Another long race weekend..
#686999
05/03/10 02:01 AM
05/03/10 02:01 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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We ran the National Open at Sacramento Raceway this weekend. new weather station, new oil pump, new alignment woohoo, this should be fun. Another way long race weekend for sure. Friday T&T was a joke, 30 mph winds and a new weather station, plus a starter, who was I think trying to throw the lite to test his reaction times. He threw me the lite twice as soon as I got the second bulb lit. Of course the racer in me is letting go of the button as soon as I see yellow, forget that I have not even got the converter yet, oh well. Different tree every pass, .500 full, .400 pro, .500 pro...Blah Blah Blah. Anyway on the last pass Friday night we had a previously placed vacuum fitting break off of the valley plate, weld was just not real good and vibrated loose on our last pass. So had to tear the intake and valley plate off to have the kid take it home and weld it up...Grrrrr. So about 10:30pm we get it back on and everyone around us was asleep so did not fire it til the next morning. Also had a strange issue on the last pass where the car picked up .10 in the 60', hmmmm. Only good news was I finally got a 160mph(wind aided of course ,crosstail) pass out of my heap. So I can scratch that off the to do list... Saturday morning we fire the car, ruh roh...Got no vacuum, and a little oil leak. Seems when welding up the plate, in the haste to get it done it got a little hot and warped. We tried to seal it as best we could the previous evning but apparently not good enough. Sooo off goes the intake again. We find the issue and get it handled. Fire it up, vroom, vroom, vroom....Apparently the intake gasket did not like coming on and off, so off comes the intake again. We get it all sealed up with silicone, hate the stuff but we did not have a spare gasket with us, and my heads are a bit unique. Fire it up and better but now no vacuum So I fire it up again and my son hears a little ticking sound, come to find out in our haste to get it done we had twisted the vac pick up baffle taking it on and off and it was not exactly centered and was hitting a rocker, which broke the o-ring so no vacuum Anyway get all that settled and made three qualifying passes. First shot was a 10.902 at 159 and change, woohoo we are #1, next round we got bumped to #2 by a 10.900, but we managed a 10.895. Round three, let go of the button, think man shouldn't the car be moving...Hmmmmm...Well it finally does and rewards me with a .200 lite, a 60' that was .10 quick and the car went 10.80. Houston we seem to have a problem. Once again mysteriously the car picks up .010 in the 60' Not sure what is causing it. I was beginning to think I have a converter issue but it sure is random, but it did do it both times after three passes. Maybe a heat thing But I am not about to let it stop me, nor am I going to pull the tranny and put in another converter. Anyway on to today. We get one time/qualifying shot. I pull up do my thing and go .005- and run a 10.905. Woohoo we look like we know what we are doing, sort of. So next up is round one. We were laddered for some reason based on qualifying and I get a guy I have lined up against twice in qualifying. I go .011 and run 10.909, round one out of the way, whew. Round two I get a local guy who I probably owe soemthing to. He seems to redlight against me always, also I seem to have some issue whenever I race him and have a poor showing. Well lady luck here we come. He went .015 red...Me well remember that mysterious picking up in the 60' and having a horrid reaction time, well guess what it happened again. I was .206 and the car went 10.77 picking up .13 in the 60', but thanks to his generosity I am still alive. We figured we were done. Although we had not run the car after the last two incindents of picking up in the 60'. They were both on the last pass of the day, and frankly this one should have been too. Well that issue did not arise again and we motored away. To wrap up this really long story I went out in the Semis to the eventual winner. I just took to much stripe, I dont like giving it away, my .883 to his .887 and I scrubbed off 13mph. he was .011 on the tree to my .005. I did also manage to get my first ever 10.900 on a bye run, with a .001 lite, go figure Oh well I guess third place is ok. So anyone have any thoughts on my mysteriouos 60' issue. It did it three times, each on the third pass of the day. It was pretty consistent about it .10-13 is what it picked up and the reaction times were .200-.206. All my other lites this weekend were fine. Any ideas???
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687000
05/03/10 02:40 AM
05/03/10 02:40 AM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Re: Another long race weekend..
#687001
05/03/10 02:44 AM
05/03/10 02:44 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266 Renton Washington
Triple Threat
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Renton Washington
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Are you monitoring trans temp at all?
Sounds like a semi successful outing.
-Dustin 67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi 68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687003
05/03/10 06:15 AM
05/03/10 06:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,668 Buford, GA
I_bleed_MOPAR
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Sounds like you had a good time, even if you had to work for it. Congrats on the 160 blast. Tim
'71 Charger 383/727 '17 Challenger SXT (Wifeys car )
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: StripeHOG]
#687004
05/03/10 10:26 AM
05/03/10 10:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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First off thanks guys. I was thinking about this last night, go figure. Am beginning to think it may be an electrical or stop issue. I just cannot wrap my head around the converter being a problem the way it is doing it. At first I was sure it was given what it did, just not sure now. Do they make a delay box tester? Have to race in Fontana in a couple of weeks. Yes we monitor trans temp, heck we watch everything Figured it would really show once we were going rounds, but it did not. That is one of the things that has me thinking it may be elsewhere.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687005
05/03/10 10:37 AM
05/03/10 10:37 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Romeo MI
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Quote:
First off thanks guys. I was thinking about this last night, go figure. Am beginning to think it may be an electrical or stop issue. I just cannot wrap my head around the converter being a problem the way it is doing it. At first I was sure it was given what it did, just not sure now. Do they make a delay box tester? Have to race in Fontana in a couple of weeks.
Yes we monitor trans temp, heck we watch everything Figured it would really show once we were going rounds, but it did not. That is one of the things that has me thinking it may be elsewhere.
Al, do you go on to the stop before the 60'... if so it could be the throttle stop doing it
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: MegaDart]
#687007
05/03/10 11:28 AM
05/03/10 11:28 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 778 Sherwood park, Alberta.
go green
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2007
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Sherwood park, Alberta.
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So your engine likes sitting on the chip and blowing the cobwebs out . I will guess to big of accelerator pump shot and your car goes fat for a bit and then cleans up when its on the main jet. Does it do that on a sportsman tree ? Just throwing stuff at the wall and seeing what sticks.
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: sg66mopar]
#687010
05/03/10 12:17 PM
05/03/10 12:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I go on the stop immediately, so yes before 60'. The #1 timer is set at .000. Been this way for a couple of years. It is an stop, Dedenbear 4 blade variety. The box is a Mega 450. Have an alternator and voltage is good, usually 13+-.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: jamesc]
#687012
05/03/10 12:47 PM
05/03/10 12:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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This is a new issue...Have not had this problem before and have not runa Sportsman tree since Vegas..I will have to look at my logbook but I seem to think my reaction times were eratic there too...hmmm maybe the box?? Is there a way to test it?
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: MegaDart]
#687016
05/03/10 02:22 PM
05/03/10 02:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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Sorry air stop. Caar is very consistent as is. Carry .075 about in the box and usually am in the 005-015 area. Car ran 10.902, 10.909, 10.905, and 10.900 in eliminations except the one incident and the semis where I lost and was carrying. The car has always been very consistent this way. I am on the stop for 4.78-4.90 seconds this way in usual air here, 1000-2000 DA's. FWIW it takes about a 400' DA change to change the car .001 with Q16.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: rickstershemi]
#687018
05/03/10 09:29 PM
05/03/10 09:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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Rick we have tried the stop everywhere, trust me. From .000 to 1.00. With anything over about .050 it is very inconsistent and dependent on track conditions to run the number consistently. Weusually dont get the best times on track in S/ST usually first or second out. Unless the track is great I will spin the tires a bit and the added time in the stop makes the car harder to dial. Trust me we tried. When you get in the 5+ second range on the stop it is hard to stay consistent and keep the down power RPM manageable, at least for me.
Guys the car works, or was working great with this set up. But obviously something has changed, intermittently. I can dial the car to run the number no issue, unless this problem comes up. Appreciate the advice but if I do have a box/stop issue adding numbers to the first number is only gonna make it worse. I dont need any more momentum than I get already. I carry plenty of numbers in the delay and plenty in the stop now.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: rickstershemi]
#687020
05/04/10 12:47 AM
05/04/10 12:47 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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Down power is 4200. I launch at 3800. With what I have it is as low as we can go, secondaries closed all the way, primariy open about 1/4". Any more closed on front and I loose signal to the carb and have some issues coming off. I come off as slow as possible, the screw is set about 1/8 of a turn from fully closed. I creep about 250RPM now. The longer I stay on the more it creeps.
Like I say the car works great usually with the current set up. Just the dang new issue that is causing me fits. Gonna send the box off to have it looked at, might just buy a replacement and keep the old one as a spare, who knows. We are gonna look over the wiring as well this week. Off to Fontana in a couple of weeks so we need to see if we can get it fixed.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687021
05/04/10 01:04 AM
05/04/10 01:04 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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Al_Alguire
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I think I may have the answer. Seems my diaper is pretty much touching the ground now in te front. Looks like when we had the pan off to look at the bearings we did not get it tight. I think it may just not be breaking the beams becuase of it occasionally. Just looked at tyhe car and it is almost on the ground, given my engine setback it may not have allowed the beam to get across until the diaper cleared..Hmmm, seem plausable??
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687022
05/04/10 01:18 AM
05/04/10 01:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266 Renton Washington
Triple Threat
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Plausible but it doesn't fit the way you described it. You said you can feel the car sit there and then leave late.
Although the car should run faster on passes where it catches the beams, so that part makes sense.
Last edited by Triple Threat; 05/04/10 01:19 AM.
-Dustin 67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi 68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Triple Threat]
#687023
05/04/10 10:09 AM
05/04/10 10:09 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I agree but maybe it was just my perception, especially after seeing the slip. Could have been those lights were a tad late as well, not sure. I know for sure on the last one, the worst light of the bunch that I saw a LOT of green, could just be from dragging the light with the diaper issue not realizing the car was moving. Make sense? We will look it over as far as wiring connections etc, but I feel pretty confident right now that this is the issue.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: JD Dart]
#687026
05/04/10 08:01 PM
05/04/10 08:01 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,288 Oregon
sg66mopar
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Al, I had that happen last year at the Division race in Montana. Consistent .490 - .530 lights. (Still made it to the semis. Got home and at some point discovered the diaper was loose. Tightened it up and went to Woodburn for the Fall Classic. .403 - .389 (yeah, red) lights. Not sure about the 60 foots cause I diddled with the throttle stop a lot. Mine comes on at aound .20 - .30 so if I make any kind of change it really fouls up the 60s. At the time I just thought I got WAY better on the light Maybe the diaper was the culprit on both cars.
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687028
05/05/10 05:51 AM
05/05/10 05:51 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667 Arizona
Chris'sBarracuda
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Quote:
Quote:
I think that was the second place I said to look..
That's probably the culprit.
Chris..
Yeah but we both know you are way smarter than me. I think the diaper is the issue it is very loose.
Still not sure why it was not on every pass though....But I ordered a new diaper today and will have it on upon arrival.
If I'm so smart, why is my engine apart, and I can't figure out why it is so weak..
BTW, I'm betting Diaper.
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#687029
05/06/10 01:09 AM
05/06/10 01:09 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667 Arizona
Chris'sBarracuda
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Quote:
Quote:
I think that was the second place I said to look..
That's probably the culprit.
Chris..
Yeah but we both know you are way smarter than me. I think the diaper is the issue it is very loose.
Still not sure why it was not on every pass though....But I ordered a new diaper today and will have it on upon arrival.
If the car pops out of the beams quickly, it will activate the tree. When it pushes through it would most likely have a horrible reaction time, but a much better 60'..
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: Chris'sBarracuda]
#687030
05/06/10 02:11 AM
05/06/10 02:11 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448 Phoenix, AZ
MoparBilly
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Just one question... Why were you swimming in that little pond in Sacramento, when you were SUPPOSED to be taking on those D-6 Sharks in Boise??????????????
And for everyone out there scratching their head..its called "Stop RPM, or RPM on Stop" in 47 1/2 states, and 6 1/2 NHRA Divisions... but in NORCAL, birthplace of the t-stop..it's called "Down power"....
"Livin' in a powder keg and givin' off sparks"
4 Street cars, 5 Race engines
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Re: Another long race weekend..
[Re: MoparBilly]
#687031
05/06/10 10:15 AM
05/06/10 10:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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Billy, My intention was to go to Boise, but due to time and family stuff going on I did not get a chance to test the car at all. After the way my year has been I decided not to drive 500 miles in hopes the car would work. To many changes and new parts to go that far IMO, plus with the announcement of the make up date for Phoenix Divisional being held at Bakersfield I decided no need to travel up there to make up that race. I will be in Fontana next week proivided my wifes upcoming surgery on Monday goes well. I am beginning to think some greater power does not want me to run Div 7 S/ST this year. She was to have the surgery the next week it got moved up last week. So we will see. AS for the downpower commnet, yep I learned that one when I kept getting that puppy dod head tilt calling it stop rpm
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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