Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: 1Fast340] #578400
01/12/10 06:15 PM
01/12/10 06:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY Offline
I Live Here
ZIPPY  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
For that matter, ever seen the lower end of an LS1?

360view's post makes alot of sense but nobody really knows for sure except the folks who were there at the time.....

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: 1Fast340] #578401
01/13/10 09:42 AM
01/13/10 09:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
Moparts resident spammer
3

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
There was also an article back about the year 2000 about a big closed door engine design conference between just the German Mercedes engineers, and the American Chrysler engineers.

The main thing I remember from the article is that someone was quoted as saying,
concerning the combustion effects of using twin spark plugs:

They taught us some stuff we did not know,
and we taught them stuff that they did not know,
and in the end we decided that twin plugs were indeed good.

Remember that when you are trying to get to the #8 cylinder plugs to change them.

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: 360view] #578402
01/13/10 11:42 AM
01/13/10 11:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,668
Mi,U.S.A.
M
mike s Offline
top fuel
mike s  Offline
top fuel
M

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,668
Mi,U.S.A.
Someone said?....An article said....Please. Was there one German engineer that was in the 5.7L group? Guess what not one.Not one in management either.If you want to give them credit be my guest.Because some rookie engineer learned something means nothing.Engines had dual plugs and a similar chamber in 20's-30's aircraft engines.Fiat had a similar design on their 124's in the 70's.Formula 1 cars had it in the 50's and 60's.Maybe they inspired the 5.7L.What's with the Benz love? They don't deserve it.Post it on the Benz board.

Btw talk a newer Hemi style engine went all the way back to pre Viper days.


Leave the gun.......take the Cannoli's....Mike
Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: mike s] #578403
01/14/10 08:22 AM
01/14/10 08:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
Moparts resident spammer
3

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
I am not giving credit to the Benz engineers for the twin spark plugs in the 5.7.

As I think can be seen in the above post,
I tried to first give credit to the aircraft hemi's where nearly all of them had twin plugs
.... then I give credit to the Nissan NAPS-Z engineers,
not for inventing twin spark plugs,
but for taking the time and effort to publish emissions data in 'hard numbers' that saved the 5.7 project from naysayers

I certainly think credit is due to 426 designers, and to drag racers who put twin spark plugs back into their engines

As to 'hear-say'
I certainly believe in giving references,
but my memory is not longer good enough to pull them out of the air when the bookmarks in my web browser does not have them.

Do Benz engineers deserve any credit for ANY of the 5.7 design?

I don't know the exact answer,
but again here is some 'hear-say'
... I seem to recall reading that Chrysler contracted out some
CRANKSHAFT
design work to Mercedes Benz on the
4.7 V8
because their German computer models were well thought of for reducing the last bits of tricky torsional vibration,
and also lightening up the rotating weight by putting metal only where its strength was actually needed.

I do not know if any 5.7 crankshaft work was sent out.

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: 360view] #578404
01/14/10 10:57 AM
01/14/10 10:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY Offline
I Live Here
ZIPPY  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
Well at least your comments make sense and COULD HAVE happened.

The Ray Barton name drop above, however, is a whole other story

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: ZIPPY] #578405
01/14/10 07:28 PM
01/14/10 07:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 292
Atlanta
DartGTX Offline
enthusiast
DartGTX  Offline
enthusiast

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 292
Atlanta
It was the LEAD engineer of the 5.7l HEMI engine project that told me he had questioned both Tom Hoover and Ray Barton on what THEY thought could be improved on in the OLD (gen2) Hemi. He stated that both agreed that the CAM needed to be as high in the block as possible to help correct the valvetrain geometry.

Additionally, he commented that when he presented the design in Stutgart the Germans were amazed at the effectiveness and simplicity of the MDS (cylinder deactivation) as compared to their previous attempts on the MB V-12.

Just saying.......

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: DartGTX] #578406
01/14/10 09:28 PM
01/14/10 09:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY Offline
I Live Here
ZIPPY  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,844
S.E. Michigan
Thx for the detail.

I would believe one phone call but not much more

Re: 5.7 Hemi USA or German built [Re: DartGTX] #578407
01/15/10 06:38 AM
01/15/10 06:38 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,578
sweden
1
1Fast340 Offline
master
1Fast340  Offline
master
1

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,578
sweden
Quote:



Additionally, he commented that when he presented the design in Stutgart the Germans were amazed at the effectiveness and simplicity of the MDS (cylinder deactivation) as compared to their previous attempts on the MB V-12.

Just saying.......





that realy makes sense from the way i see it US built stuff is very simple and effective while the germans have some very good ideas but way "overengineered"

Page 2 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1