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Re: flat rates for paint work
[Re: NITROUSN]
#86401
07/10/08 03:02 AM
07/10/08 03:02 AM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Quote:
As stated these cars need virtually no body repair other than blocking out the bodies.
I am not looking for anyone to give me an estimate here, just the crash book times for refinishing.
Says you the so called ex-body shop owner. I can see why no one in your area will deal with you. Mister know it all with his own paint in hand.
You seem to create a very un-likeable personality in every forum you pop up in.
A typical know everything.
I really didn't want to go down this road but you are just suuucking me in.
What is your problem?
A know it all doesn't ask questions, he gives all of the answers. Does this shoe fit you? Are you standing in front of my car looking at it as I am?
So now tell me, who is the know it all?
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Re: flat rates for paint work
[Re: MOBodyman]
#86402
07/10/08 03:12 AM
07/10/08 03:12 AM
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Mr T2U and MOBodyman,
I totally understand what both of you are saying.
OTOH, I was there when these cars were new and remember too how fenders and other body parts came off of the freight trucks with no covering and dented. If these are the "new" parts you are referring to, they certainly weren't bolt on ready.
Yes, the factory paint quality and body panels were not good back in the day, and Mopar was the worst. Again, OTOH, I think that the factory orange peel put out by the factories and the repair shops that people have come to find "acceptable" is pathetic.
All I really want out of this thread is an answer as to weather anyone has access to the crash book times for these cars.
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Re: flat rates for paint work
[Re: stumpy]
#86405
07/10/08 01:47 PM
07/10/08 01:47 PM
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Macco will shoot it for $300. You get what you pay for and you don't seem to want to pay very much so that's what you'll get. Those crash book #s aren't going to help you one bit. They are so out of date they don't have any relavence anymore.
As I stated a couple of times in this thread, I really didn't want to get into all of this, but I guess I need to comment on what all of you Internet mind readers seem to believe what I am thinking.
1. I have no intentions of taking this to a traditional bodyshop and have it sit to be a fill in job during slow periods of collision work.
2. 90% of traditional body shops don't want this type of work and won't give you an estimate anyway.
3. Most restoration shops are out of control and have a license to steal based on the way that they do business of time and material.
4. I intend to strip the car that has been color changed myself before it goes to a bodyman so there will be no surprises. The other car does not need it. I am willing to pay $3500. for each car and provide all of the materials and paint. BTW, it has been my past experience (being on both sides of it) that the guys that do side jobs steal most of the material/supplies from their employer anyway.
5. That is a fair price for both me and the bodyman based on $25. per hour and $1000. or less for paint and material. That works out to 140 hours. If a bodyman can't do a super straight job and paint it with no orange peel then he has no business working on my car. $25. per hour tax free is like nearly $50. per hour taxed. How many of you body men are making $50. per hour?
6. I agree with member Stanton. Now you can't make a blanket statment that all resto shop are doing this but I know for a fact that a fellow that used to be a very good friend was doing this very thing. He just thought there was nothing wrong with maximizing his profit by backing into his estimates based on what the car would be worth finished. That ended our friendship. That is one of the big problems today for people that try to make a buck fixing up old cars for profit. The repair shops make all of the money and the guy with his money invested makes nothing or loses money. This is why the dealers buy done cars. They find people that have spent all of the time, money, aggrevation, and frustration doing a car and then end up selling it for less than they have in it.
Now, does any body have any crash book sheets from the late 60s--early 70s that they can scan the pages for Mopar and post them?
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Re: flat rates for paint work
#86406
07/10/08 02:29 PM
07/10/08 02:29 PM
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i might have a book from 1967. it could take some time to find it though. i know it's stored in my warehouse with a lot of other stuff.
realistically in the end it doesn't matter what the book says, even though you want those times so badly. you already know what your willing to pay. if your not flexible enough to pay alittle more for a perfect job, what good does the time book do. you can't argue with a body man that the flat rate time says it takes this long to do the job and expect him to abide by it for your job 40 years later.
most of the guys i know won't guarantee any paint work if materials are supplied by the customer. one could argue that's bec ause they don't make any profit off of it, but they also don't have any control over the quality, brand or type of materials being provided either.
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Re: flat rates for paint work
#86407
07/10/08 02:47 PM
07/10/08 02:47 PM
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Quote:
i might have a book from 1967. it could take some time to find it though. i know it's stored in my warehouse with a lot of other stuff.
realistically in the end it doesn't matter what the book says, even though you want those times so badly. you already know what your willing to pay. if your not flexible enough to pay alittle more for a perfect job, what good does the time book do. you can't argue with a body man that the flat rate time says it takes this long to do the job and expect him to abide by it for your job 40 years later.
most of the guys i know won't guarantee any paint work if materials are supplied by the customer. one could argue that's bec ause they don't make any profit off of it, but they also don't have any control over the quality, brand or type of materials being provided either.
I would certainly appreciate it if you found that info.
I want it because my guess is that the crash book times for refinishing a complete car will be 1/2 of the hours I am willing to pay for.
I just need some baseline for this job. If someone can't refinish a stripped to the metal original sheet metal car car in 140 hours then they are in the wrong profession.
No where did I say I am looking for a PPG judged best of show paint job. I am just sick of looking at cars with fresh paint and DA marks under it and orange peeled paint. I drive my cars they are not trailer queens.
I plan on buying the material of the painter's choice so that will not be an issue. I am just not going to give them hard dollars that will end up buying beer and the car sitting there with nothing getting done. Nothing motivates a person more than having to stumble over someone elses car and not being payed for your time until it is done. As I said, this is not my first rodeo.
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