more aggressive your cam is the more timing it will like and take before it kicks back the starter. Initial timing is best to set with a vacuum gauge, as is your idle air fuel mixture. You want to tune for highest vacuum (the engine will run best with best vacuum). You can do it by ear, but you may miss some changes that are hard to perceive. Run the amount of initial timing that gives you your highest vacuum reading or the most before it kicks back the starter, whichever comes first

You want to bring the timing curve in fast, which the stock springs/weights don't do. Some people change the weights, but most just change the springs. (heavier weights will bring you in quicker). If its a Mallory they provide a chart to tell you which springs bring you in at what RPM. Typically you want full advance by 2500, I generally find that the faster you bring it in the better as long as you're not advancing/bouncing around at idle. This MAY cause issues with detonation and possibly surging at low RPMs, but I've never found that to be the case. For stock distributor type springs I like the Mr Gasket kit, but you may need to mix and match to your liking.

Then find your best total mechanical timing, typically by flogging the car at higher RPM/WOT. Typically 34-38 degrees works best, so start at 32 and add timing 2 degrees at a time.

When you're done plug in your vacuum advance, make sure it doesn't ping, and if it does you can adjust it within the vacuum canister using an allen key, I forget which size it is though but you stick it through the spout where the advance line plugs in. Be sure to figure out your best initial and total timing with the advanced disconnected and pluged.

Then tune fuel. The carb tuning depends on how deep you want to dive in an what you have for a Holley. Assuming its your basic Holley, a jet kit is as far as most will go. You can really trick it out by modifying the carb internally, but for a novice and someone without an air fuel gauge don't go there. If its vacuum secondaries a secondary spring kit will also be helpful so you can tune your secondary opening rate. Again, a vacuum gauge. You want to figure out your idle (and ideally operating) vacuum to select the best power valve (this controls when your carb will transition from the main circuit to the power/enrichment circuit).

Dont forget the basic parts to replace, fresh plugs, rotor and cap, wires if you're so inclined. Buy a good rotor and cap too!

I would do things in this order

1: Disconnect vacuum advance.

2: Figure out what your initial and total timing are now. Also figure out how much mechanical advance is in your distributor. Keep in mind your distributor probably doesn't fully advance until 4000+ rpm. You can calculate it by checking timing. Total - Initial = Mechanical advance. Or the advance plate on your distributor will have a number stamped on it when you disassemble. Multiply this number by 2 and that SHOULD be your mechanical advance. Its best to do both, because the slots may be slightly off. You don't NEED to do this, I just like to know where I started.

3: Figure out what initial timing works best. Let the car warm up. As you advance the timing the engine will raise it's idle speed. Typically I'd start at 15 and listen as the engine keeps raising idle speed. At the fastest speed, or somewhere around 20 degrees, adjust the curb idle screw and air fuel screws for the highest vacuum. Then go down 2 degrees, make sure it wont idle any better, and then go up 2 degrees? Does it idle better? If it does, adjust mixture screws and curb idle again. And continue. When you find your best initial timing make sure the car will restart with no problem and doesn't drag/kickback the starter.

4: Install light springs. Starting at 32 degrees total flog the car at 32, 34, 36, and 38 degrees of timing. Be sure that you do not hear detonation. If you do you need to back the timing off. If it still feels like its making more power at 38, try 40. I HIGHLY doubt it will like more than this.

5: Figure out what worked best for total timing. Adjust the mechanical advance to achieve the desired initial and total advance.

Once done try to find the jetting that works best for you. Start by reading the plugs. If they look lean jet up, if they look rich jet down. Its hard to do this precisely without an air/fuel gauge. Its best to bump up jets 1 size at a time (unless it looks way rich or lean). DONT jump 4 sizes. You may also need to find you need to only jet up the primaries or secondaries, so keep that in mind. Typically, though, try to keep the same stagger as what the carb came with. So if you've got 78s in the primaries and 82s in the secondaries and need to jet up, bump up to 79s and 83s.

When you think you've got the jetting right, advance and retard the timing two degrees. Does it like either better? If it does you found a new total timing. Does it now want more fuel? Less fuel? You can do it forever. How precise do you want to be?

The lazy way is to throw light springs in the distributor, set the total timing to 34-38, and call it a day.


Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: forphorty] #1451880
06/12/13 08:48 PM
06/12/13 08:48 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
GTX MATT Offline
master
GTX MATT  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
Quote:

http://www.smotherssupercars.com/engineclass.html member Bigsqueeze. I could use a copy of this myself.




Looks interesting, he just got my money


Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: GTX MATT] #1451881
06/13/13 05:32 AM
06/13/13 05:32 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,301
colorado
A
a12superbee Offline
master
a12superbee  Offline
master
A

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,301
colorado
Next to the factory service manual one of the best books you can spend you money on is this one on Holley carburetors.
http://www.classicpartsusa.com/product/LIT-81_1990/
One or two read throughs and you'll be a wizz at figuring out just what your car needs.


I can't afford this. mark
Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: GTX MATT] #1451882
06/15/13 11:59 AM
06/15/13 11:59 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,723
North Austin
KnuckleDuster Offline OP
top fuel
KnuckleDuster  Offline OP
top fuel

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,723
North Austin
GTX MATT- Thanks for taking the time to put that all down! I will be printing that out.

Thinking I will be picking up the video and book also,thanks for the recommendations yall

Re: Holley and Tune Up Questions [Re: KnuckleDuster] #1451883
06/16/13 06:20 PM
06/16/13 06:20 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
GTX MATT Offline
master
GTX MATT  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161
CT
Quote:

GTX MATT- Thanks for taking the time to put that all down! I will be printing that out.

Thinking I will be picking up the video and book also,thanks for the recommendations yall




No problem.

I watched the Smothers video this morning. It's a bit below my skill level, but there was still some good info and tips in there for me, and a good refresher. For someone tuning for the first time it'd be great, and I'm sure I'll be lending this to alot of my buddies.


Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street






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