What shock rates are good for cornering
#1191142
03/04/12 07:10 PM
03/04/12 07:10 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
jrlegacy23
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
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When I was looking to get shocks for my 72 Dart, I seen that summit had adjustable drag shocks. The adjustable ratios for front shocks were 90/10, 80/20, and 60/40. For the rear shocks, the available ratios were 70/30, 60/40, and 50/50. (extend/compress) Not that I am looking to have drag shocks put on for handling, it just made me think. What ratio is ideal for an autocross event, and what rate is ideal for regular road driving? Thanks for any info 
[color:"#00FF00"]68 Fastback Barracuda with some stuff[/color]
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: Mattax]
#1191144
03/04/12 11:32 PM
03/04/12 11:32 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
jrlegacy23
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
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Thanks for the info. I am more curious of what non-adjustable shocks are at, I would imagine a 50/50 like you were saying. I ordered the edelbrocks a couple weeks ago, I am getting money back as they were only able to get 1. I am looking to get shocks that won't break the bank. I paid $47 for the Eddy's and wanted to stay in the same price range.
[color:"#00FF00"]68 Fastback Barracuda with some stuff[/color]
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: jrlegacy23]
#1191145
03/05/12 11:21 AM
03/05/12 11:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
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For most of us layman out there playing with our toys, the 50/50 ratio is fine. In relation to the actual rate of dampening required, that really depends on springs rates, tire construction, and unsprung weight. However, most bolt in mopar shock providers are not going to have that much detail to provide on their dampners, even if you knew the specific rates of dampening you were trying to target.
Yes, tuning to alterations in both compression and rebound can make a car faster, but with the multitude of adjustments in such a unit, it is much easier to loose your bearings than it is to make the car faster, unless you have a lot of specific application experience with that specific car. If you plan on goin this route, I'd receommend starting with a single adjustable unit first.
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: TC@HP2]
#1191146
03/05/12 12:57 PM
03/05/12 12:57 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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I am not trying to make fun of the OP, but I would frame the question similar to, "I bought a guitar, which strings do I pluck first?" The answer that no here knows other then mainly the suggestion in the post above, nobody exactly knows. 
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: jcc]
#1191147
03/05/12 01:37 PM
03/05/12 01:37 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
jrlegacy23
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 699
Cooperstown, NY
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Quote:
I am not trying to make fun of the OP, but I would frame the question similar to, "I bought a guitar, which strings do I pluck first?"
The answer that no here knows other then mainly the suggestion in the post above, nobody exactly knows.
The post is not, "I bought a car, what shocks do I put on it?" It is simply what are shocks extend and compression ratios.
Seriously though, this is exactly what I stopped posting on Moparts for such a long time. Most have computers and don't have reading comprehsion skills. I understand you have been trying to use that analogy for some time and thought it fit, but if you do not have any useful info, please do not respond, it is not helpful.
Thank you
[color:"#00FF00"]68 Fastback Barracuda with some stuff[/color]
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: jrlegacy23]
#1191149
03/05/12 09:09 PM
03/05/12 09:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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Quote:
Quote:
I am not trying to make fun of the OP, but I would frame the question similar to, "I bought a guitar, which strings do I pluck first?"
The answer that no here knows other then mainly the suggestion in the post above, nobody exactly knows.
The post is not, "I bought a car, what shocks do I put on it?" It is simply what are shocks extend and compression ratios.
Seriously though, this is exactly what I stopped posting on Moparts for such a long time. Most have computers and don't have reading comprehsion skills. I understand you have been trying to use that analogy for some time and thought it fit, but if you do not have any useful info, please do not respond, it is not helpful.
Thank you
Thank you explaining what your really post is about, because seriously, my first answer is still pretty on is pretty much on target.
I would also disagree with you as to any shortcomings of most moparts members regarding reading comprehension, I think an area that comes up shorter is, "critical thinking"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_thinking
If you have anything to add to the discussion, you can have the soap box back 
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: Viol8r]
#1191150
03/05/12 09:14 PM
03/05/12 09:14 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
Mattax
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,645
Phila. Pa.
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Yup. Moving right along, lets revisit the first question as it pertains to the second.
The compression/rebound relationship is just one way to describe a shock's performance. Further in to shock tech there are more specific characteristics used to describe the performance. One is control. So for example the Direct Connection Oval Track Book has bullitens relating spring rate to shock control rates depending on various factors. (This bulletin is very application specific, not for street or road race or street. I'm just using it as an example).
Moving toward your second question, if there is a big change in spring rate or weight then shock characteristics need to be changed to match. But if your car has fairly stock spring rates and weight, then a true replacement shock will be a good match. 'True' because the aftermarket often cheaps out by offering one size fits all. Sometimes its good enough and sometimes its not.
That gets to the second question, and I really can't answer that one. What is 'good enough' for one person may not be for another. Since I was autocrossing, but not in a fully developed car, I was in a different market. So while I wasn't willing to by the most expensive shocks, I was willing to spend some money. Also I did need something to handle the high spring rates and be somewhat tunable.
Other factors you might consider:
Is the same shock sold for your car also used on every model and engine option it physically fits?
What's it made of and how much does it weigh?
Exchange policy if it fails?
If the car is lowered and bump stops cut, will the shock bottom out?
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: Mattax]
#1191151
03/05/12 10:54 PM
03/05/12 10:54 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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A shocks valving is important to performance for sure. Another thing to consider is a twin tube vs. mono tube. Some twin tubes provide all the performance a street car would ever need. Stepping up to a mono tube you get more fluid volume and a bigger piston. With that comes more fade resistance,better heat control and repeatability. I would love to see a mono tube,rebuildable and revalvable shock for our cars.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1191152
03/06/12 01:03 AM
03/06/12 01:03 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 780
Woodinville, WA
Viol8r
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 780
Woodinville, WA
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Quote:
A shocks valving is important to performance for sure. Another thing to consider is a twin tube vs. mono tube. Some twin tubes provide all the performance a street car would ever need. Stepping up to a mono tube you get more fluid volume and a bigger piston. With that comes more fade resistance,better heat control and repeatability. I would love to see a mono tube,rebuildable and revalvable shock for our cars.
Talk to Ridetech. I have rebuildable 26 way adjustable monotube shocks on my car. They will even put stock mounts on for you.
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: Viol8r]
#1191154
03/06/12 02:41 AM
03/06/12 02:41 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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I cant even afford Bilsteins right now bro, but thanks for the hook up anyway!
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: What shock rates are good for cornering
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1191155
03/06/12 03:23 PM
03/06/12 03:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
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Quote:
A shocks valving is important to performance for sure. Another thing to consider is a twin tube vs. mono tube. Some twin tubes provide all the performance a street car would ever need. Stepping up to a mono tube you get more fluid volume and a bigger piston. With that comes more fade resistance,better heat control and repeatability. I would love to see a mono tube,rebuildable and revalvable shock for our cars.
...and in the valving department you have linear rates, digressive rates, and progressive rates. All manufacturers have a rating method too, whether it is 1-9 or 500 to 1000. Its all arbritrary when comparing brands anyway, but if you can quote off wheel rates and usage, they can tell what the magic number is your trying to match up to. Suffice it to say it is more complex than most of us will ever be able to just spout out and I'd highly recommend speaking to a shock manufacturer about the specifics of valving you would need if your going to this level of performance. You'll save yourself loads of time, trouble, and money doing that.
Yes, there is also the twin tube vs mono tube layout on top of that, but there isn't a huge increase in fluid volume from a twin tube to mono tube. Yes, there is a difference, and in a competition environment where they get used hard, this may make a difference. For most street cars, probably not. I'd almost go so far to say that a twin tube would be preferable on the street because of the "set it and forget it" mentality of most drivers. A mono tube can be ruined by a small ding in the body from flying road debris. A twin tube, on the other hand,can absorb some level of damage before shock performance is impacted. If your inspecting all yoru components regularly, then a mono-tube is great. If you don't bother to look at stuf funless its broken, thena twin tube may be the better approach.
There are mono tube, rebuildable, revalveable shocks out there that can be found for under $150 a piece. There are similar twin tube designs for under $100. However, you have to be willing to look at bearing end shocks or GM style mounts and adapt the mounts to fit your car. You are not going to find a stock mount, bolt in, original appearance, adjsutable, rebuildable shock for $50 each that meets all that criteria. Now, you can find high quality, fixed valving, steel body, non rebuildable shocks for $50 easily, but mounting will not be stock mopar. You can adapt these to a mopar, but you need to put on the creative hat to figure it out. First generation Camaro front shocks are very similar to the front mopar units. Bearing end shocks are a quick adapt to the mopar rear.
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