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My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? UPDATE
#1047936
08/06/11 12:55 AM
08/06/11 12:55 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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Finally got the car to the track for the first time tonight. 528 hemi challenger, 10.3 compression, 630/618 lift, 295 duration, iron heads with some mild clean up work, factory intake opened up, 2 original hemi afb's, 2 1/8 headers, 3.5 collectors to about 18" of pipe to 3.5" aero chambers, 727 ,foot brake, 3500 converter, 4.30 geared dana, 29" tire. I made 3 passes tonight with it. It's 60 foot was 1.607, which I'm fine with since I was only leaving at about 2800rpm. I wanted to get a feel for the car a bit before I leave harder. It pulls well up to about the 1/8th and falls on its face at about the 1000 foot. I'm in 3rd before the 1/8. 1st and 2nd pull strong to about 6500 where I was shifting at. It doesn't break up or miss or anything, it just falls flat on it's face and stops pulling. My plugs look really good. Where do I start? I'm at a loss here. 7.4 at 92mph 1/8 and 11.95 at 96 mph was my best 1/4 of the 3 passes.
Last edited by fig426; 08/11/11 12:12 AM.
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047937
08/06/11 12:57 AM
08/06/11 12:57 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266
Renton Washington
Triple Threat
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266
Renton Washington
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Sounds like its running out of fuel. What kind of fuel system do you have?
-Dustin
67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi
68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Triple Threat]
#1047939
08/06/11 01:06 AM
08/06/11 01:06 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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Holley blue pump with 1/2 inch (8an) line to a high flow filter, I forget the make, to a regulator under the hood that splits with 2, 3/8 lines (6an) lines, 1 going to each carb.
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047940
08/06/11 01:08 AM
08/06/11 01:08 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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The fuel cell "output" fitting is 8 or 10an, I'm not sure, but the line at the cell is definately an 8 (1/2 inch).
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#1047942
08/06/11 01:28 AM
08/06/11 01:28 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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The pump is about 12" from the fuel cell, and below it. Cell in the trunk, pump under the trunk. The filter is on the subframe connector. The filter is pretty big and made to go after the pump and although I don't remember the make of it, I do remember the flow rate on it was really high. I have not flow tested the system. Guess I know what I'll be doing tomorrow morning. Any numbers I should be shooting for? Less than so many gallons per minute is bad? I ask because our local speed shop closes at noon so if I'm buying a pump, I have to get it figured out by then. I want to get back to the track Sunday!!
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Mopar-Al]
#1047945
08/06/11 04:03 AM
08/06/11 04:03 AM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
HEMIFRED
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
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no mention of fuel pressure ????
home of the
Sox and Martin Hemi Duster
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047946
08/06/11 10:19 AM
08/06/11 10:19 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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3 things come to mind, flow test it, fuel pressure, and those carbs only have a single inlet and bowl and they do have a tendency to empty the bowl at high revs 
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047948
08/06/11 10:33 AM
08/06/11 10:33 AM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,611
Elbridge, NY
Dart1031
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,611
Elbridge, NY
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Quote:
The filter is on the subframe connector. The filter is pretty big and made to go after the pump and although I don't remember the make of it, I do remember the flow rate on it was really high.
I would try another filter between the cell and the pump. Your pump may not be strong enought to push the fuel through that filter. Also, because it's after the pump, you may have trash in the pump/lines(before the filter) hurting the flow. 
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1047949
08/06/11 10:36 AM
08/06/11 10:36 AM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,177
ill
dennismopar73
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,177
ill
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 check fuel pressure have 7 1/2 # and only slight drop off at w o t may think about alittle better pump for the hp you have going and the amout of draw on the fuel system, also just for giggles, check your vent , do not want a restriction there as well,
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047952
08/06/11 02:03 PM
08/06/11 02:03 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157
Bend,OR USA
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If you can fill a one gallon container in under 30 seconds you should be good for a 11 second car, BG use to have a flow chart on thier website saying that a nine second car needed one gallon in or under 20 seconds, 10 second was, maybe, 25 seconds  My memory is horrible, maybe someone else on here knows of another site that has flow numbers for testing and will post a link or say where to go to  The comment on the needles and seats is very apprpriate, I have gone through that on many carbs, a .110 needle and seat would starve the motor according the wide ban and a .120 was more than enough  Good luck, fix it before you burn the motor up  In other words lift if it noses over 
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 08/06/11 02:04 PM.
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Dodgem]
#1047954
08/06/11 06:26 PM
08/06/11 06:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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1 gallon in 45 seconds from the blue pump. Picked up a Holley 150 black pump today. It's flow rate is pretty good, came with a new regulator, and it's alcohol compatible if I ever decide to change over. Looking like rain for tomorrow so hopefully if it's dry Wednesday night I'll bring it up to Island for a few passes. http://www.holley.com/12-150.asp
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: topside]
#1047956
08/06/11 09:34 PM
08/06/11 09:34 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Cab, I think you're about right on the secs/gal; I seem to recall that 20 secs/gal is good for a low-10-sec car.
Fig, take a really good look at your spark plugs & check your float settings, and if there's any rubber hose in the system, make sure there aren't any internal cuts that can create a flap inside the hose that reduces the amount of fuel it can flow. If you're running a stock pickup, make sure the fuel isn't pulling away from it; on my Roadrunner, I added a length of suitable hose that lays on the bottom and extends rearward a bit inside the tank. My Duster uses a sump.
He's right on those numbers BUT those are a VERY
GENERAL number... weight of the car comes into play...
it takes more power to move a 3500# car to low 10s
VS a 2500# car to the same... more power requires
more fuel
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1047957
08/06/11 10:13 PM
08/06/11 10:13 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157
Bend,OR USA
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Quote:
Quote:
Cab, I think you're about right on the secs/gal; I seem to recall that 20 secs/gal is good for a low-10-sec car.
Fig, take a really good look at your spark plugs & check your float settings, and if there's any rubber hose in the system, make sure there aren't any internal cuts that can create a flap inside the hose that reduces the amount of fuel it can flow. If you're running a stock pickup, make sure the fuel isn't pulling away from it; on my Roadrunner, I added a length of suitable hose that lays on the bottom and extends rearward a bit inside the tank. My Duster uses a sump.
He's right on those numbers BUT those are a VERY
GENERAL number... weight of the car comes into play...
it takes more power to move a 3500# car to low 10s
VS a 2500# car to the same... more power requires
more fuel
Lots of variables in this hot rodding business Lots of gremlins also 
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047958
08/06/11 10:17 PM
08/06/11 10:17 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
Chris'sBarracuda
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
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Quote:
1 gallon in 45 seconds from the blue pump. Picked up a Holley 150 black pump today. It's flow rate is pretty good, came with a new regulator, and it's alcohol compatible if I ever decide to change over. Looking like rain for tomorrow so hopefully if it's dry Wednesday night I'll bring it up to Island for a few passes. http://www.holley.com/12-150.asp
45 seconds...
That can't be good.. 
Chris..
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Chris'sBarracuda]
#1047959
08/07/11 12:26 PM
08/07/11 12:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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Island is rained out today. Gonna have to wait until Wednesday.
Chris from New Jersey
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047960
08/07/11 05:08 PM
08/07/11 05:08 PM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,489
St. Louis Mo.
10 o to go
"Happy Don"
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"Happy Don"
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,489
St. Louis Mo.
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do you have a fuel pressure gauge that you can see .Shoud be dropping at that point at losing HP . Fuel line, fuel filter bet is the issue as others have said .
2009 418" build dan smith built
new 9.96 131.82
6.23 108
1.30 60 foot
best to date 9/15/09
8in 727 430 dana 2860 lb 3040 lb w driver
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047962
08/07/11 06:52 PM
08/07/11 06:52 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,654
Southern by Choice
Shoozy
I have a foot fetish
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I have a foot fetish
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,654
Southern by Choice
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How long for the black pump to pump a gallon?
Old, tired, and sometimes broke down. Me, not my car...
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047972
08/08/11 06:51 PM
08/08/11 06:51 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,091
oberlin, Ohio
Rapid340
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,091
oberlin, Ohio
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I see, I thought you where comparing a 140 GPH free flow black pump to a 110 GPH blue pump. I would still check it.
1971 Factory Appearing Duster 340 11.000 @ 122 mph
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: Rapid340]
#1047973
08/08/11 10:56 PM
08/08/11 10:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 903
Saskatchewan, Canada
cudabin
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 903
Saskatchewan, Canada
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Just to be sure, did you check the valve springs? I know you said it pulled strong in 1st and second, but I would check seat pressure and open pressure to be sure...  I used to run 9.55 at 138 with nothing but a single Blue pump... Good luck, Arnie
67 Cuda 8.48@ 158.7 mph 1.18 60' 2,600 DA(so far...)
70 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 4-speed. 13.2 @ 104 Stock exhaust/Street tires.
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047975
08/11/11 12:28 AM
08/11/11 12:28 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Made 2 passes tonight with the new fuel pump. First one redlighted -.437. 12.01 at 118mph. Total mess of a start but it pulled strong throughout. Second run. 60 foot 1.705 . .1 slower than last week. 330' 4.844. 1/8 7.424 at 95.56mph. 1000' 9.647. 1/4 11.531 at 119.41mph. I did a bad burnout and spun 1st and second. Pulled strong through the lights at about 6400rpm. Have some other things to sort out, like me being the driver  , but I think it should go into the high 10's. Also it runs like turds after I go through the traps. Seems like now it's loaded up with fuel. I'll play with the fuel pressure, maybe a return line. Thanks again to all of you for the help.
Good to hear it pulls all the way... set the pressure,
set the floats and most likely you will have to do
some jetting
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: fig426]
#1047977
08/11/11 11:10 AM
08/11/11 11:10 AM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 8,165
Left Coast
BobR
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 8,165
Left Coast
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Quote:
Made 2 passes tonight with the new fuel pump. First one redlighted -.437. 12.01 at 118mph. Total mess of a start but it pulled strong throughout. Second run. 60 foot 1.705 . .1 slower than last week. 330' 4.844. 1/8 7.424 at 95.56mph. 1000' 9.647. 1/4 11.531 at 119.41mph. I did a bad burnout and spun 1st and second. Pulled strong through the lights at about 6400rpm. Have some other things to sort out, like me being the driver , but I think it should go into the high 10's. Also it runs like turds after I go through the traps. Seems like now it's loaded up with fuel. I'll play with the fuel pressure, maybe a return line. Thanks again to all of you for the help.
What kind of suspension and tires? There may be more to hooking the car than doing a good burnout.
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: deaks]
#1047979
08/11/11 03:23 PM
08/11/11 03:23 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,495
Shelby mi.
JAKE68
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,495
Shelby mi.
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Usually you have to lower the stock float level down when using the hi flo needle and seats. Jake
JAKES AUTOMOTIVE
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Re: My car fall on its face at the 1000 ft? long
[Re: RBDuster]
#1047981
08/11/11 06:48 PM
08/11/11 06:48 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
fig426
OP
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,103
East Coast, NJ
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Yeah I'm looking forward to Monster Mopar!!! Am thinking about getting a pair of DOT slicks so I can run the street class too. I'm just going to sort out the car the way it is now to figure out if I can pull off a shorter tire. 29's now. As for the suspension, caltracs, monoleaf in the rear. Gonna lose the ranchos and put in a pair of other adjustables I have. Calvert front shocks. Won't be going again until next Friday and next Sunday. Have to work this weekend and next Wednesday.
Chris from New Jersey
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Good find 
Will be lots of fun racing with you at Monster Mopar. 
