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Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
#1302357
09/11/12 10:24 PM
09/11/12 10:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
Dave_S
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
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Anyone know what mods (if any) are neccesary to make a Gen III live in a race enviroment. They were alluded to in a previous post and also when I was quizzing a local Drag Pack owner. The S/S guy didn't want to give up his secrets, not that I blame him. If anyone has any insight I would appreciate the help. I dont really want to learn the hard way. I already have a forged rotating assy. and a high volume oil pump. I plan on keeping the rpm to 7500 max.
DAve
Last edited by Dave_S; 09/11/12 10:53 PM.
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: LA360]
#1302359
09/12/12 09:11 PM
09/12/12 09:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
Dave_S
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
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I guess your right. Those who know seem to be keeping it to themselves.
Dave Stillie
'73 Swinger
5.7 Hemi, 88mm turbo, powerglide, cal-tracs & 8 3/4
Mega-Squirt EFI
[email]8.93@149
[/email]
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: Dave_S]
#1302360
09/13/12 09:35 AM
09/13/12 09:35 AM
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 528
Oak Grove, MN
lowflyingdart
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 528
Oak Grove, MN
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Are you building a stroker engine?
"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
Thomas A. Edison
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: Dave_S]
#1302362
09/14/12 12:24 AM
09/14/12 12:24 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 833
MN
hemidup
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 833
MN
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What oil pan you plan on using and how many qt's?
Jerry Williams.
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: hemidup]
#1302365
09/18/12 06:56 PM
09/18/12 06:56 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,645
Houston, Tx
AlexP
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,645
Houston, Tx
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Quote:
Quote:
Keep the oil squirters, take the lip out of the oil pump where the pick up tube meets and get an accumulator. The HYD lifters will be fine.
That will be more than enough. These engines don't have oiling issues.
Alex. He's building a 5.7. They don't have oil squirter's.
Let me ask a question. Lets say we have 2 oil pumps that produce the same amount of oil pressure at rpm. One being stock and the other a high volume. Here is the question. Would you rather have more oil in the heads or in the oil pan?
Thats a compromise. I'd like to have the valve train very well lubricated but dont want the springs drowning in it.
For most uses, I'd feel comfy with plan C...4 quarts in the sump (or draining down), 2 floating around up top and a qt in the accumulator just in case.
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: AlexP]
#1302366
09/18/12 07:53 PM
09/18/12 07:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
ahy
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Keep the oil squirters, take the lip out of the oil pump where the pick up tube meets and get an accumulator. The HYD lifters will be fine.
That will be more than enough. These engines don't have oiling issues.
Alex. He's building a 5.7. They don't have oil squirter's.
Let me ask a question. Lets say we have 2 oil pumps that produce the same amount of oil pressure at rpm. One being stock and the other a high volume. Here is the question. Would you rather have more oil in the heads or in the oil pan?
Thats a compromise. I'd like to have the valve train very well lubricated but dont want the springs drowning in it.
For most uses, I'd feel comfy with plan C...4 quarts in the sump (or draining down), 2 floating around up top and a qt in the accumulator just in case.
I think its a trick question... with the engine at speed and the same oil pressure, oil flow through the engine will be the same. The HV pump will just be dumping more out the bypass and back into the pan... and using a little extra power and heating up the oil more.
The main benefit of the HV pump is at low RPM/hot oil conditions where a stock pump may not make enough flow and pressure with increased bearing clearances.
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: ahy]
#1302367
09/18/12 08:43 PM
09/18/12 08:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
Dave_S
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 344
Burlington, Ontario Canada
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Thanks for the input guys. This web site has lots of good info as well: http://monstermopar.com/forum/index.php?board=43.0Seems like the biggest problem is oil pump cavitation at higher rpm. The fix seems to be porting the inlet side of the pump and ensuring adequate drain back from the heads. Dave
Dave Stillie
'73 Swinger
5.7 Hemi, 88mm turbo, powerglide, cal-tracs & 8 3/4
Mega-Squirt EFI
[email]8.93@149
[/email]
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: CHAPPER]
#1302370
10/11/12 05:01 PM
10/11/12 05:01 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,998
GO BUCKS !!!!!!!
340RICK
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,998
GO BUCKS !!!!!!!
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I am not expert but play one on here. My 6.1 storker has a stock oil pump and has plenty of PSI. (75PSI) I would not use a HV pump its not needed, I feel these motors already pump plenty of oil to the top end. Make sure that the oil pan you use has the dimples in the pan rail and does not cover up the drain back holes in the rail of the block. I am using a custom Charlies 7Qt pan with kick out and the factory oil pan gasket/windage tray. 
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: 340RICK]
#1302371
10/11/12 07:14 PM
10/11/12 07:14 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
CHAPPER
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
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Quote:
I am not expert but play one on here.
My 6.1 storker has a stock oil pump and has plenty of PSI. (75PSI) I would not use a HV pump its not needed, I feel these motors already pump plenty of oil to the top end.
Make sure that the oil pan you use has the dimples in the pan rail and does not cover up the drain back holes in the rail of the block.
I am using a custom Charlies 7Qt pan with kick out and the factory oil pan gasket/windage tray.
Thanks Rick, but,that's all ya' got..??  I'm looking for MORE info. I've got/had ALL those things covered....still lost a #4 rod. The concensus/opinions of the people I have talked to, that have had rod failures,, all with #3 or #4 rod,, seem to think the crank is the problem. Don't want a pizzn match,,  just trying to get some experienced opinions. I know that is hard here,, . I am talking oil problems in the 7500-7800RPM range. I don't know what anybody else is turning, but I was impressed with how these things rev. The motor was COMPLETELY upgraded internally...no stock stuff in it other than the crankshaft/block.
If you like drag racing, support your local track.
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: CHAPPER]
#1302372
10/11/12 08:56 PM
10/11/12 08:56 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,998
GO BUCKS !!!!!!!
340RICK
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,998
GO BUCKS !!!!!!!
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Dont Pizz me off I am running a Manley 4.050 crank I have had my 6.1 to 7500RPM many times and its still pulling, been to chicken to go any higher. I am running more camshaft than the drag pak motors, with ported heads so I would assume mine would like some more RPM, but on dyno and at track I have shut it down at 7500rpm so far. I am going to pull pan off my motor this winter and take a peaky poo at the rods and mains just for safety sake. I have a system one filter on since day one and its been clean as a whistle and I check it often. I also have a oil temp guage in car as well and it stays fully warmed in the 170-180 range max
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: CHAPPER]
#1302374
09/13/13 07:15 PM
09/13/13 07:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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I like to bring this topic up again for an issue I just noticed with my 5.7Hemi. Looking at/into the oilfilter mount, I noticed 2 little holes in the casting, alongside the inlet-port into the oilfilter. The side holes were formed because the casting was thin enough there to break away. Some gentle poking caused the edges of the holes to chip away some more very easily. I've enlarged and camfered one of the holes into the inlet-port and plan to do the same with the second hole. If I'm correct this is the pressure-side of the pump, right before the oil goes into the oilfilter. First pic shows the as-found situation. Second pic shows the modified situation. Third pic shows the remaining castinghole I plan to open up and blend into the filter area. Any thoughts? "Original"  "Modified"  Other casting hole; 
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Re: Gen lll Hemi oil system mods
[Re: SC304]
#1302376
09/16/13 10:29 PM
09/16/13 10:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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So the 6.1 crank is proven to oil good up to 7500-8000 ok? When the Drag Pack first were speced out they said stock cranks?? Heres mine I was messin with last night.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Any new ideas..? 
....there it is...the secret to success...MANLEY CRANK...I knew it!!! 
