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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: Streetwize]
#12498
07/30/04 01:49 PM
07/30/04 01:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 524
Mesa, AZ
Bill_T
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 524
Mesa, AZ
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Are the heads ready to assemble and bolt on then? Has this been determined? Or is it still possible that some things are "off."
The partially machined heads are only $625 from at least one vendor. The completed heads are $2100.
This space not for rent.
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: JohnRR]
#12503
07/30/04 08:30 PM
07/30/04 08:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,498
So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,498
So. Burlington, Vt.
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here are the exhaust flow numbers with a 2" tube attached: lift---flow .100--58.2 .200-124.8 .300-189.8 .400-229.8 .450-243.4 .500-254.6 .550-264.2 .600-272.2 .650-278.6 .700-283.4 .750-288.2 .800-291.4 while the topic did stray a little into a price thing, that shouldnt take away from the fact that these are pretty nice heads. but as nice as they are, and as happy as Wize is that he bought them....im going to go out on a limb here and say i dont think he would own this set of heads if he had to pay $4200/pr for the bare castings. for that same $4200....i bought some 440-1's set up for a Jesel rocker system, the Jesel rockers, the spray bar valve covers, all the valves/springs/retainers/locks/seat cups/seals....and still had enough change to go out and have a few nice steak dinners.  granted....my 440-1's dont flow as well on the intake side as these do either....so, i guess it all boils down to how much youre willing to pay for the small runner/big flow thing. i'll be looking forward to hearing how they end up fitting on the motor, how the valvetrain goes together...and how the motor combo works out when Wize gets it all done.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#12504
07/30/04 09:32 PM
07/30/04 09:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,498
So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,498
So. Burlington, Vt.
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i found my notes on when i freshened up the EM470 heads for 440Jim.
this is what i would consider a couple of the better overall ports on that set of heads(the highest flowing intake port didnt have the best area under the curve, but did flow 365.7 @ .700 lift).
keep in mind this is also a 30cc+/- smaller port than the Chapman 285's, and we didnt have the luxury of the longer valve, added roof height, or added short turn height to play with.
all in all.....i think if we had some of these same bare castings that Chapman had, and MD did another port design similar to the ones on the EM470 heads....it might even flow more than the Chapman 285's...with the same, or smaller, runner volume.
lift--Chap/ EM-A/ EM-B
.100--72.5/ 71.0/ 73.0
.200-153.7/148.2/149.0
.300-224.3/210.9/216.8
.400-285.2/265.9/273.7
.500-329.6/312.2/317.8
.600-361.9/348.5/348.5
.650-368.1/358.1/352.3
.700-364.0/358.1/352.3
i dont think i had my 4.375 bore adapter when i got these last numbers, so on the bigger bore, the mid-lift numbers on the EM heads might be even better.
it'll be interesting to see how the Chapman 260's compare to the EM470 heads, since the runner volumes are closer to each other.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#12505
07/30/04 09:45 PM
07/30/04 09:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875
Weddington, N.C.
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Dwayne,
You are absolutely right, as nice as they are I wouldn't have shelled out $4200 for them, with what I bought them for you and I could go have a decent steak dinner once a week for at least 3 months with what was left over. That's not to say they might not be worth it to some of the racers out there.
I didn't exactly buy them on a whim, but it was not long after Gary passed away and I had it set in my mind I wanted to do some type of Tribute to him, after all he had called me and told me he wanted to do a 500" short rod low deck like the one I was doing. Guess that's at least part of why I jumped at the chance to get them.
Looks like the ports liked the tube, huh? 
Last edited by Streetwize; 07/30/04 09:47 PM.
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#12507
07/31/04 01:15 AM
07/31/04 01:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,008
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,008
U.S.S.A.
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dwayne , do you have a 2.20 / 11/32 valve that will work for a flow test ? if so i'll send up the head on monday , i won't have the other heads done till the end of the week at the earliest .
running up my post count some more .
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: JohnRR]
#12508
07/31/04 12:08 PM
07/31/04 12:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875
Weddington, N.C.
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So Dwayne, anything interesting about the measurements? I'm curious to know how the depth of the bowl and the long and short side radiuses measured up.
Putting these on a low deck, what would be the best Intake to run? I know an indy or possibly a B1 would be an obvious choice but I wonder how a modern sheetmetal Max Wedge style cross ram or low rise TR would do with DFI  At these types of flow rates from some base calculations I'm now leaning toward some type of multiple carb set up. Or how about the Indy 440-25?
http://indyheads.com/catalog/page8-9.pdf
I use AutoCad and I work at a machine shop with a water jet, I might be able to talk the boss into letting me cut out a 'Paper Doll' manifold Prototype, might need some expert input to calc total runner volumes and lengths, anybody have the latest version of Engine Analyzer Pro I could borrow for a week?
Last edited by Streetwize; 07/31/04 01:08 PM.
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: Streetwize]
#12510
08/01/04 04:48 AM
08/01/04 04:48 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,720
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,720
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
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Quote:
I use AutoCad and I work at a machine shop with a water jet, I might be able to talk the boss into letting me cut out a 'Paper Doll' manifold Prototype, might need some expert input to calc total runner volumes and lengths, anybody have the latest version of Engine Analyzer Pro I could borrow for a week?
Take a look at these sites for info on Helmholtz resonators, runner lengths, runner areas, runner taper, plenum volumes,etc .
http://www.newcovenant.com/speedcrafter/calculators/intake.htm
http://www.bgsoflex.com/intakeln.html
http://www.grapeaperacing.com/GrapeApeRacing/tech/inductionsystems.pdf
http://www.mecc.unipd.it/~cos/DINAMOTO/risuonatore/risuonatore.html
http://www.eng.fsu.edu/~shih/eml4421/student%20presentation%20EML%204421/manifold%20tuning.pdf
http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/article.html?&A=0122&P=6
David Vizard has written books that cover this subject also.
Martin
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
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Re: Fast flowed my Chapmans today!
[Re: Streetwize]
#12516
08/05/04 04:18 PM
08/05/04 04:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
440Jim
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
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Quote:
Putting these on a low deck, what would be the best Intake to run? I know an indy or possibly a B1 would be an obvious choice
My experience with my 471 and several intakes was the Indy (400-2) 4150 intake was the fastest down the race track. However, driving on the return road and in the pits was notably worse than the others I tried. So "bad" in fact, I would not recommend one for street use. A 508 CID might work a little beter, or a turtle/cone in the plenum might help the part throttle performance.
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... i owe the person/company i traded a few bucks for some parts i purchased and i think he's holding it hostage till i pay up 
) , of course i don't have any valves ... maybe i can get one of each from MP , i think i'm going to get a custom set and use lashcaps ...
