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New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School #1335800
11/15/12 05:56 PM
11/15/12 05:56 PM
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western PA
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Sb Valiant Offline OP
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I'm looking into maybe updating our old coil and distributor. The coil and distributor both are from the 1970's and they are both Excell brands. I hear there might be alittle bit of power there can anyone clarify this?

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Sb Valiant] #1335801
11/15/12 06:03 PM
11/15/12 06:03 PM
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Jacksonville, FL
Chris2581 Offline
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You didn't say what type of distributor..is it a points style or electronic? I'm assuming you have Accel stuff which is very good.I'd be suspect of the coil,expecially being that old.

FWIW.... I still use a Chrysler/Mopar race ignition system that has been in the car since 1981,it works fine and I see no reason to change it.


Nautilus Racing-
We use Superformance gaskets and Turbo Action converters/products.
Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Sb Valiant] #1335802
11/15/12 06:08 PM
11/15/12 06:08 PM
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communist bloc of new jersey
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ignition system science can get a bit complicated but a couple of the biggest improvements have been multi spark and the (large) increase in primary voltage to the coil.

most performance ignitions these days generate multiple sparks for each firing up to around 3000 RPM which helps keep the engine firing clean. primary voltages have increased in some cases to over 500 volts whereas original coils ran 12 or less.

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Chris2581] #1335803
11/15/12 06:12 PM
11/15/12 06:12 PM
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we have a mechanical advance and it's deffiently not electronic.

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: jamesc] #1335804
11/15/12 06:14 PM
11/15/12 06:14 PM
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Yea I hear about the more voltage the better on the coil. Also something with a quick recovery too as well! Is those msd coils that got like 55,000 volts any good? I think they are alittle over 100 bucks.

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Sb Valiant] #1335805
11/15/12 06:27 PM
11/15/12 06:27 PM
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communist bloc of new jersey
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i don't know exactly what you're working with but if you're replacing the ignition and/or the coil make sure they are compatible. there are a lot of good ignitions out there these days and they can also be gotten for decent prices used.

on another note don't expect to change the ignition and have great improvements in performance. imho that won't happen unless something was wrong with the ignition you've been running.

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: jamesc] #1335806
11/15/12 06:39 PM
11/15/12 06:39 PM
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we run one of those old school 6 AL msd boxes. I just really want to change coil but mise well upgrade distributor as well. The better spark the faster fuel will burn! Looking to do that so we can add even more fuel. Advancing the timing helps burning more fuel as well too!

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Sb Valiant] #1335807
11/15/12 08:17 PM
11/15/12 08:17 PM
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Well, I'm sure you know this at some level, but if you're at the best power air/fuel ratio and you add more fuel, all the spark in the world won't make more power.

Big power increases from new, "better" systems actually come from fixing a problem you didn't know you had.

If you truly want to take a giant step forward in ignition, you need to investigate Electromotive and like firms. Crank triggers and computing technology combined with individual coils on the plugs or something approaching that allow the coil to be much more saturated and deliver a much bigger spark if it is needed to jump the gap. Being able to set your ignition lead electronically helps a lot, too. High dollar racers like to tailor the advance for each cylinder but this requires a lot of dyno time for a few hp gain, IMHO.

R.

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: dogdays] #1335808
11/15/12 11:52 PM
11/15/12 11:52 PM
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I appreciate the info!

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: dogdays] #1335809
11/15/12 11:53 PM
11/15/12 11:53 PM
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If the ign you have now is doing its job you may not see any performance gain at all. Dont matter if you have 35k or 65k firing your plug as long as the 35k is enough to fire the plug in your cylinder it will do the job fine. Once the mixture ignites right 40,000 more volts wont make it work any better or go any faster. If you have a problem then yes you might run better but unless you have a missfire from lack of voltage for one reason or another and its a basic street/strip car I dont think you will have a performance gain. I guess what I am saying is that if your ign can give 35k and it fires all the plugs in your eng fine upgrading to a system with a reserve voltage to 60k wont help as the ign will only use the voltage it needs to fire the plugs.
My son switched from the MP orange ECU to the MSD 6A box and from the Acell Super coil to the MSD coil in his mid 11 Dart and ran no different at all. His old setup with the Super coil and MP ECU did the job just fine on his car and the MSD had zero performance difference. Nothing wrong with upgrading to a better ign that might fire your plugs when they get worn or half fouled better then your old ign but if your old ign fires the plugs fine normaly you wont see a performance gain. The good thing about the MSD modern ign is it can fire a worn plug your old ign may not or if you have plugs get gapped to wide by mistake the new MSD may still fire it when the old ign my not. I actually use my sons old Acell coil and MP orange ECU on my 63 which it works fine running 10's shifting at 6200 rpm.
I am just saying dont hope for some big performance gain if your old ign is working good. Ron

Last edited by 383man; 11/15/12 11:59 PM.
Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: 383man] #1335810
11/15/12 11:59 PM
11/15/12 11:59 PM
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Good point thanks for going through all of that!

Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Sb Valiant] #1335811
11/16/12 12:10 AM
11/16/12 12:10 AM
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Bend,OR USA
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Quote:

The better spark the faster fuel will burn! Looking to do that so we can add even more fuel. Advancing the timing helps burning more fuel as well too!


The fuel will only burn as fast as it can burn no matter how much spark you start the fire with If you add more fuel and the car goes faster it wasn't tuned to max power to start with, you should be able to fatten the mixture(jetting) up enough to slow the car down in the 1/4 mile, if you can't you don't have enough fuel delivery To much gasoline will flood the cylinders and make the mixture to rich to make optomin(SP?) power, nitro, deisel and some other types of fuel are not like gasoline is.As far as advancing the timing to make more power only works if you didn't have the proper timing to start with There is a best tune up for all application, it may not be the same in two hours BTW, the MSD 6AL is a good box for most N/A street and strip applications I like and use the MSD Seven sereis race boxes with the appropriate coils and spark plug wires


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: New school Coils And Distributors vs Old School [Re: Cab_Burge] #1335812
11/16/12 12:58 AM
11/16/12 12:58 AM
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gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
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This is just my experience on going from old school to electronics. Had a old Mallory double life distributor, thats the square lobe dual point unit. Changed out to a new MSD billet distributor and 6al box. Still use the Accel super coil from the 70's, same coil i've had on about 6 cars. Didn't make .01 difference.


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