Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: actionange]
#907973
01/18/11 10:15 PM
01/18/11 10:15 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,628 anywhere@ anytime
actionange
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Quote:
Mike, I have an 10 point rollcage done in my 67 Belvedere. The 2 rear bars were custom bent to go down through the speaker holes. The front seat had to be out and the rear seat had to be sneaked in between the main hoop and rear bars with the rear windows rolled down- but it went in and there it will stay. I get some pics on here later today for all to see. How's the rest of your project coming along?
Here are some pics as promised earlier.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: actionange]
#907977
01/18/11 10:36 PM
01/18/11 10:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330 Lynchburg, VA
Leon441
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Lynchburg, VA
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I REALLY HATE TO BE THE BEARER OF BAD NEWS!!!
You might as well solder those rear supports in your car if you are going to bend them. The reason these bars are required is as follows. When you are traveling at speed and the car rolls it is most likely traveling forward. Force will try and lay the main hoop down into the rear seat area. These supports keep the main hoop up right. If you have ever used a tubing bender you will know why bending these bars is such a bad idea. A rear halo, as pictured, is the way to go. But, there is no need in the third and fourth bar from the halo to the main hoop. They intersect the hoop in the middle. This will support the middle of the hoop but is really unecessary. An X from the hoop to the front windsheild bar would do a lot more. Just be sure the bars going from the main hoop to the back seat halo have bars on the opposite side of the intersect going to the frame rail.
Not trying to bash anyones hard work but sometimes bad ideas get passed on when trying to find an easy way around a situation. Just remember mild steel tubing is strong when straight and noodles when bent if the bends are not structurely supported.
Leon
Career best 8.02 @ 169 at 3050# and 10" tires small block power.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: Leon441]
#907978
01/18/11 11:06 PM
01/18/11 11:06 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,131 Thigh-Gap Junction
@#$%&*!
New user name, Same old jerk!
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New user name, Same old jerk!
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,131
Thigh-Gap Junction
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Quote:
I REALLY HATE TO BE THE BEARER OF BAD NEWS!!!
You might as well solder those rear supports in your car if you are going to bend them. The reason these bars are required is as follows. When you are traveling at speed and the car rolls it is most likely traveling forward. Force will try and lay the main hoop down into the rear seat area. These supports keep the main hoop up right. If you have ever used a tubing bender you will know why bending these bars is such a bad idea. A rear halo, as pictured, is the way to go. But, there is no need in the third and fourth bar from the halo to the main hoop. They intersect the hoop in the middle. This will support the middle of the hoop but is really unecessary. An X from the hoop to the front windsheild bar would do a lot more. Just be sure the bars going from the main hoop to the back seat halo have bars on the opposite side of the intersect going to the frame rail.
Not trying to bash anyones hard work but sometimes bad ideas get passed on when trying to find an easy way around a situation. Just remember mild steel tubing is strong when straight and noodles when bent if the bends are not structurely supported.
Leon
Those bent rear support bars are going fold like newspaper if they're ever asked to do their job. Also, they don't contribute much to chassis rigidity.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: Leon441]
#907979
01/19/11 10:07 AM
01/19/11 10:07 AM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,628 anywhere@ anytime
actionange
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,628
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Quote:
I REALLY HATE TO BE THE BEARER OF BAD NEWS!!!
You might as well solder those rear supports in your car if you are going to bend them. The reason these bars are required is as follows. When you are traveling at speed and the car rolls it is most likely traveling forward. Force will try and lay the main hoop down into the rear seat area. These supports keep the main hoop up right. If you have ever used a tubing bender you will know why bending these bars is such a bad idea. A rear halo, as pictured, is the way to go. But, there is no need in the third and fourth bar from the halo to the main hoop. They intersect the hoop in the middle. This will support the middle of the hoop but is really unecessary. An X from the hoop to the front windsheild bar would do a lot more. Just be sure the bars going from the main hoop to the back seat halo have bars on the opposite side of the intersect going to the frame rail.
Not trying to bash anyones hard work but sometimes bad ideas get passed on when trying to find an easy way around a situation. Just remember mild steel tubing is strong when straight and noodles when bent if the bends are not structurely supported.
Leon
What happens to the tubing if it's chrome moly as my cage is?
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: actionange]
#907980
01/19/11 08:06 PM
01/19/11 08:06 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 89 oregon
ramcharger1964
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 89
oregon
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Here are a couple pic's of my 64 Polara withan 8 pt. I also wanted to be able to use the backseat but make it legal for 10.50 racing. It wasn't too bad to install with the headliner out but was still a little tricky to weld - had to use mirrors.
I also made the cross brace removeable so you can get in and out easily (yes I know this is not NHRA legal - but with the foam installed I have never been checked...)If you want to take the kids for a ride just remove the "tooth smasher" and go!
Hell B!tch Racing Co.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: actionange]
#907982
01/19/11 08:23 PM
01/19/11 08:23 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330 Lynchburg, VA
Leon441
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330
Lynchburg, VA
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Quote:
Quote:
I REALLY HATE TO BE THE BEARER OF BAD NEWS!!!
You might as well solder those rear supports in your car if you are going to bend them. The reason these bars are required is as follows. When you are traveling at speed and the car rolls it is most likely traveling forward. Force will try and lay the main hoop down into the rear seat area. These supports keep the main hoop up right. If you have ever used a tubing bender you will know why bending these bars is such a bad idea. A rear halo, as pictured, is the way to go. But, there is no need in the third and fourth bar from the halo to the main hoop. They intersect the hoop in the middle. This will support the middle of the hoop but is really unecessary. An X from the hoop to the front windsheild bar would do a lot more. Just be sure the bars going from the main hoop to the back seat halo have bars on the opposite side of the intersect going to the frame rail.
Not trying to bash anyones hard work but sometimes bad ideas get passed on when trying to find an easy way around a situation. Just remember mild steel tubing is strong when straight and noodles when bent if the bends are not structurely supported.
Leon
What happens to the tubing if it's chrome moly as my cage is?
Well chrome moly is harder to bend as anyone will tell you who has used a bender. But, it will still bend. Last time I asked this question, bending these bars is legal but, so is dating your sister. Don't do it. Like I tell my kids "If I didn't care I wouldn't try to steer you the right way"
Leon
Career best 8.02 @ 169 at 3050# and 10" tires small block power.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: aquamist60]
#907985
01/19/11 10:58 PM
01/19/11 10:58 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,628 anywhere@ anytime
actionange
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Quote:
We used chrome moly tubes in my '67. We pulled out the back seat & made bunches of measurements. The down bars from the main hoop are straight, go through speaker holes & weld in near the back of the trunk. I've got pics but they are in my other computer & it's down right now. With the bars the way we have them the rear seat does go in, but it is a tight fit & is NHRA legal.
When your computer is up and running again please post those pics.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: actionange]
#907986
01/19/11 11:04 PM
01/19/11 11:04 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 248 Ohio
aquamist60
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 248
Ohio
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Will do. It's got a bug right now. I did back up the pics, but can't find the disc. If I can't get them I'll go out & take some more.
Last edited by aquamist60; 01/19/11 11:05 PM.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: Quicksilver440]
#907987
01/19/11 11:08 PM
01/19/11 11:08 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Anytime you have a bend in the bar you should have a support bar for the bend.... a bent bar doesnt do anything strength wise... here's a pic of my front bars
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: Sixpak]
#907989
01/20/11 12:00 AM
01/20/11 12:00 AM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,897 MI, usa
dvw
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master
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MI, usa
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Quote:
Guys, forget about ANYONE ever 'using' the back seat again, ever, unless you pad everything and install a 5 point harness for everyone in the back, and they wear a helmet, and then cross your fingers...unless you like seeing your friends or loved ones smashed to bits if god forbid you get into any sort of an accident. There's a reason why they mandate a 5 point harness and roll bar padding once a bar or cage is installed, and that's to prevent the same thing from happening to the driver. What makes you think a back seat passenger is going to be safe without all that? Way more steel around them to crash into as well, and they are blocked from a quick exit as well. Put 'em in the pass front seat... with a harness and padding.
I guess no one should drive a car with a full cage then either. Whats the difference between hitting any inside metal object or the bar? At least the bars can be padded. Doug
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: dvw]
#907990
01/20/11 12:35 AM
01/20/11 12:35 AM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,809 Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,809
Bitopia
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Quote:
Quote:
Guys, forget about ANYONE ever 'using' the back seat again, ever, unless you pad everything and install a 5 point harness for everyone in the back, and they wear a helmet, and then cross your fingers...unless you like seeing your friends or loved ones smashed to bits if god forbid you get into any sort of an accident. There's a reason why they mandate a 5 point harness and roll bar padding once a bar or cage is installed, and that's to prevent the same thing from happening to the driver. What makes you think a back seat passenger is going to be safe without all that? Way more steel around them to crash into as well, and they are blocked from a quick exit as well. Put 'em in the pass front seat... with a harness and padding.
I guess no one should drive a car with a full cage then either. Whats the difference between hitting any inside metal object or the bar? At least the bars can be padded. Doug
I think the main difference would you are the driver, who has control? from the moment the starter engages vs a passenger has none except to exit the car.
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: Putting in a roll bar and using the back seat
[Re: Sixpak]
#907991
01/20/11 01:04 AM
01/20/11 01:04 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,600 Alberta Canada
StrokerAspen
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Alberta Canada
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Yeah, I decided to keep my back seat as well. I put a 10 point chromo cage in my car. I did bend the rear bars to suit. No one rides back there, but everyone has their idea of a street car. One of the things on my check list for a street car is a back seat. Despite, the bent rear bars, the cage stiffened up the car A LOT! The back seat was a pain to get back in, pretty sure i broke some of the seat structure in the process, but its in there (all green and nasty). -Kenny
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