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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: BcudaChris]
#57487
04/25/08 12:45 PM
04/25/08 12:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,016
Frederick, MD
71charger
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,016
Frederick, MD
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I have one, but have not yet had it installed. The LCAs are available with sway bar tabs. The k-frame, however, is not set up for one. When I asked CAP, they said they can do it, prior to powder coating. However, I forget how much extra they wanted. I chose to let my friend and his shop do it for me. I'm hoping they get started on it this coming week or the week after. As long as it's done before I get back to the States in late June so I can take it to Carlisle.
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: BcudaChris]
#57488
04/25/08 02:20 PM
04/25/08 02:20 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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CAP is a good company but the K frame isn't much stronger than stock. The light weight tubular LCA wont buy you much on a auto cross car. Firm Fell makes heavy duty K frames and sway bar kits that will make the car handle like a slot car. CAP is a good product its just not what you need for your application. 
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: BcudaChris]
#57490
04/28/08 08:32 PM
04/28/08 08:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,650
San Jose,CA
migsBIG
YouTube is my go-to news source
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YouTube is my go-to news source
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,650
San Jose,CA
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I saw them with some friends at the MATS show and got to hold them in my hands. Though the lower control arms are lighter, they do have better design and a stronger construction compared to stock controlarms and would be a good use for a street car. The uppers seemed average and would be in similar in camparison to other control arms. The k-member though light and very strong, just didn't have some more reinforcments in perfered ereas. I am no tech specialist, but I could see that the k-member was something I would not use on a daily driven car. The guy there was very nice and informative, but the strenght and welding of the k-member was what I was checking out. Quality work, just not recomended for a 2500+lb car for the street.
Please feel free to correct me, as these observations were done with personal viewings on the parts.
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: migsBIG]
#57491
04/28/08 08:43 PM
04/28/08 08:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
slantzilla
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
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Tubular K's and severe street duty do not go together. If I had my heart set on a aftermarket K for a street car I would go to an AlterK-tion from Bill Reilly.
"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: sycboi]
#57493
04/29/08 12:42 AM
04/29/08 12:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 363
Richmond, TX
Sinister68
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 363
Richmond, TX
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I have the LCA's installed on my car. Took them 3 months to finally get the driver's side right. I guess I was the first LCA purchaser. They promised to send me a small refund due to all the problems I had - Never got the refund. 
-James
2013 Challenger SRT
1968 Charger R/T
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: migsBIG]
#57494
05/02/08 03:51 PM
05/02/08 03:51 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 403
Colorado front range
BcudaChris
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 403
Colorado front range
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Quote:
The k-member though light and very strong, just didn't have some more reinforcments in perfered ereas. I am no tech specialist, but I could see that the k-member was something I would not use on a daily driven car.
Quote:
Tubular K's and severe street duty do not go together.
Those are my impressions and understandings of conventional wisdom as well. I'm still hoping to hear from someone who might have a few miles on one.
Quote:
If I had my heart set on a aftermarket K for a street car I would go to an AlterK-tion from Bill Reilly.
As would I. I want to stay with the stock type suspension though.
I've heard the same thing regarding severe street duty and the Alter-K as Slantzilla mentioned about tubular K's. We know Alter K's do the job, and I'm wondering if the tubular K's don't as well.
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: 9secondart]
#57499
05/16/08 01:58 PM
05/16/08 01:58 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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Quote:
I am not sure where the impression that a Tubular K frames are for moderate or light use came from, but that simply is wrong. Seamless tubing and JIG machined surfaces and JIG welded opposed to a stamping with spot welds? The fact of the matter is they are stronger whether it be CAP system or Alter K.
Ray
That is a pretty broad statement and I believe incorrect. Maybe a tube vs a stamping in strictly tension might be stronger, but in any bending situations any member with the deeper cross section is almost always more rigid. Since it is not completey understood what the real life loads are that are resisted by these k members, and some with Tb's and others with CO's, which makes for completely different loading, I think it is wrong to make such a blanket statement with nothing to back it up for us to consider, as to why your statement has much merit. I think the loading is actually pretty complex and one has many variables to consider, and with many different right answers, depending on the application, etc. 
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: jcc]
#57500
05/16/08 02:52 PM
05/16/08 02:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 403
Colorado front range
BcudaChris
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 403
Colorado front range
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Well, in my application, the stock K-frame will be picking up weight, Firm Feel style.
I am currently a non-practicing A&P, when I was practicing I observed 1st hand the strength of tube frame air-frames subject to tension, torsion, compression and bending stresses. Aerobatics and pilot training impart some major loads. And we're talking 1" dia chro-mo round tubing with .040" wall thickness.
I've also, from very close proximity, observed the strength of tube-frame Cup cars.
That experience leads me to believe that tube construction *should* be able to get the job done, and be lighter than a stamping. I would think if the right material is used, it should be able to deal with the continous vibration without cracking.
What I don't know is if anything on the market is proven the way an Alter-K is...
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: rjsjea]
#57502
05/16/08 04:28 PM
05/16/08 04:28 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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Quote:
What more is needed??? crash tests?? torsional load data???
Well that would be a start, you ask for cam specs, right?
And trying to to compare a well designed space frame tube structure to a basically plane truss to stamped fcatory designed structure that hase billions of proven miles is in IMO a stretch and not an accurate comparsion. The aftermarket K frames are not space frames. They do not have significant depth in their cross sections. In at least one direction they are not near as strong as a well designed stamping. Whether that is imporatnt or significant, no one here seems to know. The love affair with tubing is mainly becuase it is common, plentiful, cost effective, strong for what it is and a lot less expensive then a well designed stamping. I hate to point out the king has no clothes. Ignorance is bliss. And to make sure I am clear, I don't have a problem with the AlterK (I own one), I have a problem with unsupported statements.
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: jcc]
#57503
05/16/08 04:42 PM
05/16/08 04:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
slantzilla
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
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Take a good look at an AJE, DARE, or Magnumforce K frame. They are not built anything at all like an airplane or Cup car.
I have an AJE. It is a piece of junk. A DARE is worse. Magnumforce told me his was not for street use. LRT will tell you the same thing.
An AlterK-tion is technically not a tube K. It is much more structurally sound than a real tube K.
I have no dispute with the strength of tubing used properly. I was underneath a 6 second Top Sportsman '57 Chevy today and was amazed at how small of tubing the lower A-arms were. However, it was constructed properly and will see absolutely no street miles ever.
On the other hand, would you trust you life to a bunch of tubing welded together by Bozo the Clown?
"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
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Re: CAP Tubular K and LCA's
[Re: jcc]
#57505
05/17/08 01:56 PM
05/17/08 01:56 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 189
Portland,OR
rjsjea
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 189
Portland,OR
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Quote:
Quote:
What more is needed??? crash tests?? torsional load data???
Well that would be a start, you ask for cam specs, right?
And trying to to compare a well designed space frame tube structure to a basically plane truss to stamped fcatory designed structure that hase billions of proven miles is in IMO a stretch and not an accurate comparsion. The aftermarket K frames are not space frames. They do not have significant depth in their cross sections. In at least one direction they are not near as strong as a well designed stamping. Whether that is imporatnt or significant, no one here seems to know. The love affair with tubing is mainly becuase it is common, plentiful, cost effective, strong for what it is and a lot less expensive then a well designed stamping. I hate to point out the king has no clothes. Ignorance is bliss. And to make sure I am clear, I don't have a problem with the AlterK (I own one), I have a problem with unsupported statements.
Then the cost would be 4x what it is now......impractical. Does Wilwood, Baer, Heidts, TCI, Detroit Speed do test like that?? ....NO, it's way too cost prohibitive.
I have an AlterK and have no doubts about it's street integrity. Cant speak for CAP or Mgnfce
Last edited by rjsjea; 05/17/08 01:59 PM.
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