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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: HEMIFRED]
#745811
07/12/10 02:08 PM
07/12/10 02:08 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,675
Ortonville, MI
RoadRnnr69
Keyster
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Keyster
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,675
Ortonville, MI
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What a tragedy!!! Too many deaths in the last couple of years!! They shortened the track to slow the cars down and they still have safety issues. Was teh cute an item on a checklist? Was the car built correctly? After all, they say he built all of his own cars  NHRA in general, they need to review the tech inspection procedures of the cars, the tracks themselves, the speed rating of tires, chassis fabrication quality, etc... The rules are there but as is in any competive sport, people will cut corners to save money or weight or whatever and compromise safety. I'm not saying that is what happened here but an overall opinion of what I have personally witnessed as inconsistent tech inspections and people knowingly violating safety rules. Prayers to his family and friends for their loss 
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: BobR]
#745812
07/12/10 02:55 PM
07/12/10 02:55 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
His chutes came off the car when he pulled them.Seems like a bad mistake was made.
That's what I was thinking. Maybe a pin was left off the strap mounting point or the bracket broke.
OMG I think your right.  I've raced Mark before. RIP 
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: RoadRnnr69]
#745813
07/12/10 02:56 PM
07/12/10 02:56 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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Quote:
What a tragedy!!! Too many deaths in the last couple of years!!
They shortened the track to slow the cars down and they still have safety issues. Was teh cute an item on a checklist? Was the car built correctly? After all, they say he built all of his own cars
NHRA in general, they need to review the tech inspection procedures of the cars, the tracks themselves, the speed rating of tires, chassis fabrication quality, etc...
The rules are there but as is in any competive sport, people will cut corners to save money or weight or whatever and compromise safety.
I'm not saying that is what happened here but an overall opinion of what I have personally witnessed as inconsistent tech inspections and people knowingly violating safety rules.
Prayers to his family and friends for their loss
I'm not an NHRA butt boy, but this is a dangerous sport, and unfortunately competitors will be hurt and even die. Isn't the element of danger that makes the sport fun? This guy had been building his cars for a long time, and it was unfortunate that Paul (dipstick) Page had to bring question into whether or not he Mike knew how to build them, but tech inspection is very thourough at national events. And I just think it was one of those freak things that happened. I feel bad for his family, but that's the risk some of us take. It would be nice if NHRA would do more than be that giant sucking sound coming from the competitors, but then again, we keep coming to the events. JMO!
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: camastomcat]
#745818
07/12/10 05:21 PM
07/12/10 05:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,697
Renton Wa
topfueldart
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,697
Renton Wa
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Anyone questioning whether the car was built properly or not, Paul Page included, need to put their own foot in their mouth. Contrary to the belief of those that can't fabricate, your name doesn't have to be Hadman to be able to build a safe and competitive car. I don't know Mark, but I have no doubt he was fully capable. It's entirely possible a mistake was made in the attachment of the chutes between rounds, but that's nothing more than guessing at this point. Sounds to me like he was a real racers racer, and had the true hot rodder spirit, unlike most nowadays who write a check.
Last edited by topfueldart; 07/12/10 05:24 PM.
11.48 @ 120 with a 1.80 60' 318, stock 1.88 heads, stock 904, Pump Gas, 13 lbs of boost.
9.94 @ 134, 318 on pump gas, 14 lbs w/ Eddies, transbrake 727, 3600 lbs, 3.54 gear and 28's.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: topfueldart]
#745819
07/12/10 06:32 PM
07/12/10 06:32 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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Mark Niver knew how to build a race car and did it for several years. Sometimes I'm not sure who the dummy is, Paul Page for saying the things he does, or the people that hired him and told him to say it. There are nights the wife and I sit in the TV room and make bets how long it will take him to screw up. It doesn't take long.
Last edited by camastomcat; 07/12/10 06:33 PM.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: topfueldart]
#745820
07/12/10 06:38 PM
07/12/10 06:38 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Anyone questioning whether the car was built properly or not, Paul Page included, need to put their own foot in their mouth. Contrary to the belief of those that can't fabricate, your name doesn't have to be Hadman to be able to build a safe and competitive car. I don't know Mark, but I have no doubt he was fully capable. It's entirely possible a mistake was made in the attachment of the chutes between rounds, but that's nothing more than guessing at this point. Sounds to me like he was a real racers racer, and had the true hot rodder spirit, unlike most nowadays who write a check.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: jamesc]
#745822
07/12/10 07:08 PM
07/12/10 07:08 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,749
Chowchilla,ca
Chassisman
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,749
Chowchilla,ca
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Quote:
it really is sad i always have a lot more respect for people like that actually build the cars they race. there's a lot of difference between writing a check and spending hours on end fabbing, welding and building a car. imho you get a lot more personal satisfaction from the whole thing as well. from the "stands" it sure looks like the chutes weren't anchored. not like anything failed but just weren't anchored to begin with. not being familiar with the between rounds activity on a car like that is there any reason the chute anchoring point would have been disconnected as part of a standard procedure?
A lot of chutes are reloaded on stands rather than on the car.....gets things out of the way..then they re-install them back on the car.Not sure if his set up was like that or not.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: jamesc]
#745823
07/12/10 07:29 PM
07/12/10 07:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
not being familiar with the between rounds activity on a car like that is there any reason the chute anchoring point would have been disconnected as part of a standard procedure?
Like what was mentioned, but also sometimes they are removed for wheelie bar installation after it comes down off the pro jacks in the pits.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: jamesc]
#745825
07/12/10 10:02 PM
07/12/10 10:02 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Looks like NHRA pulled the video pretty quickly, but when I saw the tape, it appeared to me that the first net barrier was strung mighty tight and drove the nose of the car in to the sand. I always thought that the first barrier had more give to it. I just wonder if the end result would have happened to any top fuel car that ran in to it.
Fastest 300
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: Crizila]
#745826
07/14/10 10:41 AM
07/14/10 10:41 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,104
Wheels up, MO
nhramark
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,104
Wheels up, MO
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I look directly at NHRA for this. The chutes came off the car-- it happens. The driver was able to slow the car down, drove across the sand and right into the center of the net, exactly as he should have. Ever drive a vehicle on a sandy beach or trail? When you let off the gas, you slow way down, fast. That sand trap looked more like concrete.... maybe it was just how it looked on tv. I also wonder about the catch net. They had 2. Seems like the first net should have a lot more give than that one did. To me it looked like it wasn't much different than putting a wall there. Seems like over the last couple years there have been enough top end incidents that NHRA should have a better system in place. 
[image]http://s1126.photobucket.com/user/nhramark1/library/Racing[/image]
9.100 @ 150 mph
5.780 @ 120 mph
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: camastomcat]
#745827
07/14/10 11:20 AM
07/14/10 11:20 AM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,172
Ohio
theclutcher
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,172
Ohio
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Quote:
Mark Niver knew how to build a race car and did it for several years. Sometimes I'm not sure who the dummy is, Paul Page for saying the things he does, or the people that hired him and told him to say it. There are nights the wife and I sit in the TV room and make bets how long it will take him to screw up. It doesn't take long.
For Page to say anything about the construction of the car was extremely poor judgement and bad taste.
That car was certed and inspected like everything else and allowed to run.
his comment was insulting and he should be reprimanded for it.
Dunn should refuse to work with him.
He should stick with commentating for hot dog eating contests like he did in NY.
At least he sounds like he has a mouthfull.
Godspeed Mr. Niver.
Sounds like he was another epitome of sportsman racers.
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Re: Death in Seattle - NHRA
[Re: nhramark]
#745828
07/14/10 12:26 PM
07/14/10 12:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,060
Western New York
sixpackbee
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,060
Western New York
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Quote:
look directly at NHRA for this. The chutes came off the car-- it happens. The driver was able to slow the car down, drove across the sand and right into the center of the net, exactly as he should have.
I usually do not get into these debates because there is so much conjecture and may haves but in this case I agree 100%. Mark did all he could do and relied on the safty measures put in place, for exactly this kind of situation, and they failed him. As with all these cases, and I have seen way too many in my 30 years of racing, there will be a new bar added, or a foot of sand added, or a material change in the netting or whatever is done until the next unfortunate incident happens. I know you can not plan for every contingent but a realitively simple senario like this should have had different results than a loss of a life.
1959 Bugeye Sprite
1967 Charger Black L code
1967 Coronet R/T Convert Green 440 auto bought from original owner
1968 Charger R/T Bronze 440 4 spd console AM/FM
1969 Super Bee WM21H B5 A40 D21 N96
1969 Barracuda Formula S 340 Convert pilot car
1969 Hemi Road Runner RM23J D32 Omaha orange 4.10 Dana N96 N85
1970 Super Bee WM23N FE5 V1X 3.91 axle package, N96
1970 Road Runner RM21N B3 V1X D13
1971 MG Midget
1971 Road Runner RM23H GW3, A57
1972 Road Runner RM23P FY1, D21
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