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electricity in the radiator #902982 01/12/11 06:18 PM 01/12/11 06:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA T TrueTripleX OP super stock
TrueTripleX OP super stock T Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA	I have a 1999 Dodge truck that has an unusual ??problem?? and I would like to know what the truth is. I had an issue with the radiator being eaten up. The radiator shop told me that I had an electrolysis issue because of electricity in the radiator. With a volt meter, with one probe in the water, they showed me that there was electricity flowing through the radiator. Replaced the radiator, put on additional ground straps, but still have the same electrical flow. Another shop told me that ALL newer vehicles have this electrical flow. They proceeded to show me on another Dodge truck, a ford truck and a Mercedes that they were all carrying electricity in the water in the radiators. This other shop said that this was because of the �green� antifreeze, but that doesn�t sound right to me. What�s the story and should I be concerned

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: TrueTripleX] #902983 01/12/11 06:24 PM 01/12/11 06:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 606 Montana Y Yancy Derringer mopar
Yancy Derringer mopar Y Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 606 Montana	I don't know if he's right or not but he could be. Electrolysis works more like a battery, remember your simple science? You need two "dissimilar" metals and an electrolyte. a lemon, a dime, and a penny make a battery. It might just be that the radiator, the block, and the antifreeze are causing this. It's been a long time, but big trucks used to use sacrificial filters and additives to help prevent this, and if it's this bad, Chrysler should be doing something with it.

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: Yancy Derringer] #902984 01/12/11 06:37 PM 01/12/11 06:37 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA T TrueTripleX OP super stock
TrueTripleX OP super stock T Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA	Quote: I don't know if he's right or not but he could be. Electrolysis works more like a battery, remember your simple science? You need two "dissimilar" metals and an electrolyte. a lemon, a dime, and a penny make a battery. It might just be that the radiator, the block, and the antifreeze are causing this. It's been a long time, but big trucks used to use sacrificial filters and additives to help prevent this, and if it's this bad, Chrysler should be doing something with it. Thanks Yancy and I do remember the high school science, but this is registering 12 V. It seems like this is too high a number. They also stuck the probe in the upper radiator hose (in the middle) and registered 12V. Strange???

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: TrueTripleX] #902985 01/12/11 06:50 PM 01/12/11 06:50 PM
Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington A AB&E enthusiast
AB&E enthusiast A Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington	been there done that it is true I ate up 2 radiators before grounding everything. then I would sale it electrolisis eats up metal like headgaskets & everything else dump it it is a known problem in certain years mainly chevrolet I believe

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: TrueTripleX] #902986 01/12/11 06:54 PM 01/12/11 06:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 3,001 Coram, NY Pool Fixer master
Pool Fixer master Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 3,001 Coram, NY	I remember on the "shade tree mechanic" show..or maybe it was later when they changed it to "two guys garage" they built a gmc caballero (like el camino) and they installed some electric box and said it would stop electrolysis and slow down rust or something like that. maybe look into that. sounded like an easy thing to hook up and low draw.

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: TrueTripleX] #902987 01/12/11 06:57 PM 01/12/11 06:57 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,766 A Andrewh master
Andrewh master A Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,766	nope, not strange. you may have some stray current but it does happen. 2 dissimilar metals in a current carrying solution will get galvanic corosion. aluminum corrodes faster than cast iron and it will eventually eat it away. extra ground helps, having rad fluid changed out to something that doesn't carry current helps. Hopefully they fully flushed your system with new coolant. also I added a zinc annode to my system to so it will be eaten first. Change it out every few years. Same thing happens in your hot water heater, same thing happens on boats/ships etc.. got mine from some place called boatzincs or something like that. put it in a block plug instead of the rad but either way works. gives the ssytem something else to eat instead of the rad.

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: Pool Fixer] #902988 01/12/11 06:59 PM 01/12/11 06:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington A AB&E enthusiast
AB&E enthusiast A Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington	I have been in the used car bus for 30yrs we just sold a 2001 dakota 4.7 had the same problem but it ate all the metal out of the thermostate housing and all the water ports then it took the headgaskets about 200 miles later like I said hook up the grounds like it sounds like they did and sale it to someone not on moparts or plan on possibly replacing motor electrolosis kills metal inside the motor with any water contact overtime

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: AB&E] #902989 01/12/11 07:40 PM 01/12/11 07:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,012 indiana M mcmopars super stock
mcmopars super stock M Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,012 indiana	wow, been around cars for 35 years and never heard or should i say has never happened to me or seen it,but to each his own.learn something new everyday

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: AB&E] #902990 01/12/11 07:44 PM 01/12/11 07:44 PM
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 7,197 Harrisburg, Pa. screamindriver master
screamindriver master Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 7,197 Harrisburg, Pa.	Where is a good place to add the zinc annode ???

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: AB&E] #902991 01/12/11 08:08 PM 01/12/11 08:08 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA T TrueTripleX OP super stock
TrueTripleX OP super stock T Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,061 Ball Ground GA	We have grounded the radiator to the chassis and extra groung on the block to the chassis. Where else should I put ground straps to help with this

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: screamindriver] #902992 01/12/11 08:15 PM 01/12/11 08:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,179 California mickm master
mickm master Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,179 California	maybe i'm misunderstanding this, but it seems like having that kind of voltage in the radiator is not a normal situation. wouldn't he be better off finding out why it is there, and getting it to a normal situation rather than putting band aids on it?

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: mickm] #902993 01/12/11 08:26 PM 01/12/11 08:26 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,766 A Andrewh master
Andrewh master A Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,766	it isn't a bandaid, it is how it works. There are multiple paths to ground. As long as your coolant has enough iron from the block to be conductive this is going to happen. More grounds on the block will help. grounds on the rad, (since it is bolted to the body) probably don't make so much of a difference, if anything, I would isolate it so it doesn't give a path to ground. Thus preventing current from flowing in that direction. Zinc anodes have been around a very long time. Aluminum radiators have not been common for our old cars but are common for new cars and most have something like that.

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: Andrewh] #902994 01/12/11 08:49 PM 01/12/11 08:49 PM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: also I added a zinc annode to my system to so it will be eaten first. got mine from some place called boatzincs or something like that. put it in a block plug instead of the rad but either way works. They're cheap maybe ~$15 & have pipe threads iirc 3/8 or 1/2 NPT & put anywhere in the cooling system in any unused port, that & as said extra ground strap(s) EDIT esp needed w alum rad Last edited by RapidRobert; 01/14/11 10:43 PM. live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: Andrewh] #902995 01/12/11 09:07 PM 01/12/11 09:07 PM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,179 California mickm master
mickm master Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,179 California	Quote: it isn't a bandaid, it is how it works. i guess i don't understand why this isn't an issue with every car then. it sounds like this exists to some degree in every car, but more so in others, enough to cause this type of damage. so wouldn't there be some reason why his car has a higher amount of electricity flowing through the coolant, and try to figure out why that is?

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: TrueTripleX] #902996 01/12/11 09:11 PM 01/12/11 09:11 PM
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 53 Jensen Beach, Florida pressureangle member
pressureangle member Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 53 Jensen Beach, Florida	Some years back I serviced a fleet of Caterpillar forklifts which constantly threw trouble codes and ate sensors, brass plugs and even the thermostats. To make a long story short; First check for AC voltage in the coolant. If you have any (~5vac) have your alternator tested by a competent auto electric shop (not the NAPA spin-o-tron) Secondly, as others have said be certain that the radiator, chassis, and engine are all thoroughly grounded together. I prefer to ground the chassis and radiator both to the same attachment point as the engine block negative. If your engine and radiator are completely grounded together, there won't be any juice to pass through the coolant. Lastly, and importantly; what we discovered with the Caterpillar forklifts was that the alternator bodies were not grounded to the engines. The blocks and brackets were painted, and although the engine and radiator were both grounded to the frame, the ground loop found its way back to the alternator through the engine(starter ground)chassis(lights/gauges grounds)via the coolant. I still don't fully understand the path, but we grounded the alternators thoroughly and the problem went away. Why do I torture myself so?

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: AB&E] #902997 01/12/11 10:40 PM 01/12/11 10:40 PM
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 15,487 Florida S scratchnfotraction I Live Here
scratchnfotraction I Live Here S Joined: May 2003 Posts: 15,487 Florida	never had this problem myself,maybe cause I drive older junk with bigger problems but i learned 2 things from this post 1) the anode thing a ma jig goes in the block or rad 2) dont buy any cars from AB&E

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: scratchnfotraction] #902998 01/12/11 11:04 PM 01/12/11 11:04 PM
Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 6,167 Maryland GO_Fish master
GO_Fish master Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 6,167 Maryland	Old coolant can become corrosive itself also, pH becomes acidic. More of a problem with diesels than gas I think, and more of a problem with aluminum radiators than copper. In general the more aluminum parts in the engine, the more vulnerable also I'd say. Stay up on your coolant changes and use the grounds mentioned. Would be nice if someone made a radiator cap with a zinc anode hanging from it... At some point, corrosion becomes rampant and takes on a life of its own in the entire system or vehicle. Once the corrosion has become that entrenched, there is almost nothing you can do to stop the process more than briefly. You put new parts on and they corrode within months. When it gets to that point, time to look for another ride. Scott B. "I'm a self-made man... I started with nothing, and I still have most of it!" 68 360 rusty B'cuda 'vert (GO Fish)13.59@ 98.72 mph 69 340 GTS stock 14.18@ 95.60 mph 01 5.9L Ram 1500 Quad Cab 4x4 01 3.5L 300M 16.23@ 86.97 mph

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: GO_Fish] #902999 01/12/11 11:15 PM 01/12/11 11:15 PM
Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 146 rhode island B bomber1965 member
bomber1965 member B Joined: Oct 2010 Posts: 146 rhode island	Quote: Would be nice if someone made a radiator cap with a zinc anode hanging from it... rad cap anode Product Details The cooling system of a Viper, SRT-10 Ram and many other cars carries a slight positive charge. This charge will cause erosion of the aluminum components in contact with the coolant. The sacrificial anode is immersed in the coolant tank and because it's a "softer" metal, the EME attacks the anode instead. Extends the life of all metal components in the coolant system. You'll be stunned to see the corrosion it begins to show after just two weeks. Fits all model year Vipers and SRT Rams Last edited by bomber1965; 01/12/11 11:17 PM.

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: GO_Fish] #903000 01/12/11 11:53 PM 01/12/11 11:53 PM
Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington A AB&E enthusiast
AB&E enthusiast A Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 204 washington	Quote: Old coolant can become corrosive itself also, pH becomes acidic. More of a problem with diesels than gas I think, and more of a problem with aluminum radiators than copper. In general the more aluminum parts in the engine, the more vulnerable also I'd say. Stay up on your coolant changes and use the grounds mentioned. Would be nice if someone made a radiator cap with a zinc anode hanging from it... At some point, corrosion becomes rampant and takes on a life of its own in the entire system or vehicle. Once the corrosion has become that entrenched, there is almost nothing you can do to stop the process more than briefly. You put new parts on and they corrode within months. When it gets to that point, time to look for another ride. my point exactly time for a new ride there is a level of elec. in most i believe but then there is to many amps or what have ya very common in big diesel trucks atleast the ones the built 30 yrs ago

Re: electricity in the radiator [Re: scratchnfotraction] #903001 01/13/11 10:02 AM 01/13/11 10:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,270 Missouri M MY340 master
MY340 master M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,270 Missouri	Quote: never had this problem myself,maybe cause I drive older junk with bigger problems but i learned 2 things from this post 1) the anode thing a ma jig goes in the block or rad 2) dont buy any cars from AB&E especially with #2 1970 FE5 Duster 360/904/3.91's SOLD 1973 TB3 SpaceDuster 340/4spd/4.10's SOLD Moparless for now but when the opportunity is right I'll have another one.

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