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Re: m-code dart
[Re: JohnRR]
#719778
06/09/10 12:03 PM
06/09/10 12:03 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,826
NY usa
540challenger
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,826
NY usa
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Quote:
Quote:
68 M-code Darts were Super Stock Hemi cars.
69 M-code Darts were 440/727 street cars, built at the factory (several hundred as a matter of fact).
I think the number built was 604 , they started life as 383 cars , the build code is A13.
When you started life as a 383 car do you mean.
1. That a 383 was alreadying installed and they pulled it out to put a 440 in or...
2. when they were coming down the production line when it came to put the motor in they tossed in a 440??
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: 540challenger]
#719779
06/09/10 12:52 PM
06/09/10 12:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
68 M-code Darts were Super Stock Hemi cars.
69 M-code Darts were 440/727 street cars, built at the factory (several hundred as a matter of fact).
I think the number built was 604 , they started life as 383 cars , the build code is A13.
When you started life as a 383 car do you mean.
1. That a 383 was alreadying installed and they pulled it out to put a 440 in or...
2. when they were coming down the production line when it came to put the motor in they tossed in a 440??
Not exactly sure , it's the same as the A12 6pk B bodies they started life as 383 cars.
The car was originally speced as a 383 build with auto trans , the cars were run in batches so it was known ahead of time they would get a 440 as there was a special mount used on 440 engines that required drilling and tapping of mount holes , these holes with drilled and tapped by hand on assembled engines best I could tell by a block I aquired thru an ad in the paper . I never realized it was an M code dart block till I looked at the vin on the block and it was for a car made 6 vin numbers my car. I have since traded the car to Rhinodart for the 383 4 speed Dart I have .
Check out the Dart GTS registry , it has info on the cars.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Kern Dog]
#719782
06/09/10 03:57 PM
06/09/10 03:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
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Quote:
There are many that believe that the 640 M code Darts were converted by HURST. I still haven't heard if they HAD 383 engines installed and pulled out at Hurst. I also wonder why the 383 was available with a 4 speed but the 440 was 727 only. Does the taller deck height intrude into the cluch linkage that much? A recent article I read stated that ALL M codes had floor shifters and consoles because the column shift linkage wouldn't fit with the big honking LH exhaust manifold. I would love to have a few hours to look one of these cars over. I have owned 20 A body cars, but never put a 440 in one...YET!
Being done by Hurst is a myth, I believe, same as the A12 B bodies being done outside, they weren't .
As far as why no 4 speed behind the 440 , no DANA 60 for the A body , for a limited production car it would have been to expensive to tool up a special width Dana 60.
I have one with a 383 and stock manifolds and it's tight, I can only imagine how hard it would be to do plugs on a 440 car, it was easy on the m code I had , NO fenderwells and fenderwell headers 
Doing a clutch is a pain , I had to drop the centerlink so I could tip back the engine far enough to get the shifter mount to clear the Tbar Xmember, I didn't try rotating the trans , that MIGHT have worked, but I was on my back and frustration was high.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Commando1]
#719785
06/09/10 05:04 PM
06/09/10 05:04 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
Jim_Lusk
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
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ALL 69 440 A-bodies were factory done, the 68 Mr. Norm GSS 440 Darts were done outside.
There have been several reasons given for the lack of a four speed, but it would have been an 18-spline necessetating another complete transmission assembly. The 69 440 bellhousing has a single hole for the engine side ball stud. This is too far rearward for the stock a-body linkage, again necessetating custom parts, drilling the bellhousing, etc. Chrysler was willing to do this for a race car like the 68 SS A-bodies, but for a street car with a warranty that was built on the regular production line, then no.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#719786
06/10/10 01:03 AM
06/10/10 01:03 AM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog
Striving for excellence
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Striving for excellence
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
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Hemmings Muscle Machines July 2010 Article by Jeff Koch:
M, M Good
.......The Factory made these machines in seven distinct batches: Dec 1 1968, January 14, January 31, February 14, February 21, March 29 and April 27, 1969. There has apparantly been some controversy whether the M-code cars were factory built, rather than converted off site, but even without word from someone who worked at Hurst back in the day, there is compelling evidence of their involvement. First, Grand Spaulding was a small enough outfit that it could barely build the 50 GSS models from the previous year. Second, a period Car Craft story delved into the who-did-what of the M-code and Hurst was implicated as the converter. Third, and most curiously, all of the M-code cars have E63 on their paperwork and fender tags: Thats the code for a 383 engine. But theres also a Y39 code for "special handling"--and if it was built on the line, why would a 440 car have an E63 and a Y39 code together? Why not just use the code for the 440 and call it done?........A total of 640 of these so-called M-code Darts were built. All were dealer ordered and all were more or less the same.
I read this article about a week ago and just remembered where! I have about 5 magazine subscriptions and sometimes forget what I read and where.
My first car was a 69 Dart, back in 1982. It was a 318 car. Back then I never knew that Dodge built 440 Darts.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Kern Dog]
#719787
06/10/10 06:47 AM
06/10/10 06:47 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,611
Indiana
EV2DEMON
The Camaro Kid
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The Camaro Kid
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,611
Indiana
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Don't believe anything you read in Hemmings MM.... Quote:
First, Grand Spaulding was a small enough outfit that it could barely build the 50 GSS models from the previous year.
That's irrelevant since they were built at the factory.
Quote:
Second, a period Car Craft story delved into the who-did-what of the M-code and Hurst was implicated as the converter.
A third party magazine article certainly should not be considered proof as to how the factory did or did not do something.
Quote:
Third, and most curiously, all of the M-code cars have E63 on their paperwork and fender tags: Thats the code for a 383 engine. But theres also a Y39 code for "special handling"--and if it was built on the line, why would a 440 car have an E63 and a Y39 code together? Why not just use the code for the 440 and call it done?........
As mentioned above, the 69 Six Pack B bodies all have the code for the 383 on their fender tags as well, yet there is no doubt that they were factory built. The fender tag doesn't have E86 for the same reason the VIN has an M instead of an L, just like the lift off hood cars. A 440 in an A body was a special circumstance, so the normal rules don't apply.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#719788
06/10/10 08:42 AM
06/10/10 08:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,326
A gulag near you.
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Quote:
The 69 440 bellhousing has a single hole for the engine side ball stud. This is too far rearward for the stock a-body linkage, again necessetating custom parts, drilling the bellhousing, etc. Chrysler was willing to do this for a race car like the 68 SS A-bodies, but for a street car with a warranty that was built on the regular production line, then no.
Jim they made a special offset bracket for the 10.5 Big block bell that was used behind the 383. But I don't think the 69 143 tooth bell would have worked out well in the in the A body engine bay for multiple reasons.
The trans would have had to been something real special and oddball that would have had to return back to the 67 hemi trans design, a 307 front bearing , they obviously changed to the larger 308 for a reason.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: JohnRR]
#719789
06/10/10 09:42 AM
06/10/10 09:42 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
Jim_Lusk
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
The 69 440 bellhousing has a single hole for the engine side ball stud. This is too far rearward for the stock a-body linkage, again necessetating custom parts, drilling the bellhousing, etc. Chrysler was willing to do this for a race car like the 68 SS A-bodies, but for a street car with a warranty that was built on the regular production line, then no.
Jim they made a special offset bracket for the 10.5 Big block bell that was used behind the 383. But I don't think the 69 143 tooth bell would have worked out well in the in the A body engine bay for multiple reasons.
The trans would have had to been something real special and oddball that would have had to return back to the 67 hemi trans design, a 307 front bearing , they obviously changed to the larger 308 for a reason.
That's kind of my point. The big bell fits the car fine (that's what's in my son's Dart), but like I said the linkage (actually the 383 bracket) would not work due to the lack of the second hole.
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#719790
06/15/10 10:48 PM
06/15/10 10:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,187
USA
big-block-dave
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,187
USA
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Guys, don't forget about the 360 M-code '69 'cudas built! Approximately 300 fastbacks and 60 coupes. We had a 40 year anniversary reunion at Carlisle last July and had 16 cars show.
I'm the CARETAKER of Weinstats '69 440 'cuda registry and have 104 of the 360 cars to date. 84 fastbacks/20 coupes. Always looking for new(REAL M-code) '69 440 'cudas to add to the registry so drop me a note if any are found or known. This isn't a publicly released registry. Thanks, Dave
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: big-block-dave]
#719791
06/16/10 12:16 AM
06/16/10 12:16 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
Jim_Lusk
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,688
Fresno, CA
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Quote:
Guys, don't forget about the 360 M-code '69 'cudas built! Approximately 300 fastbacks and 60 coupes. We had a 40 year anniversary reunion at Carlisle last July and had 16 cars show.
Yeah, and Mr. Norm built those, too........
I hope you got my sarcasm here....... 
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: Commando1]
#719793
06/17/10 08:50 PM
06/17/10 08:50 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,187
USA
big-block-dave
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,187
USA
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"Not publicly released" Well the guy i took over the registry from was very much so against giving out vin#'s. He seamed not into the internet much and coudn't believe people put vin#'s in ads. He would only give complete info to M-cuda owners. These cars are pretty rare and alot of owners don't want their info out there. I may someday have a website but vin#'s and owner info wouldn't be included. ALSO if the registry was a public thing i believe it would keep some owners from registering. As it is alot of people don't like to join registries. There are cars out there that i know of but can't get any REAL info on them because the owners don't want to give info. You can't force people to join, there are many M-cudas still out there, i found one on the internet for sale that wasn't in my registry! That owner selling wouldn't even give me info! He said that if the next owner wanted to give info that would be up to them! That's the way it is, you would think that a guy selling a car wouldn't care about giving out info because he is selling it??????........Dave
I'm the CARETAKER of Weinstats '69 440 'cuda registry and have 104 of the 360 cars to date. 84 fastbacks/20 coupes. Always looking for new(REAL M-code) '69 440 'cudas to add to the registry so drop me a note if any are found or known. This isn't a publicly released registry. Thanks, Dave
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Re: m-code dart
[Re: big-block-dave]
#719794
06/17/10 09:02 PM
06/17/10 09:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,449
Gateway to the West.
hemi_harvester
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,449
Gateway to the West.
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The Factory made these machines in seven distinct batches: Dec 1 1968, January 14, January 31, February 14, February 21, March 29 and April 27, 1969 I have studied these caes a lot a few years ago I have found that most be not all were built in these lots and I also have reason to beleive that these cars where built or finished on the Fleet or taxi line when the line was slow most these dates are Fridays and Sundays.. 
There comes a time in life, when you walk away from all the drama & people who create it. You surround yourself with people who make you laugh, forget the bad, and focus on the good.
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