Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: smalltyredart]
#3248341
07/30/24 08:26 AM
07/30/24 08:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,480 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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Pretty sure the Chapman's went 9.30s naturally aspirated w/ that orange super bee. That's what most mopar guys hang onto b/c so many view nitrous as cheating, lol. Later they went 8s w/ nitrous. I was there for the first nitrous passes in KOS. Kevin Chapman vs. Sheila Bowman. Sheila won, both ran 8.80s IIRC. I can't argue w/ the 4 link, but I kinda wish they'd just put CalTracs on the car. I just prefer the stock suspension stuff. But hey, not my car...still love it though. I'd be tired of replacing springs every 4 outings too.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: smalltyredart]
#3248365
07/30/24 10:24 AM
07/30/24 10:24 AM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,775 Wichita
GY3
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The car works very well, and the previous owners had a wealth of knowledge in their corner so they used it for everything it was worth.... pump gas, nmca super street, local heads up racing, and obviously KOS. Alot of superstock springs were sold cause of that car. It would also bend the hell out of a set of springs in 4 events. Maybe if MP didn't sell junk springs that are made in Mexico with no quality control! Mine bent a pair of 456/457's after one season of street strip use and it was only a low 11 second car! Cal-tracs for the win.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: smalltyredart]
#3248375
07/30/24 11:03 AM
07/30/24 11:03 AM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,296 Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak
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And it was far from naturally aspirated. Richard O'Malley built the nitrous system and later to me on the phone to " throw it in the garbage or donate it to a museum. I've never used N2O, but... I saw pics of one of O'Malley's (early?) nitrous plates many years ago and -- even then -- it looked like something I could have cobbled together on my kitchen table on a rainy Sunday afternoon ![laugh2 laugh2](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/laugh2.gif)
2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft) weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)
1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008] pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: GY3]
#3248379
07/30/24 11:16 AM
07/30/24 11:16 AM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,296 Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak
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Loudoun County, VA
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Pretty sure the Chapman's went 9.30s naturally aspirated w/ that orange super bee. That's what most mopar guys hang onto b/c so many view nitrous as cheating, lol. I catch more crap from the boomers about this while they're content running 12's. I don't view it as "cheating" and have thought about trying it on more than one occasion... and on more than one car ![whistling whistling](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/whistling.gif) However, the 1320 is still under warranty, and the old car "should" be running quick enough NA that it wouldn't take much spray at all to make the car too quick for either the car's or the driver's tech requirements. About the only chance I could see using it is for "non sanctioned" 1/8 mile stuff like Capitol's Friday Night events; I was told pretty much that until they become a fully-certified IHRA track that they're still basically an outlaw track...
2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft) weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)
1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008] pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: GY3]
#3248398
07/30/24 12:27 PM
07/30/24 12:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,522 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I catch more crap from the boomers about this while they're content running 12's. Not all boomers run 12's NA ya know. But yep plenty of old Mopar guys who can get their junk to run very well at all. Firmly stuck with thier heads buried in the 70's technology/mythology. As for nitrous whatever gets you where you want to be. I have had blown cars, nitrous cars and NA cars. I prefer the NA stuff and the challenge of what it brings, its just a choice. I had a nitrous SB in the 9's in the mid 90's, a blown car in the 9's in the early 2000's and have been 9's 8's and 7's NA since. It is all just a choice.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#3248528
07/31/24 06:26 AM
07/31/24 06:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,883 Smyrna, South Carolina
STEFF
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards?
Last edited by STEFF; 07/31/24 06:27 AM.
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: STEFF]
#3248551
07/31/24 09:06 AM
07/31/24 09:06 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,480 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? ![iagree iagree](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/iagree.gif) I've talked w/ Stephen Daurity about what they did w/ those cars back then. He laughed and said it was pretty much throw the kitchen sink at it right out the gate and hope for the best. You can hear it in some of those videos. Some of the O'malley stuff was different. Multiple crossbars in a plate w/ dual entries on each bar. Lots of plumbing, Y fittings everywhere, but it seemed to work OK back then. I'm sure it's all antiquated now.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#3248568
07/31/24 10:27 AM
07/31/24 10:27 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,736 On the parachute mount
n20mstr
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? ![iagree iagree](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/iagree.gif) I've talked w/ Stephen Daurity about what they did w/ those cars back then. He laughed and said it was pretty much throw the kitchen sink at it right out the gate and hope for the best. You can hear it in some of those videos. Some of the O'malley stuff was different. Multiple crossbars in a plate w/ dual entries on each bar. Lots of plumbing, Y fittings everywhere, but it seemed to work OK back then. I'm sure it's all antiquated now. IF they didnt try all that back then.... where would we be now??? that was the ground work for todays power management , Those guys were innovators, trying things that were not tried before, learning and pushing limits . AND that trancends all makes not just Mopar, but that was the early small tire heads up racing years. Mopars are still behind in the tech that all other makes have learned
Last edited by n20mstr; 07/31/24 10:29 AM.
....BAD A$$ STREET CAR.....
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: n20mstr]
#3248573
07/31/24 10:48 AM
07/31/24 10:48 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,480 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? ![iagree iagree](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/iagree.gif) I've talked w/ Stephen Daurity about what they did w/ those cars back then. He laughed and said it was pretty much throw the kitchen sink at it right out the gate and hope for the best. You can hear it in some of those videos. Some of the O'malley stuff was different. Multiple crossbars in a plate w/ dual entries on each bar. Lots of plumbing, Y fittings everywhere, but it seemed to work OK back then. I'm sure it's all antiquated now. IF they didnt try all that back then.... where would we be now??? that was the ground work for todays power management , Those guys were innovators, trying things that were not tried before, learning and pushing limits . AND that trancends all makes not just Mopar, but that was the early small tire heads up racing years. Mopars are still behind in the tech that all other makes have learned Absolutely. Back then a 29.5x10.5 was small for that kind of power and some people were amazed they went down the track at all. Now look what guys are running on what seems like 1/2 the tire!
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#3248611
07/31/24 01:46 PM
07/31/24 01:46 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,775 Wichita
GY3
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master
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Wichita
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? ![iagree iagree](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/iagree.gif) I've talked w/ Stephen Daurity about what they did w/ those cars back then. He laughed and said it was pretty much throw the kitchen sink at it right out the gate and hope for the best. You can hear it in some of those videos. Some of the O'malley stuff was different. Multiple crossbars in a plate w/ dual entries on each bar. Lots of plumbing, Y fittings everywhere, but it seemed to work OK back then. I'm sure it's all antiquated now. It's pretty amazing that you can get a 500 hp billet plate with tune-ups that are pretty close right out of the box anymore. Unfortunately, so many wives tales have been spun about the limitations of the stock Mopar blocks that people are afraid to try it.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: STEFF]
#3248654
07/31/24 04:42 PM
07/31/24 04:42 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16 at work
smalltyredart
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? That's a major part of the equation.. the car had junk (maybe Monroe matics) on it when Fred got it. Absolutely nothing special.
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: smalltyredart]
#3248753
08/01/24 10:20 AM
08/01/24 10:20 AM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,296 Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak
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Joined: Dec 2021
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Loudoun County, VA
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I'm sure with today's power management capabilities and shock technology, that the Leafs would survive today. There's been plenty that have gone faster with more power and not bend stuff. But, since it is already has a 4 link, why would ya' go backwards? That's a major part of the equation.. the car had junk (maybe Monroe matics) on it when Fred got it. Absolutely nothing special. IIRC, the shocks Direct Connection / Mopar Performance sold for SS spring applications (they offered both manual-trans and auto-trans versions) were simply OEM-fitment truck shocks that they figured out worked better w/ their springs than standard passenger car dampers. Oh, as far as SS springs durability, yeah... I'd heard years ago the Made in Mexico parts were short-lived vs the Made in Canada parts (like I had on my Challenger "way back when") which held up much better. Regardless, SS springs and truck shocks were low-tech even then ==> "Hello, Captain Obvious!" ![grin grin](/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/custom/grin.gif)
2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft) weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)
1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008] pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
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Re: Rob Sylvester's KOS '69 super bee?
[Re: Brad_Haak]
#3253824
08/26/24 10:13 AM
08/26/24 10:13 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,480 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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OP
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Here's the pic of Rob's bee from the Munroe 727 rebuild book I mentioned.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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