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I have the BADDEST big-block on my street............PERIOD.

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you have a very impressive bigblock for sure

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I said "my street" cos there`s always someone around the corner who`s faster. This topic is good for both sides big and small blocks guys and gals alike as for me; I`d rather have the big block torque in a street/strip car and keep the r`s down than have a small block high revving monster that taxes even the best of parts.

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thats your opinion now here's mine dont take offense you have a big block that runs on race gas? i'll be honest here ur car runs 9.90's thats slow..what were sayin here is u dont need a bb to run 10'ooozzzz u can do it pretty easy and have ur car 140lbs lighter

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I agree the big block torque curve will be broader, but I said with gear and converter to match the combo's.


With that said a big block with a 275/60/15 tire with 3.23 shifted at 6000 rpm would fall back to 3500 in second, then back to 6000 and fall back to 4000 in drive. While a small block with the same tire and with 4.10 shifted at 7500 would fall back to 4500 in second and back to 7500 then fall to 5200 in drive. That small block would have 500rpm more pull in 1st-2nd shift and 300rpm more pull in 2nd-drive thats 800 rpm more total. This is figured on both cars with a 727 and stock gear ratio's. This would also be with the converter dead locked which we know don't happen, but still more useable rpm from the small block.

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You stated matched optimized combos between the two. A 500 HP BB is not optimized with a 3.23 gear. Further, it wouldnt fall back to 3500 rpm in second with the right vert.


The original question, 500 HP BB 440 vs 500 HP SB 360 in a 3000# car. In this case alone, at this level of performance, the broader torque range of the BB,s extra stroke should win.

The argument of Mechanical advantage with more gear has merit. But you can overgear IMO, Ive found that with my 500HP combo, it likes to dwell a little in first gear with the verts torque multiplications aspects.

Ive tested 3 gears with the same HP. RPM and gear multiplication isnt always the fastest way to the stripe at these 500 hp levels.

Pro stocks 500CI and 10,000 rpm,s sure different story.

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A 500hp BB has torque around 3000-3800 rpms. Would
need traction aids to hook well in a #3000lb car.
A 500hp SB has torque around 4000-4500 rpms. Needs traction aids also, but a bit EASIER to hook
in a #3000lb car, due to it's higher peak, not wider. Wider or broader torque band are great for
slightly heavier cars, but at #3000lbs, so much torque is there down low, tires are overwhelmed and they spin. During the run, things may or DO get "close" midtrack, but to the finish it's usually a "leg" race, with the one who has the higher rev potential winning.

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I agree the big block torque curve will be broader, but I said with gear and converter to match the combo's.


With that said a big block with a 275/60/15 tire with 3.23 shifted at 6000 rpm would fall back to 3500 in second, then back to 6000 and fall back to 4000 in drive. While a small block with the same tire and with 4.10 shifted at 7500 would fall back to 4500 in second and back to 7500 then fall to 5200 in drive. That small block would have 500rpm more pull in 1st-2nd shift and 300rpm more pull in 2nd-drive thats 800 rpm more total. This is figured on both cars with a 727 and stock gear ratio's. This would also be with the converter dead locked which we know don't happen, but still more useable rpm from the small block.

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You stated matched optimized combos between the two. A 500 HP BB is not optimized with a 3.23 gear. Further, it wouldnt fall back to 3500 rpm in second with the right vert.


The original question, 500 HP BB 440 vs 500 HP SB 360 in a 3000# car. In this case alone, at this level of performance, the broader torque range of the BB,s extra stroke should win.

The argument of Mechanical advantage with more gear has merit. But you can overgear IMO, Ive found that with my 500HP combo, it likes to dwell a little in first gear with the verts torque multiplications aspects.

Ive tested 3 gears with the same HP. RPM and gear multiplication isnt always the fastest way to the stripe at these 500 hp levels.

Pro stocks 500CI and 10,000 rpm,s sure different story.

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A 500hp BB has torque around 3000-3800 rpms. Would
need traction aids to hook well in a #3000lb car.
A 500hp SB has torque around 4000-4500 rpms. Needs traction aids also, but a bit EASIER to hook
in a #3000lb car, due to it's higher peak, not wider. Wider or broader torque band are great for
slightly heavier cars, but at #3000lbs, so much torque is there down low, tires are overwhelmed and they spin. During the run, things may or DO get "close" midtrack, but to the finish it's usually a "leg" race, with the one who has the higher rev potential winning.

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I have the BADDEST big-block on my street............PERIOD.

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you have a very impressive bigblock for sure

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I said "my street" cos there`s always someone around the corner who`s faster. This topic is good for both sides big and small blocks guys and gals alike as for me; I`d rather have the big block torque in a street/strip car and keep the r`s down than have a small block high revving monster that taxes even the best of parts.

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thats your opinion now here's mine dont take offense you have a big block that runs on race gas? i'll be honest here ur car runs 9.90's thats slow..what were sayin here is u dont need a bb to run 10'ooozzzz u can do it pretty easy and have ur car 140lbs lighter

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Whatever..........apparently you didn`t read what I wrote. I joked about having the fastest car on "my street" also, I drive on pump 91 and mix at the track and never claimed to have a " pump gas ONLY" car. I`ve read several of your posts and you`re very cocky......I`m humble. NO ONE where I live including RADICAL small blocks can match my et`s...........PERIOD. How much did your small block REALLY cost and how fast are you running and do you DRIVE it on the street like I do? Another thing; I had fuel and charging issues which I`ve worked out but unlike most of you guys ,we have one 1/4 track within several miles and it`s either big EXPENSIVE events or import fags tearing up and blowing up SCREWING up the track. I went back to back 6.22`s in the 1/8th.......how about you?

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That's another thing, to get a decent tire on an a-body you have to start cutting.

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That's another thing, to get a decent tire on an a-body you have to start cutting.

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Not on a Duster you don't. I have 275/60/15 drag radials on 15X8 rims with 4.5" backspacing and they fit perfectly with no rubbing.

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Yeah, but a Duster is just a Nova rear with a Valiant front clip..

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That's another thing, to get a decent tire on an a-body you have to start cutting.

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Not on a Duster you don't. I have 275/60/15 drag radials on 15X8 rims with 4.5" backspacing and they fit perfectly with no rubbing.

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Yeah, but a Duster is just a Nova rear with a Valiant front clip..

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My DUSTER is not a NNOVEE i can`t say it it`s a MOPAR please tail me you are a MOPAR guy and you joking because that hurts but cubic inchs makes horse power ..THANKS

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thumper sorry if i sound cocky I am NOT i am very giving person,,,i was just getting annoyed not at you..so sorry..i cant give u exact time with my car..as i do race for $ once in a while..but it does do 139mph in the 1/4 mopars!

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No problem......... When I freshen my heap and make a tweek or two I should be running a bit faster and I`ve been 134mph but my second half numbers didn`t match my 1/8th but, I`ll get it.

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A 500hp BB has torque around 3000-3800 rpms. Would
need traction aids to hook well in a #3000lb car.
A 500hp SB has torque around 4000-4500 rpms. Needs traction aids also, but a bit EASIER to hook
in a #3000lb car, due to it's higher peak, not wider. Wider or broader torque band are great for
slightly heavier cars, but at #3000lbs, so much torque is there down low, tires are overwhelmed and they spin. During the run, things may or DO get "close" midtrack, but to the finish it's usually a "leg" race, with the one who has the higher rev potential winning.

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The 248* cam I was using with a 440 BB, peak torque fell around 4500 RPM, peak HP around 5750. It was around 500 to 520 HP.

Im not sure where the torque and HP peaks would fall on a same HP 360 SB

It was hard to hook up at first but with tricks of the trade 1.43,s are effortless now.

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ok cool thump

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It`s all good...........

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That's another thing, to get a decent tire on an a-body you have to start cutting.

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Not on a Duster you don't. I have 275/60/15 drag radials on 15X8 rims with 4.5" backspacing and they fit perfectly with no rubbing.

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My friends '72 runs those same tires and
has plenty of bite, zero clearance problems.

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I agree the big block torque curve will be broader, but I said with gear and converter to match the combo's.


With that said a big block with a 275/60/15 tire with 3.23 shifted at 6000 rpm would fall back to 3500 in second, then back to 6000 and fall back to 4000 in drive. While a small block with the same tire and with 4.10 shifted at 7500 would fall back to 4500 in second and back to 7500 then fall to 5200 in drive. That small block would have 500rpm more pull in 1st-2nd shift and 300rpm more pull in 2nd-drive thats 800 rpm more total. This is figured on both cars with a 727 and stock gear ratio's. This would also be with the converter dead locked which we know don't happen, but still more useable rpm from the small block.

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You stated matched optimized combos between the two. A 500 HP BB is not optimized with a 3.23 gear. Further, it wouldnt fall back to 3500 rpm in second with the right vert.


The original question, 500 HP BB 440 vs 500 HP SB 360 in a 3000# car. In this case alone, at this level of performance, the broader torque range of the BB,s extra stroke should win.

The argument of Mechanical advantage with more gear has merit. But you can overgear IMO, Ive found that with my 500HP combo, it likes to dwell a little in first gear with the verts torque multiplications aspects.

Ive tested 3 gears with the same HP. RPM and gear multiplication isnt always the fastest way to the stripe at these 500 hp levels.

Pro stocks 500CI and 10,000 rpm,s sure different story.

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A 500hp BB has torque around 3000-3800 rpms. Would
need traction aids to hook well in a #3000lb car.
A 500hp SB has torque around 4000-4500 rpms. Needs traction aids also, but a bit EASIER to hook
in a #3000lb car, due to it's higher peak, not wider. Wider or broader torque band are great for
slightly heavier cars, but at #3000lbs, so much torque is there down low, tires are overwhelmed and they spin. During the run, things may or DO get "close" midtrack, but to the finish it's usually a "leg" race, with the one who has the higher rev potential winning.

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The 248* cam I was using with a 440 BB, peak torque fell around 4500 RPM, peak HP around 5750. It was around 500 to 520 HP.

Im not sure where the torque and HP peaks would fall on a same HP 360 SB

It was hard to hook up at first but with tricks of the trade 1.43,s are effortless now.

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Don't know the weight of your car, but there is an abundance of torque starting above 2.5K.
Did the right things to it!! In a 360, torque peak may be a tad higher than the 440 with the same cam
in it. Is the 248* a solid cam?

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It's amazing that in 2011, people still don't understand important things, like "shift recovery" and "useable rpm".

It has nothing to do with....."my big block is better than your small block, or vice versa.

Pity, I tell ya.

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You can talk to some people till your blue in the face and in the end all you got was blue in the face If they don't get it by now 2011 they will never get it and thats why most are still stuck thinking it's the 1970's with .590 cams and TRW pistons. If the last statement offends you then you are who I'm talking about.