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Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Dodgem] #680175 04/26/10 08:01 AM 04/26/10 08:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 5,746 Ontario, Canada Dodgem master
Dodgem master Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 5,746 Ontario, Canada	and yes I was degreeing the exhaust lobe 5947690-new2.JPG (86 downloads)

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Dodgem] #680176 04/26/10 02:25 PM 04/26/10 02:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,931 P Paul_Fancsali master
Paul_Fancsali master P Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,931	Before I would go crazy working on the engine I would get a good dist and get the total timing up to at least 42-44 degree's esp if the car comp is below 9.1 On the carb I would check jet sizes most carbs are over jetted not sure in your case but timing and geting it all in by stall speed sure will help.I'm sure the timing will get a pooch to go better try it it cheap and easy to do or change

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Paul_Fancsali] #680177 04/26/10 04:05 PM 04/26/10 04:05 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon D Dougsmopars top fuel
Dougsmopars top fuel D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon	42 to 44 is to much total for a big block mopar. 36 to 38 tops.

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Dougsmopars] #680178 04/26/10 06:31 PM 04/26/10 06:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,495 Shelby mi. J JAKE68 pro stock
JAKE68 pro stock J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,495 Shelby mi.	Quote: 42 to 44 is to much total for a big block mopar. 36 to 38 tops. I agree. Without knowing what cam he has it is hard to try and cover up the problem without throwing a bunch of tricks,do dads and such at it and get good resaults. he could have a 509 cam low compresion low staul coverter and you could never make it right. Put a dial indicater on the thing and find out what cam it is. Then maybe put a deree wheel on it and find out where it is instauled at. That would tell you what direction to go. If it is anything like the video that guy was shifting and he wasn't on the pipe yet.We have found on the dyno that most pump gas big blocks like 32-34 total. Last edited by JAKE68; 04/26/10 06:33 PM. JAKES AUTOMOTIVE

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: JAKE68] #680179 04/26/10 09:18 PM 04/26/10 09:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL 7 71383beep top fuel
71383beep top fuel 7 Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL	FWIW...my 383 was doggy with the big open chamber 906 heads. With a set of 516s on her now she is a totally different animal and she is running the .474 cam. It DEFINITELY puts you in your seat and will annihilate the tires from a stop. So my says that you may be very low on compression and that is really all you need to work on. '73 GK6 Challenger Rallye - 340 4-Speed

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 71383beep] #680180 04/26/10 09:27 PM 04/26/10 09:27 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon D Dougsmopars top fuel
Dougsmopars top fuel D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon	if it's a 509 throw it in the dumpster. Anyone who has done any real drag raceing will tell you those old out dated cams are junk. Plenty of new designs that make a lot more power.

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Dougsmopars] #680181 04/27/10 06:59 AM 04/27/10 06:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,495 Shelby mi. J JAKE68 pro stock
JAKE68 pro stock J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,495 Shelby mi.	i agree that there are alot of newer cams that will have better manners and make more power with less but that 509 is by no means junk. It just likes compresion,converter and gear to work good. If any of the combo is off it could be a turd. JAKES AUTOMOTIVE

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: JAKE68] #680182 04/27/10 12:15 PM 04/27/10 12:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,931 P Paul_Fancsali master
Paul_Fancsali master P Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,931	My reply for 42-44 is for a car with low comp and too much cam like the 509 Too many people go by the Mopar perf bible that are often way out of date.I had a Mopar perf tech guy tell me a 509 would be ok in a small block with exhaust manifolds NOT. Now I do my own thing and if it works for me so be it.

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 71383beep] #680183 04/27/10 01:47 PM 04/27/10 01:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 6,119 Valencia, España NachoRT74 master
NachoRT74 master Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 6,119 Valencia, España	Quote: FWIW...my 383 was doggy with the big open chamber 906 heads. With a set of 516s on her now she is a totally different animal and she is running the .474 cam. It DEFINITELY puts you in your seat and will annihilate the tires from a stop. So my says that you may be very low on compression and that is really all you need to work on. stock pistons ? With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Paul_Fancsali] #680184 04/27/10 02:16 PM 04/27/10 02:16 PM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,825 Sk. Canada RemCharger master
RemCharger master Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,825 Sk. Canada	Quote: My reply for 42-44 is for a car with low comp and too much cam like the 509 Too many people go by the Mopar perf bible that are often way out of date.I had a Mopar perf tech guy tell me a 509 would be ok in a small block with exhaust manifolds NOT. Now I do my own thing and if it works for me so be it. Paul, you're right. Them little guys need timing. It is NOT a 440.

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: NachoRT74] #680185 04/27/10 05:42 PM 04/27/10 05:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL 7 71383beep top fuel
71383beep top fuel 7 Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL	Quote: Quote: FWIW...my 383 was doggy with the big open chamber 906 heads. With a set of 516s on her now she is a totally different animal and she is running the .474 cam. It DEFINITELY puts you in your seat and will annihilate the tires from a stop. So my says that you may be very low on compression and that is really all you need to work on. stock pistons ? No it has been rebuilt. the problem with the first build and the 906 heads was the KB162 pistons which are something like a mile in the hole with huge 5cc valve reliefs. My compression on the first build was around 7.8:1. Now it has the same pistons, but the deck was milled 0.020 and with the 516 heads and the felpro gasket i get a CR of 9.2:1 which really woke the motor up. '73 GK6 Challenger Rallye - 340 4-Speed

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 71383beep] #680186 04/27/10 06:02 PM 04/27/10 06:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 583 San Antonio, TX CurYellowBird mopar
CurYellowBird mopar Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 583 San Antonio, TX	Hey 71383bee, How do you like that .474/.474 MP cam? I'm looking at a build for the 383 in my 71'bird and I think we talked a couple times before. Comp cams camquest version of this MP cam gives my 383 the max hp and torque and should work well with my 4 speed and AC. What gears and transmission are you running? Hi-po manifolds or headers? Don't mean to hijack the thread, just not alot of guys who drive the 383 as much as 440's, or the MP cams since they are "old technology". Last edited by CurYellowBird; 04/27/10 06:04 PM. Project War Bird: 1971 Plymouth Roadrunner 383 4 speed with air conditioning GY3 Curious yellow All original

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: CurYellowBird] #680187 04/27/10 08:19 PM 04/27/10 08:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 4,503 NJ 4 440challenger OP master
440challenger OP master 4 Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 4,503 NJ	Well a little update. i went to check timing today with my matco dial back and it seems to not be working... It will flash but with very long pauses in between. Who makes one that works with a an msd box? So i ended up just popping the distributor out and i looked under the plate and realized one of the advance springs was missing! The remaining spring was the lighter of the factory installed springs. I ended up putting BOTH Mopar perf. Light springs in and stabbed the dist. back in where it was. I had no way to check timing but i did notice when i fired the motor up my rpms went from a previous 700rpm at idle to now 1k at idle,and a noticeabley smoother idle/power.. On test ride it was a night and day seat of pants difference. Now i just need a timing light to see where im at. It looks like she has some potential to make some decent power. I do notice now when i rev it out and shift from 1st to 2nd 2nd to 3rd it lags quite a bit before it goes into gear. its not a firm shift. is this an adjustment that i can make or do i need a shift kit? Thanks for the help so far!

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 440challenger] #680188 04/27/10 08:35 PM 04/27/10 08:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 843 Suffolk,VA I ireland383 super stock
ireland383 super stock I Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 843 Suffolk,VA	How old is the tranny fluid?

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 440challenger] #680189 04/27/10 09:40 PM 04/27/10 09:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,463 oklahoma F forphorty pro stock
forphorty pro stock F Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,463 oklahoma	Although you thought you were running 38 degrees advance that might not be true. Your timing light may not be accurate. There is also a possibility the outer ring on your damper may have slipped, giving an incorrect reading. Or it may be that your car just likes lots of timing.

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 440challenger] #680190 04/27/10 11:53 PM 04/27/10 11:53 PM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: So i ended up just popping the distributor out and i looked under the plate and realized one of the advance springs was missing! The remaining spring was the lighter of the factory installed springs. I ended up putting BOTH Mopar perf. Light springs in and stabbed the dist. back in where it was. I had no way to check timing but i did notice when i fired the motor up my rpms went from a previous 700rpm at idle to now 1k at idle,and a noticeabley smoother idle/power. Here's a chart. I hear MSD make dialbacks act up. you could do a slight bit of math and mark the dampener exactly. .0632683" is 1 degree so 35.5 degrees would be 2.246 (2&1/4") and you could use your 2-3" micrometer and measure/cut strips of paper to use as a ruler & magic mark your dampener & you can mark 5 deg on the stock marks then move the dampener 5 degrees and mark it again & so on until you've got up to 35 40 btdc and checking for exact TDC with the ten dollar tool is a good idea as you cannot assume anything then use a non dialback light. EDIT forgot the chart 5951280-dirstspringcurves.jpg (43 downloads) Last edited by RapidRobert; 04/28/10 12:04 AM. live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: 71383beep] #680191 04/28/10 11:23 AM 04/28/10 11:23 AM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 6,119 Valencia, España NachoRT74 master
NachoRT74 master Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 6,119 Valencia, España	Quote: Quote: Quote: FWIW...my 383 was doggy with the big open chamber 906 heads. With a set of 516s on her now she is a totally different animal and she is running the .474 cam. It DEFINITELY puts you in your seat and will annihilate the tires from a stop. So my says that you may be very low on compression and that is really all you need to work on. stock pistons ? No it has been rebuilt. the problem with the first build and the 906 heads was the KB162 pistons which are something like a mile in the hole with huge 5cc valve reliefs. My compression on the first build was around 7.8:1. Now it has the same pistons, but the deck was milled 0.020 and with the 516 heads and the felpro gasket i get a CR of 9.2:1 which really woke the motor up. ok will check specs of those pistons... I'm trying to guess how much will mill down the 452 heads using KB240s on a 400 what suposelly sits .020 or so in the hole, to get around same compression ( 9.2-9.5 rate )... using metallick gaskets of course ( and same cam ) EDITING... they are about the same piston with just simply diff bore LOL... will have to try to reach 84cc, from the initial 90-92cc I got measured... that's around .040 mill job... With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Dougsmopars] #680192 04/28/10 05:42 PM 04/28/10 05:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	Quote: 42 to 44 is to much total for a big block mopar. 36 to 38 tops. plllussst... ran 383's up to 42 easy on a good day and good gas. give it as much timing as it will take. [IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG] Coming soon!!!!

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: Mr.Yuck] #680193 04/28/10 05:47 PM 04/28/10 05:47 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 5,037 hi sharpie Moparts Linguist
sharpie Moparts Linguist Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 5,037 hi	Wait a second, is a 780 normal for a stock-ish 383? That sounds like a way-large carb for a stock engine...

Re: Help my doggy 383 [Re: CurYellowBird] #680194 04/28/10 05:50 PM 04/28/10 05:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL 7 71383beep top fuel
71383beep top fuel 7 Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,647 IL	Quote: Hey 71383bee, How do you like that .474/.474 MP cam? I'm looking at a build for the 383 in my 71'bird and I think we talked a couple times before. Comp cams camquest version of this MP cam gives my 383 the max hp and torque and should work well with my 4 speed and AC. What gears and transmission are you running? Hi-po manifolds or headers? Don't mean to hijack the thread, just not alot of guys who drive the 383 as much as 440's, or the MP cams since they are "old technology". I am very happy with it. It has got excellent street manners and can bring it when it needs to. The motor dyno'd at 400/430 hp/tq which was my goal. Its a pretty mild build really...040 over on the bores, KB162 pistons, mill the deck 020, built 516 heads with the 2.14/1.74 valves IIRC and a bit of bowl blend and porting, Comps 474 version (nostalgia purple plus) cam, street dominator intake, FBO prepped 650 mighty Demon, and the FBO ignition. Haven't tried it at the track. Running a 727 auto with the TF2 shift improver kit and 3.73 gears. I prefer to slapstick it. From a stop first gear is virtually useless with the tires I have, but its a fun cruiser! There certainly is faster out there, but she holds her own pretty well. I can drive it anywhere and she holds an idle very well with power brakes. I have been following your thread too. FWIW i would just try and coax 400 to 450 hp from your stock 383 and keep it mostly stock appearing. Unless you already have the 440 that is. I do have to agree that as much fun as having an absolute killer 500 hp motor is it does eat in to how much you really can use the car. Especially it being a fairly rare real 4 speed high impact bird. 400 hp is still a lot of fun and it has good street manners means IMHO that you can do more with the car. I have several friends that have invested so much into there cars that they are no longer as tame for taking on nice cruises or going to a long distance show. they kill at the strip which is cool, but they sometimes miss out on just cruising the backroads and raising a bit of he[[! A 400 to 450 hp mill will still be respectable at the strip and you won;t have to modify the car much to handle it. Anyways thats just my '73 GK6 Challenger Rallye - 340 4-Speed

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