I just installed my MSD Street Fire ignition which replaced my Chrysler "style" setup. I ran into a couple of minor issues that I need help with.
A) When I connected the "+" battery cable to the battery, I got a few sparks which I don't recall from before. See B. Note: When I was done, I put a test light on the negative battery post and the other end on the un-mounted positive cable and my test light did not light.
B)The instructions say to wire the HEAVY red wire to the positive side of the starter solenoid which I did. This is before the ammeter in the circuit, is this correct?
C) The engine did not want to fire right up but once it did, then it idled at the high idle speed of 1400rpms. My ammeter was solid in the "+" side which is normal and my battery volt gauge showed solid 14ish and my volt gauge for the 12v feed to the MSD showed solid 13.5 or so ("Crank" and "Run" wires). But as soon as I dropped the idle off of high idle to base idle, the ammeter started flickering and both voltage gauges started flickering 12-14 volts real fast.
D) At my base idle rpm, my initial timing is now showing 54 degrees instead of my previous 24 degrees. My Craftsman dial back showed a solid line on the dampner but I gained 30 degrees of initial timing. Is this normal when switching from a Chrysler style ignition to a MSD unit? If so, then I will reset my initial timing.

Thanks

If I understand you correctly:
A disconnected + cable has no power, = no reading.
Did you disconnect the ballast resistor and make a jumper wire for the charging circuit there?
I've always connected the MSD heavy wires to the battery. Also make sure the engine has a good ground to the chassis.
Dial-back timing lights usually don't work well with MSDs; borrow an old-style one before you play with timing.

i'm reading the instructions now, but do you have it selected for 8cyl?

This box comes with the V8 mode standard.


""A disconnected + cable has no power, = no reading.""
Correct. It appears that there are no leaks when the "+" cable is removed from the battery.

""Did you disconnect the ballast resistor and make a jumper wire for the charging circuit there?"
The ballast was already removed (previous 12v setup, no ballast). BUT, you may have found my voltage problem. Before, I had the two brown wires connected to the blue (run) and the brown (crank). I removed the two brown wires (at ballast hookup) and they are not hooked up to anything right now. I just have the blue (run) and the brown (crank) hooked up to the red 12v switched wire for the MSD unit (with my voltage gauge spliced into the red wire too. I REALLY want to use my volt gauge inside of my car to watch the 12v feed to the MSD unit.)
Note: the LED on the side of the MSD unit showed solid red during the idle rpms when I was having the voltage issue. So it is getting 9+ volts.
Are the two brown wires my issue? I was not sure what to do with them so I left them disconnected.

I have MANY grounds all over the engine compartment.
I may need to pickup a standard timing light and timing tape.

Thanks for the replies

i believe you're on the right track with your meter issue. the MSD unit shouldn't effect that. you will need an inductive timing light (clips on #1 wire) and i would suggest not playing with timing until you have one. i installed my MSD 15 years ago so i don't remember if my timing advanced after installation or not. i was also running solid core wires and you wouldn't believe the issues i had!

I called my local NAPA store to find a standard timing light and their selection has been minimized to one unit that is a digital unit. Is anyone using a digital unit on the MSD? If so, then I will buy it and give it a shot. If not, then I will check with one of the other stores plus find timing tape.
EDIT: I just read that digital units may not work either. I have found a standard timing light and timing tape.

Thanks

just in case, i saw a few on Ebay yesterday. this is more just a than anything else.

Three of my local parts stores can not get the standard timing light and/or the correct timing tape, so I went to Summit to review their timing lights and I found one that is a dial back that is "Multi-Spark compatible" for $60. I like this unit because I don't want to mess with the tape and I like my current dial back but it won't read correctly. What do you think about the dial back that is MS compatible?
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EQU-3555/

looks ok to me. i just have an old craftsman so anything is slicker than mine!

Don't laugh but I use a Harbor Freight timing light and it works just fine with the CD ignitions. http://www.harborfreight.com/timing-light-with-advance-40963.html and it was less than $40 with a 20% coupon. Now I'm just a shade tree but it gets the job done.

68: That is a great price for a dial back with MSD capability!!



Mr P: I called Equus tech support and they said that this light is compatible with MSD because they do their in-house testing on MSD systems.

Now you have me worried because I already ordered it. I will find out this weekend.

Thanks for the replies.

I used my new dial back timing light and I also got the 54 degrees initial timing, so my old dial back and my new dial back both show the same timing. Can this be that the MSD box added 30 degrees of timing?
My idle rpms went up by about 250rpms too and as I rev up the rpms in neutral the exhaust sounds like crapt.

54 degrees is about what you'd get with mechanical (25) and vacuum (18) advance kicked in on top of initial.

Make sure the vacuum is disconnected and plugged. Make sure your rpm isn't so high that the mechanical advance is coming in.

Or, wind it up to 2500-3000 rpm and set the advance at ~34 (with the vacuum disconnected).

""54 degrees is about what you'd get with mechanical (25) and vacuum (18) advance kicked in on top of initial.""


I would agree but my current distributor is a non vacuum advance unit that was previously setup at 24 degrees initial and 34 total. I ran it this way for several years and then as soon as I hook up this new control box, I now have 54 degrees at the same idle rpms.
I don't mind just resetting the initial timing but I would like to know first if the cause is from the MSD box or from something else.

I have a vacuum advance distributor coming but I would like to get this one setup correctly before I add in another new part.
Thank you,

I wrote the MSD support tech about the additional 30 degrees of initial timing and they are stumped. They thought that my distributor wiring is backwards but that checks out. They also thought that my two distributor wires were touching one of the coil wires or one of my spark plug wires. I re-routed the pickup wires and insulated them inside of a rubber hose to make sure that they are not getting any interference, but I won't be able to start the car back up until late this weekend. The tech never commented on the two timing lights that I am using.
http://www.msdignition.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17478

Any other thoughts on the extra timing at idle?

Thanks

i've installed a few MSD 6s in various mopars and a Toyota camper and never had a jump in timing like you are struggling with. BUT - i did install a new dizzy last year with the wires backwards and the timing went to hell. to be honest i didn't put a light on it to see because it was the only thing i changed and knew right away it was reversed.

Mike,
I just moved the MSD ground wire from the motor to the main negative battery cable. I also isolated the two distributor wires with rubber fuel line (3/16" wall) and I double checked my wiring and it matched the diagram. But the next time I start the car and if I have the same trouble, I will swap those two wires to see what happens.

Thanks a bunch.

I moved the MSD ground wire to the negative battery cable. I swapped the wires at the distributor pickup.
I started the car (fires up immediately even in cold weather) and let it warm up for a few minutes. Then I let the engine come off of high idle to idle rpms and both of my voltage guages are fluctuating between 13-15 volts real fast and my ammeter is fluctuating from just left of straight up to pegged out on the positive side.
My initial timing still shows 52-54 degrees at idle and 60 degrees at hight idle.
When I bring the rpms up to 1600, my ammeter and both voltage gauges become SMOOTH and the ammeter stops fluctuating and stands still straight up. But, the engine is running real rough like the timing is way up there.
I am now wondering if my timing really is off and I just need to lower the initial back down to 24 and see how it runs.
The electrical guage problem seems weird that all three gauges are fine at 1600rpms but they all three start to fluctuate as I start to lower the rpms down. Then when I get it down to the idle rpms, all three gauges are fluctuating pretty bad.
The only wires that I have hooked up to the MSD for 12v is the BLUE/RUN and the single BROWN/CRANK and my voltage gauge.
Before I made this swap, I had the above wires and the two TWIN BROWN wires plus the LIGHT BLUE/YELLOW tracer hooked up with the FBO ecu and I had no problems with voltage at idle.
I attached a photo of my ballast hookup for reference. When I pulled my ballast and added a 12v coil, I just took all of these wires and connected them together. I am wondering if one of these wires still needs to be hooked up.

Only plan: reset initial timing to 24 degrees and see how it runs. But the fluctuating electrical gauges at idle I am stumped.

Any help is highly appreciated.