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Detonation #520142
11/08/09 11:13 PM
11/08/09 11:13 PM
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JoesMopar Offline OP
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Does detonation affect how fast your car accelerates that much?

I especially notice it when I'm on the interstate and I start gradually getting into it. I know I need to run some higher octane (110) gas in.

It doesn't do it that bad until I get about halfway into it then I back off because I don't want to damage the motor. Just wondering if the slight pinging would affect how fast it is that much.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520143
11/08/09 11:23 PM
11/08/09 11:23 PM
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You've got pre-ignition, not detonation. If you were experiencing detonation on you street car to that degree your motor would be destroyed. But to answer your question, yes.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520144
11/08/09 11:29 PM
11/08/09 11:29 PM
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Quote:

Does detonation affect how fast your car accelerates that much?


yes and is very damaging to piston lands/rings. Do whatever you need to do to stop it ASAP & adj the timing or as you said more octane


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Re: Detonation [Re: sg66mopar] #520145
11/08/09 11:31 PM
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Thanks, how do you know the difference in the "pinging" when you start getting into it whether it's lack of octane or lack of timing?

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520146
11/08/09 11:38 PM
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it's too much (or too fast) timing or not enough octane to support your current timing curve whether it's correct or too much. Ideally you want to optimize your timing and then run enough octane to support it.


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Re: Detonation [Re: RapidRobert] #520147
11/08/09 11:51 PM
11/08/09 11:51 PM
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Thanks, I've got my timing adjusted where it needs to be and I know I need to be running higher than 93 in my car, '68 Charger w/440, I just didn't know if the slight pinging when getting into it would affect how hard it pulled or not until I asked you guys. I do plan on fixing it by mixing some higher octane Sunoco gas into it but was just curious the results I'd expect by fixing the pinging problem. The car is put away in my garage now for the winter, so I wouldn't know until the spring, but I was to impatient to wait to know so I asked you guys because you all know your stuff.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520148
11/09/09 11:19 AM
11/09/09 11:19 AM
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Well what cam and heads and carb you got?? sometimes a little work on the vacuum advance will cure that. the vacuum advance should be unhooked and plugged till all the ping issues are dealt with.
You should be able to tune it to no ping with the curve the amount of total and maybe a little more jet???

Re: Detonation [Re: Dodgem] #520149
11/09/09 01:22 PM
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I'm running a Comp 292/299 .509/.509 cam, Edelbrock 84cc closed chamber heads, Holley 870 street avenger carb, MP ignition (distributer w/chrome box). The block has alsobeen zero decked and I'm running KB flat tops. Can't remember the head gasket thickness, maybe .020"?

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520150
11/09/09 01:24 PM
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what carb. you should be able to make that work good with 93. Just some tweeking!

Re: Detonation [Re: Dodgem] #520151
11/09/09 01:33 PM
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It's a Holley 870 Street Avenger.

I put in on a vacuum gauge and tuned it like they recommend, set the floats etc.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520152
11/09/09 01:43 PM
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What is your total timing at with vacuum advance unhooked and plugged? Did you try it with vacuum advance unhooked and I assume it is on the right port?

Re: Detonation [Re: Dodgem] #520153
11/09/09 01:53 PM
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If I remember right I set it at 32 deg total and I know I'm using the right port.

Inititially I had it too far advanced and then re-set it to 32 deg because it was too hard to start.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520154
11/09/09 02:29 PM
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It sounds like your ping is just on the transition from a high-vaccuum situation to acceleration. I'd stick a small allen wrench into the vaccuum advance and give it 1 turn counter clockwise and retest. This should make the vaccume advance go away a little faster.


Quote:

If I remember right I set it at 32 deg total and I know I'm using the right port.

Inititially I had it too far advanced and then re-set it to 32 deg because it was too hard to start.



Re: Detonation [Re: @#$%&*!] #520155
11/09/09 02:52 PM
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Yea most likely tuning the vacuum advance is all you need. 3/32 allen wrench in through the port on the vacuum pot 3 turns CC to start. Then you can probably get the total up to 36 later 36 to 38 if achived give best power. If it is hard to start you may need more travel of the mechanical advance. and or a mini starter!

Re: Detonation [Re: Dodgem] #520156
11/09/09 03:16 PM
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Thanks for all the help and suggestions

I'll try what you guys said, now it makes sense.

Re: Detonation [Re: JoesMopar] #520157
11/09/09 03:42 PM
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put some good octane in there & (1) set your initial where your cam/eng likes it (2) shorten the slots for 36-38 total (vac adv (if used)disconnected) (3) play w the spring combo so you get a fast a curve as possible but staying just under the pinging point as you run it thru the gears @ WOT on your hottest/driest day (4) hookup the vac adv & add as much of it as it will take without pinging (or missing from too much overall timing) @ PART throttle on your hottest driest day. Get each stage near perfect then the next one(& in order) so that nothing is being left on the table.


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Re: Detonation [Re: RapidRobert] #520158
11/09/09 03:56 PM
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Quote:

put some good octane in there & (1) set your initial where your cam/eng likes it (2) shorten the slots for 36-38 total (vac adv (if used)disconnected) (3) play w the spring combo so you get a fast a curve as possible but staying just under the pinging point as you run it thru the gears @ WOT on your hottest/driest day (4) hookup the vac adv & add as much of it as it will take without pinging (or missing from too much overall timing) @ PART throttle on your hottest driest day. Get each stage near perfect then the next one(& in order) so that nothing is being left on the table.


The key here is to leave the vacuum advance out of the equation ( disconnected ) until you get the pinging problem sorted out. Then play with the vacuum rate - also ported or manifold source to see what works best.


Fastest 300
Re: Detonation [Re: RapidRobert] #520159
11/09/09 06:05 PM
11/09/09 06:05 PM
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Quote:

put some good octane in there & (1) set your initial where your cam/eng likes it (2) shorten the slots for 36-38 total (vac adv (if used)disconnected) (3) play w the spring combo so you get a fast a curve as possible but staying just under the pinging point as you run it thru the gears @ WOT on your hottest/driest day (4) hookup the vac adv & add as much of it as it will take without pinging (or missing from too much overall timing) @ PART throttle on your hottest driest day. Get each stage near perfect then the next one(& in order) so that nothing is being left on the table.




But he stated starting problems when he had 36 total? This is usually to short of slots where the
real initial not idle advance is too far ahead for his combo. I like a longer slot to lessen starter kickback and some like shorter slots Oh well tomato tomato?


Re: Detonation [Re: Dodgem] #520160
11/09/09 08:53 PM
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Quote:

But he stated starting problems when he had 36 total?


Correct, I missed that. What worked for me in that situation was to wire in an ign cutoff (like a simple anti theft feature) & get the eng "cranking" then switch on the ign.


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Re: Detonation [Re: RapidRobert] #520161
11/09/09 09:01 PM
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Yeah what it would do is just crank longer because of the advance. It was really bad once the motor got warmed up and the only way I knew to fix it was back the timing off.

I'll try your suggestions and see if it fixes it. I appreciate all the help as usual.

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