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Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... #1124099
11/29/11 04:38 PM
11/29/11 04:38 PM
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Between a rock & a hard place
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cudadoug Offline OP
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Between a rock & a hard place
We have a OLD (1985-ish) 800 Holley on our 416 small block bracket car. It was a very low use unit, but freshened and we gained 40 cfm on the bench when the motor was built. That said, it works pretty good and has produced some decent timeslips but we are thinking a "race" carb might be an upgrade this winter.

Who's/what 4150 base Holley are you running and why?

Are the Proform carbs any good?

What do the Holley HP 950's really flow? Not 950 I've heard...

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: cudadoug] #1124100
11/29/11 05:12 PM
11/29/11 05:12 PM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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The new Holley 950 carbs have a 1.59 venturi. Not sure if your 416 needs that much carb or not. Depends how hard you spin it and how much power you're making.

You might be better off with one of the new Holley 850 carbs. The new aluminum carbs are a killer design with a ton of new features.

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: AndyF] #1124101
11/29/11 10:12 PM
11/29/11 10:12 PM
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Between a rock & a hard place
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cudadoug Offline OP
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Thanks Andy. The new 950 is one that we are considering. You raise a good question. What DOES the motor need? We are going 128 in the 1/4 at 3100#, but I don't think I've found the optimum tune up. In fact I know I haven't. Added some jet to the carb and gained almost 2 mph with a restrictor plate so now it should go 130 flat out. (??) We're shifting at a 6400, and seeing 7100 in the lights if that helps anyone.

So, 84 lookie-loos but only one reply? I'm surprised that no one wants to brag about their carb or carb builder. Come on guys...school me on what works for you!

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: cudadoug] #1124102
11/29/11 10:25 PM
11/29/11 10:25 PM
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Central NC
gch Offline
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I would say borrow an 850 DP and see if it picks up any(after jetting it to your motor).This will tell you if it like a larger throttle bore.

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: cudadoug] #1124103
11/29/11 10:28 PM
11/29/11 10:28 PM
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Posts: 449
Wisconsin
sjs64polara Offline
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Wisconsin
Quote:

Thanks Andy. The new 950 is one that we are considering. You raise a good question. What DOES the motor need? We are going 128 in the 1/4 at 3100#, but I don't think I've found the optimum tune up. In fact I know I haven't. Added some jet to the carb and gained almost 2 mph with a restrictor plate so now it should go 130 flat out. (??) We're shifting at a 6400, and seeing 7100 in the lights if that helps anyone.

So, 84 lookie-loos but only one reply? I'm surprised that no one wants to brag about their carb or carb builder. Come on guys...school me on what works for you!




I would highly recommend calling Ken Jones. He is an incredible guy. He is a high end alky builder and also builds some great gas carbs. I’ve never met anyone that didn’t disagree……….. Enough said

http://kenjonesperformance.net/

Ken Jones Performance
7030 E Campbell Rd.
Walnut Hill IL
62893
618 533 5605

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: sjs64polara] #1124104
11/29/11 10:36 PM
11/29/11 10:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 449
Wisconsin
sjs64polara Offline
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Wisconsin

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: sjs64polara] #1124105
11/29/11 10:36 PM
11/29/11 10:36 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Performance Only Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Thanks Andy. The new 950 is one that we are considering. You raise a good question. What DOES the motor need? We are going 128 in the 1/4 at 3100#, but I don't think I've found the optimum tune up. In fact I know I haven't. Added some jet to the carb and gained almost 2 mph with a restrictor plate so now it should go 130 flat out. (??) We're shifting at a 6400, and seeing 7100 in the lights if that helps anyone.

So, 84 lookie-loos but only one reply? I'm surprised that no one wants to brag about their carb or carb builder. Come on guys...school me on what works for you!




Quote:

I would highly recommend calling Ken Jones. He is an incredible guy. He is a high end alky builder and also builds some great gas carbs. I’ve never met anyone that didn’t disagree……….. Enough said




is that really what you meant to say?

Last edited by Performance Only; 11/29/11 10:37 PM.

machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: Performance Only] #1124106
11/29/11 10:46 PM
11/29/11 10:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 449
Wisconsin
sjs64polara Offline
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Wisconsin
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Thanks Andy. The new 950 is one that we are considering. You raise a good question. What DOES the motor need? We are going 128 in the 1/4 at 3100#, but I don't think I've found the optimum tune up. In fact I know I haven't. Added some jet to the carb and gained almost 2 mph with a restrictor plate so now it should go 130 flat out. (??) We're shifting at a 6400, and seeing 7100 in the lights if that helps anyone.

So, 84 lookie-loos but only one reply? I'm surprised that no one wants to brag about their carb or carb builder. Come on guys...school me on what works for you!




Quote:

I would highly recommend calling Ken Jones. He is an incredible guy. He is a high end alky builder and also builds some great gas carbs. I’ve never met anyone that didn’t disagree……….. Enough said




is that really what you meant to say?





Oh damn…….. You know what I mean. Besides Mandarin, English it’s the hardest language. Its time !

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: sjs64polara] #1124107
11/29/11 11:14 PM
11/29/11 11:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Performance Only Offline
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it's all good. have one on me.


machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: cudadoug] #1124108
11/29/11 11:31 PM
11/29/11 11:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,036
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
I ran a new 950 on my 514 engine. It made a little over 800 hp and only gave up about 10 hp to a Dominator. The new aluminum carbs are the way to go if you need a carb. I wouldn't bother buying an older design anymore.

I'm still not sure if you need the 950 or not. The 850 might be a better match for your car. Just depends on what RPM range the car operates in.

If you want a tuner carb then call BLP.

6942756-950.jpg (54 downloads)
Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: cudadoug] #1124109
11/30/11 12:23 PM
11/30/11 12:23 PM
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Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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BradH Offline
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Find some buddies w/ good running carbs like an original Holley "950 HP" 80496 (1.38" venturi x 1.75" throttle), a Proform or Quick Fuel 950 (1.45" venturi x 1.75" throttle), maybe a Mighty or Race Demon 825 (1.425" venturi x 1.75" throttle), and a decent 850-type from somebody(1.56" venturi x 1.75" throttle), then try 'em out. I have no idea if that's possible for you or not, but it's my suggestion.

IMO, the new "True 950" Holley HP is too big for your application, which is why I was suggesting borrowing & testing smaller carbs.

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: BradH] #1124110
11/30/11 02:01 PM
11/30/11 02:01 PM
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Portage,michigan
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B3422W5 Offline
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Its been my experience that on a "race" type 416 motor, its pretty near impossible to " overcarb" them. Even on an 11.8 to 1 eddie headed 416 i used to have, the 1050 pro systems dominator i installed on it made better et and mph than a pro systems 750, 1000 and a race demon 1025 rs did( the 1025 rs was mighty close though)

I then took that 1050 dominator and later put it on my 422 w5 motor.

In short, i cant imagine in a race car scenario, not using a dominator over any 4150 type carb out there, its going to make the car faster, imo. I have tried enough different carbs on them to say this quite confidently.


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: B3422W5] #1124111
11/30/11 02:16 PM
11/30/11 02:16 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Quote:

Its been my experience that on a "race" type 416 motor, its pretty near impossible to " overcarb" them. Even on an 11.8 to 1 eddie headed 416 i used to have, the 1050 pro systems dominator i installed on it made better et and mph than a pro systems 750, 1000 and a race demon 1025 rs did( the 1025 rs was mighty close though)

I then took that 1050 dominator and later put it on my 422 w5 motor.

In short, i cant imagine in a race car scenario, not using a dominator over any 4150 type carb out there, its going to make the car faster, imo. I have tried enough different carbs on them to say this quite confidently.




Same here.... I'm using a 1050 dom on a 405ci....
if I had a 1150 I would try that on my engine

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1124112
11/30/11 02:51 PM
11/30/11 02:51 PM
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SoCal
Brian Hafliger Offline
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I doubt you'll move a ton of air volume through those RHS heads unless you move the pinch over...so with that I'd settle on a 1000HP or the new Ultra 850HP. The new carb has so many great features, this is the carb I would run.

I agree with others though, if you can test a few borrowed carbs AND take the time to tune them at the track (not always possible) then you might be able to make a better educated guess.
I've used the 1000HP on many different engine builds as well as the 950HP and IMO you cannot go wrong with them...just that the new carbs have so many upgrades for around 100.00 more it seems worth it to go that route.
Good luck with it!!
Brian


Brian Hafliger
Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: Brian Hafliger] #1124113
12/01/11 02:27 PM
12/01/11 02:27 PM
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
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BradH Offline
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Not saying that the OP's and my combination are remotely comparable, but... if I "had" to buy a new carb today, it would most likely be one of the new aluminum Holley Ultra 850 HP (080804s).

The problem for me is I have a couple of carbs on hand now that haven't necessarily been flogged to their best tune / configuration. It's really hard to justify buying another one when there's other stuff waiting to try out already.

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: BradH] #1124114
12/01/11 02:55 PM
12/01/11 02:55 PM
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Joplin, Mo
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rt66jim Offline
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Well my motor is a W2 headed 416. I started out with a 750. Up graded that with a PF base plate. Tried a borrowed 800DP that slowed it down. Borrowed a non HP 950 and it picked up .3 and 3 mph. I now have a PF 950 and it runs the same as the non HP 950 did. A friend has a HP1000 That I hope to try in the future.

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: rt66jim] #1124115
12/01/11 04:24 PM
12/01/11 04:24 PM
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Romeo MI
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Quote:

Well my motor is a W2 headed 416. I started out with a 750. Up graded that with a PF base plate. Tried a borrowed 800DP that slowed it down. Borrowed a non HP 950 and it picked up .3 and 3 mph. I now have a PF 950 and it runs the same as the non HP 950 did. A friend has a HP1000 That I hope to try in the future.




It does make a difference in how high you buzz the
engine to and what the heads flow... but a good check
is to run a vac gauge on the intake to see what the
vac is in the intake when you are at WOT... you want
very little

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: sjs64polara] #1124116
12/01/11 06:14 PM
12/01/11 06:14 PM
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Southern IL
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carbman1 Offline
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Thanks Spence

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: rt66jim] #1124117
12/02/11 12:06 PM
12/02/11 12:06 PM
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
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BradH Offline
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Quote:

... Borrowed a non HP 950 and it picked up .3 and 3 mph. I now have a PF 950 and it runs the same as the non HP 950 did...



What is a "non HP 950"?

Re: Race carb input/thoughts/suggestions... [Re: BradH] #1124118
12/02/11 01:21 PM
12/02/11 01:21 PM
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Joplin, Mo
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rt66jim Offline
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It was a Holley 950 that didn't have screw in air bleeds. I don't know the list #. I could get it. It belonged to member WillP. He doesn't post here very often. Jim

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