(cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
#1338606
11/20/12 09:41 PM
11/20/12 09:41 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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mopar
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mopar
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Sherman Texas
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Been awile since i posted ,but im back.Racing season is over for me and im planning to upgrade my car a bit over the winter.The car runs well for what it is (7.13 @96 in the 1/8 best) and always runs 7.1's -low 7.2's in good weather.The problem is its out of steam at about 5800 and although i think the heads arent helping matters , i think the cam is an even bigger issue.I got a smoking deal on a cam and lifters for it .My goal was to select a cam that would be ideal for my setup without over camming it for my compression ratio ,convertor ,gears ,etc. Here is my setup: 360 LA strocked to a 408 10 to 1 compression Unported Econo W2 heads Harland Sharp roller rockers Victor intake 750 Demon MSD ignition (dist ,box ,coil) Hedman Hustler Fenderwells PG trans with a 3500 convertor 4.10 gears with 26 tall tire (i have a set of 4.86's also ,but the car slowed down with them ,so i went back to the 4.10) Now for the cam: the current is an Eddy hyd flat tappit .488/.510 lift and 234/244 dur @50 with a 112 lobe sep The cam i bought for it: Its an NOS Inskenderian solid flat tappit .507/.507 lift and 254/254 dur @ 50 with a 108 lobe sep I am only after about 6200-6300 rpm and have no desire to spin it past that with the cast crank .May do it ,but im not gunna. I realise that a solid roller ,12.5 to 1 pistons ,porting the heads ,etc ,would do alot more for it,but i really dont want to tear this thing down at this point.Its still running strong ,has great compression ,oil pressure ,and not alot of passes on it.This car is also a "Back Burner" hobby (i have several) for me and i dont care to sink that kinda $$ into at my involvement level . My question is ,do you think any will be gained by the cam swap alone ?Should i have selected a different grind ? Keep in mind this is a budget car ,that i just race for fun at Nostalgia events a few times per year.I am wanting to run a 7.0 class and maybe dip into the 6.9's .Any and all opinions on the cam would be appreciated ,thanks ...
Last edited by The Shocker; 11/20/12 09:52 PM.
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: The Shocker]
#1338611
11/20/12 10:53 PM
11/20/12 10:53 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,177 ill
dennismopar73
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,177
ill
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Go ahead and swap it out, put it in @ 102-103 c/l put tighter lash that what the card says, I run 12 intake 14 exhaust , 410 will run fine on the street and the track, be nice if you could find some 430, as for the rpms would not be scared to go up to 7 tho thru the traps but you will go @ 6300-6500 with what you got? power glide killing ya ,, unless your in a super light car!! good luck
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: gtsdude]
#1338613
11/20/12 10:59 PM
11/20/12 10:59 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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Quote:
I run a solid MP circle track cam 509/280, 106 centerline, subtract your lash and your below .500 lift. Is that duration @ 50?
Yes its @50.The advertised duration is 300/300...
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: Hot 340]
#1338614
11/20/12 11:05 PM
11/20/12 11:05 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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Quote:
Why not grind on the heads a little bit? or do you not want to yank them off?
Not scared to ,just dont want to .When this thing shows signs of wear ,i was planning to pull it out and do it right.Port the heads ,and more compression are on the list ,but i dont want to do a halfa$$ job ,when i could do the whole deal at once while freshing it up and gain alot.The cam and lifter deal was cheap ,and i thought it might do it a little good with my current setup in the meantime is all...
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: dennismopar73]
#1338616
11/20/12 11:13 PM
11/20/12 11:13 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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Quote:
Go ahead and swap it out, put it in @ 102-103 c/l put tighter lash that what the card says, I run 12 intake 14 exhaust , 410 will run fine on the street and the track, be nice if you could find some 430, as for the rpms would not be scared to go up to 7 tho thru the traps but you will go @ 6300-6500 with what you got? power glide killing ya ,, unless your in a super light car!! good luck
car is lite.Weighs 2720 without me (extensive gutting) .I know three gears would be ideal ,but the PG is doing okay since i got the weight down.It 60 foots mid to low 1.5's at 3300-3500 launches.I accept the fact that there are lots of mixed matched items on the car that are holding it back as well...
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: topbrent]
#1338618
11/20/12 11:20 PM
11/20/12 11:20 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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Quote:
A 408 generally will appreciate the extra cam duration. You could retard your current cam several degrees to shift the emphasis to the top end a bit.
Your current Edelbrock Cam, #7177 is 234/244 112°LSA 107°ICL. It has a intake closing point(@.050)of 44°.
As most cams do, I would imagine that the solid Isky has 4° advance ground into it, so with 254/254 108/104, the intake closing point would be 51°.
If installed at 104°ICL the Isky cam will lower your dynamic compression ratio, but would probably be an improvement overall imho. It might not care for the 3500 stall at this point, though. You could install it early at 102° to help with the torque and dynamic compression ratio a bit. This would put your intake closing point at 49°
I got the specs from Isky's sight.
3000 stall ,10.5 to 1 comp ,4.10-4.56 gears ,up to a 750 carb ,valve lash .028 hot on both sides.Bracket Racing Cam /rough idle.
Thanks for the info and tips .I am by no means an expert when it comes cam lowering dynamic compression ...
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: The Shocker]
#1338619
11/20/12 11:22 PM
11/20/12 11:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,444 NEW JERSEY
dynamite
pro stock
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NEW JERSEY
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My question is ,,you said it has a cast crank..Maybe I'm stupid here but I didn;t know you could get a cast crank for your 408 stroker motor..could be wrong tho...
Last edited by dynamite; 11/20/12 11:23 PM.
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: dynamite]
#1338620
11/20/12 11:26 PM
11/20/12 11:26 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 429 Sherman Texas
The Shocker
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Quote:
My question is ,,you said it has a cast crank..Maybe I'm stupid here but I didn;t know you could get a cast crank for your 408 stroker motor..could be wrong tho...
Its one from Ohio crank Company ...
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: The Shocker]
#1338622
11/20/12 11:28 PM
11/20/12 11:28 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,300 Northern Indiana
Dunnuck Racing
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master
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Northern Indiana
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Quote:
Dont think anything is to be gained by the added duration and closer lobe speration ??? [/quote
To compare duration numbers between hydraulic and solid lifter cams,the generally accepted rule is to add ten degrees to a hydraulic to have a comparable solid. So you basically have the same exhaust duration,more intake duration. I would expect the solid to pull much stronger above maybe 5500 rpm due to the nature of hydraulic lifters. The larger intake lobe should raise the peaks a little,and the tighter lsa will build torque much better through the middle. I would not expect huge gains,but they definitely should be there. Keith
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Re: (cam swap )What can i expect to gain ?
[Re: Dunnuck Racing]
#1338623
11/21/12 06:56 PM
11/21/12 06:56 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
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The Shocker
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Quote:
Quote:
Dont think anything is to be gained by the added duration and closer lobe speration ??? [/quote
To compare duration numbers between hydraulic and solid lifter cams,the generally accepted rule is to add ten degrees to a hydraulic to have a comparable solid. So you basically have the same exhaust duration,more intake duration. I would expect the solid to pull much stronger above maybe 5500 rpm due to the nature of hydraulic lifters. The larger intake lobe should raise the peaks a little,and the tighter lsa will build torque much better through the middle. I would not expect huge gains,but they definitely should be there. Keith
Thank you sir.This is kinda what i was thinking as well.Small gains here and there through the rpm range .A bit weaker out of the gate (with my convertor stall), but with a little extra lung capacity on the topend.Nothing to write home about for sure ,but a noticable gain .I will report back when i get the cam and lifters changed and have a new time slip in my paw .If it works it works ,if it dont it dont ...
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