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Critique my 408 stroker induction #1363814
01/03/13 02:40 PM
01/03/13 02:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 220
Wichita,ks.
jst19600 Offline OP
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Wichita,ks.
I have a 72 dodge dart racecar which weighs 2,800 with me in it.I built a 408 stroker for it with edelbrock heads,compression is 10.8.Cam is solid flat tappet 251/256 with .556 intake/.576 exhaust lift.Hedman 1 5/8 headers.Powerglide with Hughes 4,500 converter.9 inch with 4.10 gears and ladder bar suspension.I currently have an air gap intake and proform 750 with 1 inch spacer.This is a FOOTBRAKE car.It is deadly consistant and i probably wont change a thing but wondering if im leaving some performance on the table with the airgap and 750 carb.It runs on average of 10.70 at 121.I mix one gallon of 110 to four gallons of pump 92 for fuel.I shift at 6,500 and go thru traps about 6,700 rpm's.It 60ft's 1.48 to 1.50.Not going to change anything but carb and intake,what would you suggest,it must be able to leave off idle.

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: jst19600] #1363815
01/03/13 03:00 PM
01/03/13 03:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366 Offline
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while my 408 has more compression,(13.0-1) and more cam, .688 roller, (can't remember the duration at this time) I think you could get a little more by going to a 950 cfm carb and maybe a little better header,1.750 to 1.875 and let it breath a little better, strokers like plenum volume but not sure about the air-gap plenum size as I have never used one, possible alt may be a Victor intake as I know these are good intakes also, I run a Indy with a 2" spacer and a 1050 dommy which I know you really dont need that much, I say just a carb change will give good results by it self. jmo


Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: dartman366] #1363816
01/03/13 03:03 PM
01/03/13 03:03 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,745
Maryland
340_Dart Offline
top fuel
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Maryland
Get a Victor 340 on it. My buddy picked up .2 going from a performer RPM to a victor 340 on a stock stroke 360. From 11.00s to 10.80s

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: 340_Dart] #1363817
01/03/13 03:21 PM
01/03/13 03:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,876
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline
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mildly ported Victor 340, a manifold is cheaper than a new carb, at your weight and stall it's a slam-dunk but you may need to tweak the acc. pump shot and jets. If you can't port it and have to run an OOTB single plane, I'd go with the Holley Strip Dominator or M1. I will say an 850 or larger might be better as well, especially on a dual plane which generally wants 100cfm + (or more) than a single plane to compensate for the plenum split. Good insight to be found on the 587 HP 360, to correlate to a 408 it's.going to generally (rule of thumb cid to cfm) lower the Hp and Torque RPM roughly 10-12% lower for the same head, cam, induction and Cr.

While you're at it.... slightly O/T but related, if you get the Schoenfeld 1 7/8 x 3 1/2" slip on collector it's an easy mod to your Headman 1 5/8 -3" headers....I just did it on my 414 and put a 3 1/2" to 3" Flowmaster reducer behind it.

Last edited by Streetwize; 01/03/13 03:44 PM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: Streetwize] #1363818
01/03/13 07:38 PM
01/03/13 07:38 PM
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nc
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emarine01 Offline
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If your gona flow more in you need to ditch the 1 5/8 , its probably holding you back now...

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: emarine01] #1363819
01/03/13 07:41 PM
01/03/13 07:41 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 220
Wichita,ks.
jst19600 Offline OP
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The 1 5/8 headers are staying,the only options im exploring are carb and intake.

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: jst19600] #1363820
01/03/13 09:29 PM
01/03/13 09:29 PM
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Posts: 3,245
Between a rock & a hard place
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cudadoug Offline
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Between a rock & a hard place
I'll add this:

Some mild combo's GAIN power and torque with the Air Gap vs. the Victor intake. (Brian's street 408 he did for Car Craft comes to mind).

That said, I would to an intake swap ONLY, experiment with the fuel curve to optimize both and note the gains/loss.

THEN, I'd try a 850/950 on whatever intake ran the best...

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: cudadoug] #1363821
01/03/13 10:03 PM
01/03/13 10:03 PM
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bean town ....Ca
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WHITEDART Offline
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I think more gear would help 4.10 with a glide what is your tire size .mph rpm at the stripe 1/8 or 1/4 mile


In the 8s N/A.with Brett miller W8's
5.07 at 133 at 2700lb
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: WHITEDART] #1363822
01/04/13 07:55 AM
01/04/13 07:55 AM
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NJ central
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Scamp408 Offline
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NJ central
I gained alot going from a torkerII to the victor but my victor was port matched deep.

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: Scamp408] #1363823
01/04/13 04:24 PM
01/04/13 04:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,718
Portage,michigan
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B3422W5 Offline
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This is an off the wall thought i know

But if its a bracket car and is working perfectly now, like you said....how about not doing anything and leaving it the way it is.
An old saying i heard a while back, " if it dont stink, dont stir it"

Anyhow, just a thought


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: B3422W5] #1363824
01/04/13 06:19 PM
01/04/13 06:19 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 220
Wichita,ks.
jst19600 Offline OP
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jst19600  Offline OP
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Wichita,ks.
Yes its a bracket car and im very happy with its consistantcy.Third place points finish in Pro at Heartland Park Topeka isnt to bad.I just wondered if a carb and or intake change would pick my E.T. up significantly.I wouldnt change anything for a few thousandths,but a couple of tenths i might think about it.

Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: jst19600] #1363825
01/04/13 06:22 PM
01/04/13 06:22 PM
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Renton Washington
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Triple Threat Offline
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Renton Washington
You're not going to find a couple tenths in the intake. Leave it alone.


-Dustin
67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi
68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: Triple Threat] #1363826
01/04/13 06:53 PM
01/04/13 06:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,876
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline
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Streetwize  Offline
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Weddington, N.C.
I think it'll be worth at least between .08 and .14, possibly more in good sea level air once you sort it, the RPM is about maxed out at 6500 rpm on a 370-ish motor which means it's going to be nearly out of it's ability to move more air by ~5800 or so on a 408.

Look at the 581 horse 360 thread, that motor has plenty of head flow and you can see the difference the RPM AG vs the Super Victor made, somewhere around 35 hp IIRC.

Talk to member Flyfish, he tried the victor against his AG in a similar ET cuda notch, din't like it at first but liked it BETTER(and the ET's dropped) after some carb tuning.

I have plenty of hands on and seat time with the Vic and other single planes, I can't speak from experience on the Super victor.

FWIW...The 1 3/4" Schoenfeld-slip on style collector will go right over your hacked-off 1 5/8" ( cut it about 1/2"-3/4" behind the cloverleaf) 3" collector and that will also be worth at least another 10th on YOUR EXISTING HEADERS. if the collector is too small (even moreso than the primary tube) it will peak your torque at a fixed RPM and then LOWER the HP trajectory above that peak torque RPM. running 10.80's I'm also assuming your Edelbrocks are worked over a bit to flow another 30-40CFM over stock, is that the case?

Do both and jet up accordingly and you'll get AT LEAST 2/10th's

Last edited by Streetwize; 01/04/13 07:11 PM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: Triple Threat] #1363827
01/04/13 06:57 PM
01/04/13 06:57 PM
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Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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A single plane will probably kill off too much TQ at low speed VS what it will get you on the top end especially leaving at idle and running a glide. The air gap will have a broader power band even though the peaks may be slightly off VS victor, M1....

An 850 carb however may be a nice addition, should not cost you enough low end to notice when tuned properly but the higher RPM will definitely pull better.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: HotRodDave] #1363828
01/04/13 07:04 PM
01/04/13 07:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,876
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline
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Dave, I agree in part but remeber the Glide soaks up something close to 1/2 the comparable amount of engine power to turn at speed than the 904 so that much more power is getting to the wheels; he's got enough stall and he's light enough that I believe he'll pick up....opinions vary I suppose.

A Vic on a 408 is proportionally like a torker 2 on a 360, it'll have PLENTY off the line, at least on any motor I've built.

Last edited by Streetwize; 01/04/13 07:06 PM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Critique my 408 stroker induction [Re: Streetwize] #1363829
01/04/13 09:47 PM
01/04/13 09:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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Kalispell Mt.
I was just thinking that with the glide his breakaway ratio is gonna be more like a 904 with a 2.9X gear ratio (depending on of course exactly witch 1st gear the 904 and glide have) and that gives very poor TQ multiplication, not many people actually drag race with a 3 spd auto and a 2.9X gear for that reason. Sounds like he has a decent converter to mask it some but still not getting any help from the breakaway ratio


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!









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