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Welding Questions: help me be better. #928036
02/13/11 07:15 PM
02/13/11 07:15 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Ok been an amateur welder for about 3years now. Im using a hobart 140 (120v) with 75/25 gas set at 20cfh and .023 wire.

Ive welded patches and floor pans and many other misc things with some success and some crap. I love the welder, for the price I thought it was very good and does all I need to do.

The main question is: once in while when I start my weld the wire starts to melt back on itself and not place itself on the metal. It leaves glowing little ball of material on the wire and you have to start again. This is VERY annoying and often causes a bad next weld. What is causing this? Unclean metal? Ground to far from weld? (maybe an amateur )

Another thing would it be advantageous to switch to 0.030 wire for panel work?

Enlighten me so I can be a good amateur!


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928037
02/13/11 07:49 PM
02/13/11 07:49 PM
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Sounds like wire feed rate too slow or heat range too high. Just my opinion. Randy


1957 Dodge truck, Snakeskin Green with a little stroker motor. 1964 Plymouth Savoy wagon ( my new project)
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: rattler] #928038
02/13/11 08:12 PM
02/13/11 08:12 PM
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Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:

Sounds like wire feed rate too slow or heat range too high. Just my opinion. Randy




exactly...

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: rattler] #928039
02/13/11 08:17 PM
02/13/11 08:17 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Quote:

Sounds like wire feed rate too slow or heat range too high. Just my opinion. Randy




This was what I was thinking but on a heat range of 1-4 I was it on 2 when this and the recommended speed is 20 I like 25 to 30 for this. But its possible.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928040
02/13/11 08:19 PM
02/13/11 08:19 PM
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I agree with the others. Check the paperwork you got with the welder. There should be a guide or some info with it that will give you various wire speed, wire thickness and heat range settings for various gauges of metal. On my MIG there's a label on the inside of the door where you add a new wire spool that has all those settings. Those will get you in the ballpark. After that it's making fine adjustments of either the wire speed or heat range til the sound the weld creates sounds like frying bacon.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928041
02/13/11 08:24 PM
02/13/11 08:24 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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also sometimes it works perfect than move over a foot and it will ball up?

OH and it does it on more vertical or inverted surfaces and not on horizontal that I can think of, such as where the gun would be below the weld. Also related to these situations, sometimes the weld will follow the wire up and and build a chimney around the wire.

Now given these are rare occurrence but when they happen they are a major pain so I would like to eliminate them and I havent found the magic bullet yet.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: Sixpak] #928042
02/13/11 08:27 PM
02/13/11 08:27 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Quote:

I agree with the others. Check the paperwork you got with the welder. There should be a guide or some info with it that will give you various wire speed, wire thickness and heat range settings for various gauges of metal. On my MIG there's a label on the inside of the door where you add a new wire spool that has all those settings. Those will get you in the ballpark. After that it's making fine adjustments of either the wire speed or heat range til the sound the weld creates sounds like frying bacon.




Agreed on the sound but you dont want to fry bacon while hanging a quarter! Also I have been using these guide lines provide by welder and usually speed the wire up just a bit.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928043
02/13/11 08:30 PM
02/13/11 08:30 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

I agree with the others. Check the paperwork you got with the welder. There should be a guide or some info with it that will give you various wire speed, wire thickness and heat range settings for various gauges of metal. On my MIG there's a label on the inside of the door where you add a new wire spool that has all those settings. Those will get you in the ballpark. After that it's making fine adjustments of either the wire speed or heat range til the sound the weld creates sounds like frying bacon.




Agreed on the sound but you dont want to fry bacon while hanging a quarter! Also I have been using these guide lines provide by welder and usually speed the wire up just a bit.




Yup - hanging a quarter is different. You want it a tad hotter and less wire if you are doing quick bursts and small welds.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: Sixpak] #928044
02/13/11 08:33 PM
02/13/11 08:33 PM
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Yep, I'm no great shakes, but underneath welding up is tougher than the other positions...

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: Sixpak] #928045
02/13/11 08:36 PM
02/13/11 08:36 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Quote:


Yup - hanging a quarter is different. You want it a tad hotter and less wire if you are doing quick bursts and small welds.




I never would have though less wire though. More heat ya... hmm have to try it sometime.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928046
02/13/11 08:58 PM
02/13/11 08:58 PM
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Quote:

also sometimes it works perfect than move over a foot and it will ball up?

OH and it does it on more vertical or inverted surfaces and not on horizontal that I can think of, such as where the gun would be below the weld. Also related to these situations, sometimes the weld will follow the wire up and and build a chimney around the wire.

Now given these are rare occurrence but when they happen they are a major pain so I would like to eliminate them and I havent found the magic bullet yet.




Welding inverted , overhead , you need to use a FLUX core wire , no gas , that's why you are having problems wi hthat weld , that type Hobart is a marginal machine at best, we have one at work , it bites.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: JohnRR] #928047
02/13/11 09:13 PM
02/13/11 09:13 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Quote:

Welding inverted , overhead , you need to use a FLUX core wire , no gas , that's why you are having problems wi hthat weld , that type Hobart is a marginal machine at best, we have one at work , it bites.




so no welding with gun below weld on gas?

Just curious what would be a good one at $450-500 range on 120v? My old man has a 220v bigger brother to mine and you can tell it MUCH hotter but I like the portableness and the fact I only have 120v in garage.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928048
02/13/11 10:32 PM
02/13/11 10:32 PM
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mesa arizona
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Quote:

Quote:

Welding inverted , overhead , you need to use a FLUX core wire , no gas , that's why you are having problems wi hthat weld , that type Hobart is a marginal machine at best, we have one at work , it bites.




so no welding with gun below weld on gas?

Just curious what would be a good one at $450-500 range on 120v? My old man has a 220v bigger brother to mine and you can tell it MUCH hotter but I like the portableness and the fact I only have 120v in garage.




The hobart is a good machine. I use one everday,it will work fine for what you are doing. It takes practice welding upside down but you can do it, with gas. I have found that sometimes switching the polarity of the machine will help when welding upside down. The .023 is what you need for body panels. On my machine with .023 wire and sheet metel I usually have it set at 2 and 40-45. Also is your liner good? do you have a good ground clamp you also need to make sure not to have the machine too close to where you are working, try to keep liner as straight as possible, bends can cause the wire and machine to do weird things. If you are using magnet to hold things together you should ry to move them away from your weld, the magnetic field messes with your weld. Dont run your machine off of an extension chord unless its short and large guage wire, its no good for the welder and will make for bad welds.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: moturbopar] #928049
02/13/11 10:45 PM
02/13/11 10:45 PM
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kilroy Offline OP
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Thanks guys for tips! Keep them coming so I can try em all as experience is the ultimate guide...but friends sure help a hellva lot too! Bout half the things said I know BUT the other half will surely help and be fun to see what works for me.

Reversing polarity isnt really bad for machine in unintended uses? Maybe you could enlighten me as to what reversing exactly does to welding. I know you reverse it for flux core.


1973 Charger, former SE, former auto

I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....
Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928050
02/13/11 11:44 PM
02/13/11 11:44 PM
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Ontario, Canada
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Quote:

Welding inverted , overhead , you need to use a FLUX core wire , no gas




This is BS ! Do you think all welders or welding shops switch units to do overhead welding ?

When welding overhead you cut back on the heat and amperage IF you have a machine that can dial down both. Otherwise plug into the recommended heat setting then back off the amperage (wire speed). On an overhead weld you want to move faster so the puddle doesn't drop AND you want to keep the stickout shorter - 1/4" to 1/8" - get right in there! Welding vertical you can use your normal settings but either push or drag DOWN not up. That mixed gas you're using will produce a nice weld with very little spatter but is not good for anything other than close to vertical welding - some on here will disagree but go to the supplier's website and see what they say !!

As for your balling up problem, all good suggestions but before you change anything else, make sure your wire stickout is about 3/8" to start, your torch angle about 10-15* from vertical and most important SQUEEZE THAT TRIGGER! Too many people just get scared by the "snap" and let go the trigger. Don't be afraid to hold it on to start the puddle.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928051
02/14/11 03:54 AM
02/14/11 03:54 AM
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Quote:



The main question is: once in while when I start my weld the wire starts to melt back on itself and not place itself on the metal. It leaves glowing little ball of material on the wire and you have to start again.




That is your start-up voltage. Most welders give you a shot of voltage for two reasons:

1. Arc stability

2. Create heat to avoid cold-lap.

Use it to your advantage. Be patient, wait it out and keep the trigger pulled.

Look at the weld pool, not what the wire is doing!

If you are blowing holes, turn up the wire speed. Hopefully this welder has infinite adjustability, not the huge A, B, C, or 1, 2, 3, click stuff.


Mo' Farts

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Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: kilroy] #928052
02/14/11 05:08 AM
02/14/11 05:08 AM
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Aurora, Colorado
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I have an older Hobart mig, and it works fine.
Make sure the weld area is clean metal, purge the gas line, and check the polarity. Like others have said don't be afraid of putting some heat into it.
Practice on some scrap of the same thickness.

Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: 451Mopar] #928053
02/14/11 08:04 AM
02/14/11 08:04 AM
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my is a canox firefry 115 gas 030 wire
set at one wire set 90


Last edited by 440beep; 02/14/11 08:17 AM.

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Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: Stanton] #928054
02/14/11 09:13 AM
02/14/11 09:13 AM
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Quote:

Quote:

Welding inverted , overhead , you need to use a FLUX core wire , no gas




This is BS ! Do you think all welders or welding shops switch units to do overhead welding ?

When welding overhead you cut back on the heat and amperage IF you have a machine that can dial down both. Otherwise plug into the recommended heat setting then back off the amperage (wire speed). On an overhead weld you want to move faster so the puddle doesn't drop AND you want to keep the stickout shorter - 1/4" to 1/8" - get right in there! Welding vertical you can use your normal settings but either push or drag DOWN not up. That mixed gas you're using will produce a nice weld with very little spatter but is not good for anything other than close to vertical welding - some on here will disagree but go to the supplier's website and see what they say !!

As for your balling up problem, all good suggestions but before you change anything else, make sure your wire stickout is about 3/8" to start, your torch angle about 10-15* from vertical and most important SQUEEZE THAT TRIGGER! Too many people just get scared by the "snap" and let go the trigger. Don't be afraid to hold it on to start the puddle.



Re: Welding Questions: help me be better. [Re: 451Mopar] #928055
02/14/11 09:58 AM
02/14/11 09:58 AM
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Ontario, Canada
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Quote:

purge the gas line




A very good point that many occasional welders forget. Turn on the gas at the regulator, turn on your welder then hit the trigger for a couple seconds. Snip the excess wire off and you're good to go.

Although a lot of people don't do it, try to get in the habit of snipping off the little ball on the end of the wire before starting each weld. This is actually contaminated metal that will contaminate your weld. Yes, its a nuisance.

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